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BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Mystery illness, rabbit in Pain

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    • lorree
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      Hi guys, I’m back after a very long absence from here because my little gorgeous girl Boonie has something wrong with her and I’m looking for other opinions on what could be going on.

      So Boonie is around 6-7 years old and has been mostly healthy her whole life apart from a eye leak problem that comes and goes and the vets don’t know why that is but is never really seems to bother her. I think it might be an allergy but don’t know what to.
      Anyway over the last few years she’s gotten thinner but has remained at the same weight for quite a long time, I think she’s just too picky with food. Lately I started sprinkling herbs on the hay and she now seems to be eating more, so that’s a win.

      So now the big problem, the last few weeks I started to find her butt was dirty. Her poop and pee is healthy but she was getting messy (mainly wet and stained)
      So I began cleaning her regularly and then last Friday I woke up, looked at her and my heart broke, she looks as though she couldn’t use her hind legs and was desperately trying to clean her butt but kept wobbling around instead. Went to the vet immediately where she started hopping around and making me look stupid. Anyway I wasn’t having a bar of that so I explained everything to the vet and she continued to examine Boonie and it wasn’t long b4 Boonie couldn’t keep the act going and the vet said that Boonie can use her legs but must be in so much pain that she just doesn’t want to ?
      So she went in for x Ray’s and blood tests but nothing was found, no injuries, kidney and liver healthy, doesn’t look like arthritis, no bone cancer, nothing showing up in the blood work except that her body seems to be fighting an infection.

      So I have a rabbit in what must be a lot of pain, fighting an unknown infection.
      She is now on tramodol and meloxicam for pain and inflammation management morning and night and I am also having to clean her butt area a lot cos she just can’t. Which again is mainly just wet and smelly, no poop stuck on her or anything.
      She seems a little better with the pain relief but is still hunching her butt in and not able to groom properly.

      So the vets, even though they are great rabbit savvy vets, they don’t know what’s going on.
      Her teeth are great, ears great, poo great, pee great, eating great, fur feels great.

      The vet said she can test for E cuniculi if I want to but still that usually causes paralysis and Boonie is not paralysed at all just very sore
      ?
      I don’t know what’s happening to my beautiful girl
      Any ideas?


    • LBJ10
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      Are you sure it’s soreness and not motor problems? What you’re describing sounds like she is experiencing on and off instability in her hind end. To me, that would suggest a neurological problem (e.g. EC). I’m not a vet though. I’m just going off of the experiences of others here on BB. You can test for EC. Unfortunately, it doesn’t always come back positive when a bunny has EC. There are a lot of false negatives.

      There are some other things it could be as well. EC is just where my mind automatically goes to in these types of scenarios (EC-like symptoms, but not the classic textbook symptoms). If she doesn’t improve with the pain meds, it might be worth treating her for EC. There have been many cases on BB similar to yours where the vet isn’t sure, treats for EC anyway, and the bunny improves.


    • Sirius&Luna
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      I agree, I think it’s worth treating for EC. Member Asriel&Bombur’s bunny was recently diagnosed with EC, and his only symptom was excessively peeing on himself.

      I also had a previous bunny with EC, who was diagnosed when he excessively peed on himself, and then later developed hind leg weakness. Again, sometimes he could hop, and other times he would be dragging his legs behind himself, and was unable to balance to clean himself.


    • lorree
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      Ok
      I will get her looked at for EC and treated for that
      I should also say that since going to the vet and starting the pain killers she has been better and has not gotten any worse. She definitely can run and gets around a lot. She’s been eating more too
      And is definitely stronger as she now fights a bit when getting medication as she’s always hated that. B4 the pain killers she had little to no fighting strength

      It seems to be the act of stretching out her back legs that she doesn’t like to do, though I know she can
      And also getting her head down there to clean up

      She’s been happier since starting medication too


    • lorree
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      I just noticed that some of her toes are a bit swollen at the base of the nails on her front feet ?
      Another painful thing for her to deal with. I’m guessing it’s bcos of her weird hunched stance.
      She currently doesn’t lie down anymore, just stands in a hunch all the time
      ?


