Little-Bit’s mystery illness

[Binkles]

This is beyond frustrating. For about two months now, Little-Bit has been having one batch of dark, mushy, deformed poops of varying sizes a day. The vet does not think they are cecals. Sometimes there’s only one or two, sometimes it’s seven or eight of varying sizes. It always occurs at the same time every day, between 9:30am and 1pm, and seems to occur concurrent with when she gets her cecals. Literally concurrent: as in I’ve seen her leave the weird mushy poops in her litterbox and immediately hop off to get her cecals. Aside from the once-a-day weird poops, she is completely normal and happy. She eats her hay like a horse, drinks plenty of water, and poops tons of normal healthy golden bunny poops.

I brought her to the vet two weeks ago and had them so a blood test and a poop test. The vet was a bit baffled by her strangely specific symptoms, but said she had Clostridium (a trigger weird for me, since Peter just died of Clostridium in January), and put her on Metronidazole for fourteen days.

Unfortunately her blood test results came back with some high levels that often correlate to kidney disease. However, the vet is hopeful that these high levels might have been caused by inflammation or dehydration due to the Clostridium. So after she is done with her antibiotics, I’ll be bringing her back in for a second blood test to see if these levels are still high.

Well here we are at the end of her antibiotic regimin today and she still has the once-a-day weird poops at the same time she gets her cecals. Obviously there is something more going on here other than just Clostridium. Does this ring a bell with anyone?

I’m reaching my wit’s (and financial) end. I haven’t even had the opportunity to mourn Peter’s death before this all started. Why is this all happening?

[Binkles]

Attached is a photograph of her first blood test results with the high levels noted. What do you all think? Could this be kidney disease?

I did a bit of reading up on kidney disease, and it seems like she is not exhibiting any of the classic symptoms of kidney disease. She’s not urinating everywhere or having trouble urinating. She drinks between 180ml and 280ml of water a day -how normal is this for a very small dwarf bunny?

[MimzMum]

Hi Sarah
I am sorry to hear Little Bit is now ill. I can’t comment on the test results, (it is a bit hard to read, but I wind up having to Google my own to figure them out anyway) but I know metronidazole can be hard on the system. If these were her values despite the anti-fungal though, it is a puzzle.

What’s her diet like? And she was bonded with Peter, yes? I too would be concerned that she may have shared his infection, but you’d think one round of medication would’ve cleared it up. The bilirubin (?) being high might be pointing at liver involvement. Do you happen to have a photograph of the offending poos?

I can understand the frustration with the cost of vet care. Fiver’s recent adventure with the surgeon cost me over $600. My Care Credit is already maxxed so it’s out of my daily funds. Do you have any pet insurance options where you are that would cover a possible pre-existing condition?

I will keep you and LB in my thoughts, but it seems like a second opinion might be helpful although I can understand why it would be difficult to get one.

[MimzMum]

Thought I’d add this link.

https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/80571/Default.aspx

This is talking about 5-10 ml per day being normal for a 2-6 lb bunny to drink, so perhaps she is taking in a bit much.

When her cecals arrive, are they normal?

 

ETA: I Googled this and it seems to argue that even 150 mls is okay, so, I’m confused too.

http://www.smallanimalchannel.com/rabbits/rabbit-diet/rabbits-need-water.aspx

[redbunbun]

Her water intake sounds within reasonable bounds to me, especially if she’s eating a lot of hay (as she should be!).

I’m wondering if what she’s experiencing could be due to a motility disorder of the gut, particularly of the cecum. A mushy poop whenever she empties out her cecum would fit with cecum motility issues, which would cause icky unformed poop to gather there and be discharged along with the cecals. This is kind of counterintuitive if her cecals are normal, though… those should be the first thing to go wonky with a gut motility problem! Wonky poop definitely screams to me that there’s SOMETHING in her gut, be it bacteria, a virus, a parasite or some kind of structural anomaly. I would find it odd for a kidney disorder to exhibit as only gut-related symptoms, though of course with bunnies with mystery illnesses everything possible should be taken into account.

Changes in bloodwork could also be due to gut problems. With poor motility, a rabbit could have trouble digesting nutrients from food, leading to funky bloodwork. I don’t think it could explain all the changes you see there, however, but I would ask my vet about the possibility anyway.

I hope you find a diagnosis! I have experiences with a mystery illness as well, and I know from experience how nerve-wracking and heartbreaking the process of trying to find a reason for your bunny’s illness among a swamp of symptoms is! In our case it turned out to be congenital megacolon. I wish you both the best of luck and all the vibes in the world.

[jerseygirl]

Posted By redbunbun on 3/09/2016 5:04 PM

Her water intake sounds within reasonable bounds to me, especially if she’s eating a lot of hay (as she should be!).

I’m wondering if what she’s experiencing could be due to a motility disorder of the gut, particularly of the cecum. A mushy poop whenever she empties out her cecum would fit with cecum motility issues, which would cause icky unformed poop to gather there and be discharged along with the cecals. This is kind of counterintuitive if her cecals are normal, though… those should be the first thing to go wonky with a gut motility problem! Wonky poop definitely screams to me that there’s SOMETHING in her gut, be it bacteria, a virus, a parasite or some kind of structural anomaly. I would find it odd for a kidney disorder to exhibit as only gut-related symptoms, though of course with bunnies with mystery illnesses everything possible should be taken into account.

Changes in bloodwork could also be due to gut problems. With poor motility, a rabbit could have trouble digesting nutrients from food, leading to funky bloodwork. I don’t think it could explain all the changes you see there, however, but I would ask my vet about the possibility anyway.

I hope you find a diagnosis! I have experiences with a mystery illness as well, and I know from experience how nerve-wracking and heartbreaking the process of trying to find a reason for your bunny’s illness among a swamp of symptoms is! In our case it turned out to be congenital megacolon. I wish you both the best of luck and all the vibes in the world.

I agree, it’s almost as if part of the food been proceeded in intestine is being help back near where the cecatrophes are produced. I wonder if trialing her on a prokinetic for the hind gut would be worth while? 

There may be hormone involvement also as hormones control fusus coli.

The fusus coli is a thickened, muscular, vascular, innervated area of the colon that controls motility of the hindgut. It is also the area where the intestinal contents are formed into faecal pellets.~ Frances Harcourt-Brown

Re the blood tests & kidneys, could E Cuniculi be a factor? It can actually cause some gi issues in some rabbits. Possibly via nerve involvement. 

Maybe ask your vet to research if urine retention and/or obstruction are consistent with the high B.U.N. & creatinine levels??

I took a quick look at your profile. She is 8 now?   Im glad she is behaving normally other then these weird poops. It sounds rather like the “cow poop” that some rabbits with megacolon do.

[jerseygirl]

Just another thought. What about her teeth? I know she has a history of molar spurs. I *think* LPT said she knows it’s time for Bindi to have his trimmed when he starts to get weird poop. I dont trust my memory. Hopefully she’ll see this.

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