    • Deleted User
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      Hello! I’m the member S&L was talking about with the peeing bunny I think it’s great the pain killers are working to a point, but if she’s hunched they aren’t really working that effectively. Bombur does have EC and has incontinence and mild hind leg weakness. He can still hop around, but anything more than 1-2 inches is a bit of an effort for him. It’s a good idea to get her tested, but keep in mind that EC can yield a false negative test result, and the test is a little pricey. I think my vet charged $300 for the test, and I held out on a two week course of antibiotics for a UTI before I went ahead with it. If the result comes back as a negative, I still think asking for the treatment is better safe than sorry. The treatment is way cheaper than the test too. It’s usually a 28 day course of Panacur or Oxibendazole or a similar drug. Good luck


    • lorree
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      Thanks
      I am thinking is worth trying the ec treatment either way
      Unfortunately having just spent a $1000 on her I have to wait till next week to get more done, I hope she’s not in too much pain until then
      This morning she came running up to me, and stood on her back legs to reach up to me, so that’s a positive sign. Though she went back to her hunched stance shortly after.
      Yesterday I picked her some fresh dandelion and I don’t know if that helped a little with her health but I think I’ll keep doing that in case that’s what is giving her the strength to run and stand up like that

      Anyway fingers crossed
      I hate seeing her in pain


    • lorree
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      Update:
      The specialist called me
      She had a look at the X-rays and says she thinks Boonie has a problem with her spinal discs
      And that I should get further imaging done at like $2-4000 and then surgery for about $10000
      ?
      That’s a lot of money
      And I can’t afford that

      She said I can put her on higher strength pain killers and try to just make her life comfy
      If I can’t afford the surgery

      Don’t really know what to do
      ?

      I was thinking maybe get a go fund me page and source the money. I don’t know how they really work tho

      Ahh poor Boonie


    • Sirius&Luna
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      $10,000? plus $4,000? That sounds like an absolutely crazy amount. I’ve never heard of surgery for a bunny costing that much. My insurance wouldn’t even cover that, it’s a maximum of £2000 a year. I think it’s worth seeking a second opinion.


    • kurottabun
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      I agree with S&L to get a second opinion. Vet care can be expensive but $14,000 does sound quite crazy.


    • lorree
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      Yeah I’m not sure what to do
      Unfortunately there are not many rabbit savvy vets here so even though it’s expensive I trust them to help her

      I have an appointment Thursday and I’m thinking for now to get her on the better pain killers
      And I still can’t rule out ec in my mind so I want to talk to them about that and see if I can treat her for that whilst on pain killers, I don’t know if they mix well ?

      And then I will probably have $1000 soon to get her a Mri and hopefully that’s enough for them to see if she needs the surgery. To get a cat scan is the $2000-$4000 scan, but I’m hoping the mri would be enough

      And I’m thinking of trying out crowdfunding for the surgery if it comes to that. And hopefully I’d get an estimate on that that’s lower then 10000 cos I think 10000 was like the worse case senario price. There is only 1 other rabbit vet here and she usually is more expensive so ?

      But good news is Boonie is moving around more and really starting to enjoy butt cleans and cuddles. She’s looking much happier every day, I don’t know how but she is.
      And her biggest problem seems to be stretching out her hind legs and I caught her doing just that this morning which was a happy site for me


    • lorree
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      I decided to start a crowdfunding page to try to source the money for boonies surgery
      I’m hoping it works

      It seems like a good idea,
      I’m thinking that the pain killers are working and her hunched posture might just be how she stands due to the back problems.
      She’s been running around a lot and has put on weight ?

      (Edited by Bam).


    • Bam
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      I have removed the link. The Binky Bunny forum rules don’t allow fundraising. This is a screen shot of the relevant rules:

      Full list of forum rules can be found here:

      https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/10084/Default.aspx

      You could perhaps start an Instagram account for Boonie. Instagram permits fundraising (and so does Facebook).


    • Pinkbun
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      my netherland dwarf dwarf, also called bonnie has been experiencing all these systems. im alfraid that i might loose her. she’s only 3yrs old. she been to the vet multiple times and been on medicam, baytoral and panacure. please let us know any more info if you get it. id be very grateful. i wish yr bun a recovery.


    • Bam
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      Lorree, what Boonie is suffering from reminds me of my dog’s condition. She has a lower back problem that started suddenly. One morning she couldn’t stand up, her hind legs didn’t work. This episode lasted an hour, and then she snapped back.

      There’s no real quick version but still: Our vet did a full investigation, CBC, normal x-rays, ultrasound of abdomen etc. Nothing. But she kept getting these weird attacks of very fast breathing and licking her paws, so we decided to have a CT done. Our dog insurance covered that. Turns out she had a problem with L7-S1 joint and the disc in between and some extra bone growth around where the nerves exit the spine. Typically age-and breed-related that fully explained her symptoms.

      Anyway, surgery was not deemed a good option. We have been managing it with anti-inflammatory meds and cold laser treatment. We have adjusted her physical activities (she still needs exercise but no wild playing with other dogs, she has a ramp to the car etc.) She’s had three episodes in total of the hind end not working, the first one + two that both occurred after she had been taken off the anti-inflammatories as a test. She has improved greatly. No more fast breathing episodes. No reluctance to go for walks etc. She seems happy, enthusiastic and “herself”.

      Anti-inflammatory meds has an immediate painkilling effect, but also a slower acting anti-inflammatory effect that often needs several weeks to take effect. The inflamed tissues need time to “calm down”. Once you get the inflammation under control you can often lower the dose of anti-inflammatories.

      Anyway, if you could manage Boonie’s pain with anti-inflammatory meds and perhaps do some light at-home-“physiotherapy” (very light massages, walking supported by a towel under her tum etc), she could heal. Ruptured discs do heal in most cases (unless you have a complicating condition like diabetes, obesity etc), even if it takes time.

      Boonie’s test did show there was an infection though, and that can’t be explained by a disc problem. So that would need to be addressed separately.


    • lorree
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      Thanks Bam
      That’s very interesting what happened to your dog
      Boonie has been on meloxicam for just over a week so perhaps it needs longer to deal with the level of inflammation
      I’m quite happy with her progress on the pain meds and will keep at it whilst saving for the ct scan etc

      I’ve started holding her on my lap for about an hour, at least once a day, in order to give her some rest. I originally decided to do this based on worrying about her feet but I find that she spends all her time trying to hold herself up and that means she can’t quite relax. It doesn’t seem pain related, just that she feels the need to keep herself standing up. When I hold her she doesn’t have to worry about that and quickly falls asleep. So I think that helps her to get a good rest in each day,
      Maybe I’ll try a little massage whilst she’s sleeping on me


    • LBJ10
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      Aww, poor thing. If the meloxicam doesn’t bring relief after it has built up in her system, you could consider an opioid like Tramadol. I’m trying to remember who here on BB has used it. They might be able to offer some input.


    • Bam
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      It sounds wonderful that you let her spend an hour in your lap each day. It seems like she needs it and appreciates it. Oftentimes muscles respond to instability in the spine and stiffen up. It’s the body’s own natural way of trying to stabilize the spine, but it can lead to a sore-muscle problem on top of the joint problem. The muscular response can be so strong it actually keeps vertebrae locked in the wrong position. Hopefully the anti inflammatories will help with that too.

      I don’t know if you’re familiar with the website Disabled Rabbits. It’s a good website with tips and info for owners permanently or temporarily disabled rabbits. How to make their habitat suit their needs etc. http://www.disabledrabbits.com/


    • lorree
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      Hey guys
      Just thought I’d write an update about Boonie

      So the vet said the surgery may not even help her which is sad but kind of a relief too, I mean any surgery on a bunny is scary but more so as they get older, Boonie being 7 years old now

      So this leaves me with a disabled rabbit. I think the biggest problem is that she has lost hind leg muscle which is causing her to not move as much and fall over and drag herself instead.
      We are starting physio tomorrow and I’m really hoping that will help. If she can get stronger leg muscles and start moving around better that would be amazing

      The back problem, I guess it will always be there but the vet said it is only a mild problem and is being managed with pain meds. Having no paralysis and having full bladder control etc is great. If her legs can improve then she would be almost normal again

      Her cecals have gone weird, big, round and smelly, I think maybe from medication.
      But she still eats them up so that’s good
      Also she is eating and pooping well in general

      I starting putting baby socks on her because it keeps her feet dry and protects them when she drags them around. She doesn’t seem to mind them either.

      I’m keeping her little butt as clean as possible, with twice daily washes. And cream for urine scald. She’s lost a lot of hair in that area but hopefully it grows back although currently it makes it easier to clean her.

      We been having lots of cuddles and she’s started licking me like crazy which she never used to do. So I think she’s loving all the extra love and care I’m giving her

      I’m so excited to get her into physio tomorrow
      Fingers crossed we can make her little legs better again
      ❤️


    • LBJ10
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      I’m glad to hear she is doing better. Keep us updated on her progress!


    • sarahthegemini
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      Aw, poor bunbun. It sounds like you’re doing everything you can and it’s so sweet that she’s becoming more affectionate with you. You must be a great comfort to her <3


    • lorree
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      Boonie had her first physio session today and it went really well. I’m so happy. She is really optimistic about Boonie’s chances of improvement. And Boonie did so well today. She was even slightly better at the end of the session.

      So glad I took her to physio. I think it’s going to be the best thing ever
      Boonie actually seemed to enjoy it all too, although she was so tired afterwards, gorgeous little girl

      Also Boonie gave the physio a decent pile of poop too ?

      I’m just so happy right now, I feel like we’ve had a break thru, and that there is hope for some normality in Boonie’s future. Even the possibility of jumping again at some point. ?
      But that’s way off right now. But just seeing her move around and not fall over would be amazing right now and it could happen sooner then I thought.
      ?


    • Gordo and Janice
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      Wow, that is really great she is doing so well. I’ve never heard of physio for rabbits. That is so cool. Really hoping it brings about the desired results as well. Glad you two are spending some really great quality time together.


    • LittlePuffyTail
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      Glad to hear it.


    • jerseygirl
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      Hi Lorree
      I’m only just catching up on Boonie’s situation. She is a lucky bun to have you! It is great the physio is helping some.
      Has the therapist mentioned cold laser treatment at all? I have read some feedback from owners that this therapy is beneficial.
      Here is a little more about it, if you like a read: http://www.houserabbitga.com/cold-laser-therapy-rabbits

      {{{Boonie}}}


    • lorree
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      She did use some sort of laser thing on Boonie, maybe that’s what it is
      I’ll ask about it anyway ?

      I wish Boonie would stop losing fur, she’s so naked around her butt. I wash her twice a day but it still keeps happening. Her skins not red but the fur still takes in most of her pee everytime it’s just so absorbent. Poor little girl


    • lorree
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      So I freaked out big time looking at Boonie’s tail. It looks weird and I thought it was gangrene

      Today I have to go on holiday. I say have too bcos I feel bad about it cos of leaving her. And my mum pAid for holiday so I can’t be nasty to mum either

      Anyway thankfully there is a vet now looking after her for the week and he is great. And obviously as I was freaking out he looked at her b4 I left to see what’s up. And he says it’s not gangrene it’s like she’s perhaps snapped her tail ?
      Poor baby. And the bone is fine but the skin tissue is dying. But he says its treatable but may require surgery that’s the only scary part just bcos any surgery is scary

      So I’m relieved some but still a little worried but he is a wonderful vet and I’m so happy he’s personally looking after her and that it’s not gangrene. I cried so much last night and spent way too long looking at terrible gangrene photos on the net

      Gosh I love my Boonie. ❤️

      This vet is going to regularly message me on Facebook whilst I’m away so I can hopefully relax a bit.


    • LittlePuffyTail
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      I hope you enjoy your holiday.

      ((((Boonie)))) It’s great that you have a vet looking after her while you are away.


    • lorree
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      ???
      Boonie passed away

      It’s all back to a mystery again
      Something was killing her from the inside

      The suspected back injury was not a back injury more something was wearing down her bones and muscles
      She didn’t lose hind leg muscle from lack of movement, it was just being destroyed somehow in her body

      It kept getting worse so fast, her front legs started losing muscle and her face

      On Thursday morning vet rang me (I was overseas) he said she’s barely breathing
      He put her on oxygen

      I cried all day, I was hysterical

      That night he told me he didn’t think she’d make it threw the night, maybe a lung collapse, maybe cancer, don’t know. I had to say goodbye
      We had about a half hour video call, he let me talk to Boonie till the end
      Such a great person
      If ur in Perth, Western Australia, Dr Chris Martin from little paws rescue. Amazing guy, I would be so much worse if it wasn’t for him

      I cried so much that night but since then I think I’ve been avoiding dealing with it

      She looked happy and at peace afterwards tho.
      He preserved her and I came to pick her up and he had wrapped her up in her blankie so cutely

      I buried her in her favourite digging spot in the back yard with a banana

      I’ve been an absolute mess. I feel like nothing is real. I’ve been sleeping a lot, eating a lot but I feel like my body is burning food too fast. I feel like my heart is shaking constantly. My brain is foggy. Everything is weird
      I feel like I’ve had way too many red bulls but also I’m tired

      I loved her so much

      She’s got to jump around the banana plantation and chew on everything now. Go destroy stuff Boonie ❤️

      I’m lost


    • kurottabun
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      So sorry to hear that You’ve done all you can and it was nice that you got to say goodbye to her through the video call. Take care of yourself too xx

      Binky free (((Boonie)))


    • LBJ10
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      Oh no, I’m so sorry to hear of Boonie’s passing. I agree, you did all that you could. Don’t blame yourself. You were with her in the end and that’s what matters.


    • meridiian
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      I’m sorry you lost Boonie after all that. You certainly gave her all you could and more. And she had you with her at the end.

      Be kind to yourself, she is looking down at you and wants you to be happy. xx

      RIP Boonie. Binkie free.


    • Gordo and Janice
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      Oh Boonie, Boonie. So sad. So very sad. I was following your story closely. Similar, in a way, to our little girl. Her need to always stand. The regular bottom washing. The extra kisses. Even the hair loss was similar. And we watched her waste away. So frustrating. They are so innocent and helpless.

      You were wonderful with her. So patient and loving. She was lucky to have someone like you. You two were a fateful match. You did everything you could. Hold no guilt. And that doctor of hers seems absolutely wonderful. So considerate of you, your feelings, and your little baby.

      You will be lost at first. Everything in chaos, life and emotions both. Different people have different reactions. You sound so much like me. I shake like too much red bull. I clench my teeth. Brain fog. I feel sleepy all the time but I can’t really sleep good. And the weight loss. Just like you said, no matter how much I eat and drink, I lose weight precipitously like my body has gone into dangerous overburn. Basically you summed it up in that one three word sentence, “Everything is weird”.  Again, like nothing is real and you’re caught in a bad dream.

      Hang in there. It will get better. We all have to walk through the painful fire of loss. There is no way around it. It will be hard. But you will make it through. It’s an unfortunate fact of life, this grief that we have to go through when we lose someone so close, so special. It may seem like you aren’t going to be able to get better but it always does in time. And relief seems to never come fast enough, but come it will.

      Be grateful for your life with her. I am sure she is grateful for you. Like meridiian says, she wants you to be happy. She loves you. Be kind to yourself. You are in my thoughts, the both of you.

      Binky free {{{Boonie}}}


    • Ellie from The Netherlands
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      Oh no, I’m so sorry to hear this after all the good care you’ve taken of her She must have felt your love and devotion. Binky free without pain now, Boonie!


    • Bam
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      I’m so very sorry you lost her. You did so much for her. I hope she is bunstructing in bunny heaven now ?


    • lorree
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      Thanks guys.

      I haven’t been such a mess in a long time

      @gordo and Janice, it all sounds so similar to what u experienced, I don’t know why she kept wasting away, no matter how much she ate. Whatever it was, it broke down her muscle, it wore into her bone, destroyed any fat stores and must have then gotten to her organs. But she had been eating so well, pooping well, everything. It was just so strange.
      I’m glad I didn’t have the money for that surgery they wanted to do, it wouldn’t of worked, and she probably wouldn’t of survived it and I’d be in serious debt.

      I don’t understand what happened to her
      ?
      She was always so healthy, then in a matter of maybe 2 months all this happened


    • Bam
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      The very rapid wasting away does suggest cancer, because cancer cells have a very high metabolism rate and they find ways to get “first dibs” on all nutrients. When that isn’t enough, they start consuming the body itself.

      There are wasting diseases in many (most? all?) mammals, but I don’t know anything specific about rabbits. Mammal neuromuscular systems have big similarities between species. Neuromuscular wasting disorders in humans can progress fast, for example ALS (Lou Gehrig’s disease), but I don’t know if there is a rabbit equivalent to ALS. It’s an incurable disease in humans, so there would be no cure for rabbits.

      You did all you could for her, I’m so sorry you couldn’t save her. Many things are outside of human control.


    • lorree
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      Thanks bam

      I guess there is a high chance it was cancer.
      No one likes that word.

      7 years young my little angel ?


    • Ellie from The Netherlands
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      Big hug to you! I hope it helps you with your grief to talk to others. It’s a very confusing time with emotions all over the place. We understand and we feel for you.


    • LittlePuffyTail
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      I’m so very sorry. Saying goodbye is so hard. And it’s harder sometimes when we don’t know the reason. I’ve been through this too. (((Hugs))))

      (((((Binky Free Boonie)))))


    • lorree
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      It does help to talk about it

      I have come to realise I am in a serious state of grief

      I can’t even see properly
      I feel like I’ve been drugged, my range of vision is smaller and tunnel like and things keep flowing across my vision

      When I’m out on my own it’s worse, and I’m sure I’ve freaked a few people out by talking loudly or just running for no reason. I’m scaring myself at times

      Some people I know get it and they understand that it’s just the same as losing a human loved one but others are like “get over it” which is annoying and hurtful and at the moment I feel like I could really get angry at people and I’m not normally an angry person

      Singing is helping me so I’m trying to sing a lot lately. Although Boonie loved it when I sung to her and sometimes that makes me cry thinking about it

      Thanks guys
      I’m battling on
      I can’t believe how much I loved her


    • LittlePuffyTail
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      (((((((((Hugs))))))) I know it’s hard. I’m still mourning two of my buns right now. They passed away within months of each other. We all understand here at BB.

      Try to do something to honour her memory. I always put pictures and favorite memories, quotes, things you used to do together, etc in a special memory journal. Use coloured pencils or stamps and make it pretty. I find this helpful. To put my grief into something tangible. And/or, if you’re able, donate money to a rabbit shelter in her memory.

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Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Mystery illness, rabbit in Pain