Diet for 2 Month Old Flemish Giant

[DustBunneh'sMama]

Hello to everyone from Wisconsin. I am new to this site and the boards, but absolutely love it. You all are so knowledgeable.

I am new to being a bunny mama, so I have a lot of questions. The woman I got my baby from said that I should not give him "treats" – meaning fresh things like fruit and vegetables – until he is at least 4 months old, and he should only get pellets and grass hay.

So…I got a nice bale of grass hay with some timothy and pasture grass that I got from a dairy farmer friend, but my bunny hates it. He never even nibbles on it. I got him ADM "Pen Pals" pellets at 18% protein, because she said he should have a little more protein when he is growing since he will be so big. I am just worried that he’s eating solely pellets at this point. I have ordered some oat hay and will see if he will eat that, and I’m trying a bale of the 6-in-1 hay from this site.

This is the nutrition information from the feed:

Features & Benefits

• Contains Sarsaponin (Yucca) to aid in reducing ammonia levels

• Contains direct fed microbial to aid in digestibility and nutrient availability

• Amino acid-balanced for improved growth and fur quality. Alfalfa-based formula for consistent palatability and high quality fiber

• Feed includes salt to eliminate need for salt spools which may corrode cages.

                          Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein…………………………………………Min. 18.0%
Crude Fat………………………………………………Min. 3.0%
Crude Fiber………….. Min. 16.5% ……………….Max. 19.8%
Calcium (Ca)………… Min. 0.7% …………………Max. 1.2%
Phosphorus (P)…….. Min. 0.5%
Salt (NaCl)…………… Min. 0.6% …………………Max. 1.1%
Vitamin A…………………………………………….. Min. 2,500 IU per Pound

Ingredients
Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Dehulled Soybean Meal, Wheat Middlings, Soybean Hulls, Cane Molasses, Vegetable Oil, Lactobacillus acidophilus Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Lactobacillus casei Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Bifidobacterium thermophilum Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Enterococcus faecium Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Yucca Schidigera Extract, L-Lysine, DL Methionine, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Phosphate, Salt, Zinc Oxide, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Polysaccharide Complex, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Polysaccharide Complex, Copper Polysaccharide Complex, Sodium Selenite, Iron Polysaccharide Complex, Vitamin A Supplement, Niacin Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Biotin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement, Magnesium Polysaccharide Complex, Calcium Iodate, Thiamine Mononitrate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Cobalt Carbonate, Folic Acid, Choline Chloride

It looks like the calcium is under 1%, at .07%, which is good, even though the first ingredient is the dehydrated alfalfa meal. I know one of the main concerns in feeding alfalfa products is the higher calcium level, but I don’t think that’s a problem here.

My question is, will he be alright eating this, given that he doesn’t like hay, for now, and I can’t supplement with anything else until he is older?  All opinions and information are welcome. Thanks everyone!

[Sarita]

You can actually start giving him greens – small amounts one green type at a time to ensure he has no problems with the greens. Honestly there is no need to wait until he is 4 months old for greens. Greens are a natural part of a rabbits diet. I would start with simple types of greens like parsley and cilantro for now.

As for hay – keep trying different types of hay – also he may be eating the hay and you just not notice it. The hay you have sounds really nice.

The pellets do sound fine – baby rabbits can have timothy pellets and be just fine all their life so you don’t have to use alfalfa pellets but these are fine. I would not give him alfalfa hay and alfalfa pellets but if you give him timmy pellets you can give him alfalfa hay.

Are you measuring his pellets or free-feed? I would recommend that even if he is a baby to measure out his pellets so you can see what he is eating and that might also entice him to eat more hay. You can just measure an amount morning and night to help you determine the amount he is eating.

How much does he weight at 2 months?

[MooBunnay]

Hello! Welcome to BinkyBunny!

Since your rabbit is still a baby, as well as a large breed bunny, it is OK to give your bunny alfalfa hay until he is six months old. I have not had much experience with baby rabbits, but in the few times that I have, I was recommended to feed unlimited alfalfa hay and pellets until they are six months old. I bet your bun will really love alfalfa hay I have yet to meet a bun that doesn’t! However, now that you know your bunny isn’t the biggest fan of some hay, you’ll have to remember to start transitioning him from the alfalfa hay to regular hay around 5 months to give him sometime to adjust.

A couple things I recommend for picky hay eaters:
1. Purchase a hay rack – for some reason my buns just love pulling their hay out of the rack AND it makes it easier to see how much hay your bunny is eating
2. Limit pellets and veg – most bunnies really like their pellets and veg and will pass up hay for those
3. Monitor their poops – as you will learn quickly, bunny mama’s know a LOT about their bunny poops as long as the poops are looking healthy (AKA dry poops that are round) your bunny is probably eating his hay when you aren’t looking!

[Sarita]

Just so you know about alfalfa hay too – it is never to be fed unlimited like grass hay and it never takes the place of grass hay. You should just feed handfuls of it not unlimited. It is more of a supplement rather than a necessity as the grass hay.

[DustBunneh'sMama]

Thanks for the great tips, guys!  It’s so nice to get such quick replies and be a part of a board that is so active and current.

Right now he weighs about 9 lbs.  I’m working really hard on bonding with him and getting him tame, but he is super curious and friendly so far. He’s not too into petting, but I have been able to give him a few nice, gentle strokes and he lowered his head and shut his eyes, so I think that means he likes it? 

I’m free-feeding pellets and hay now, because the breeder said to give him as much as he wants until he’s a year old. I’m going to try the suggestions of measuring amounts though so I can see how much he eats. I would say I put about 2 cups a day in his crock, one in the morning and one in the evening, and there is always a bit left in the bottom.

I would love to purchase a hay rack or net, similar to what they have for horses, but I have no idea where to look. Any suggestions or website addresses would be appreciated!  We live in a tiny town in northwest Wisconsin, so my physical shopping options are quite limited. Thank God for the Internet.

I just got home from work and am getting ready to run upstairs and hang out with him. He’s the highlight of my day!  I’m hoping to get some cute pics to put on my profile here. He has the most darling cheeks and giant ears.

Thanks again everyone. I’ll be seeing you around the message boards!!

[DustBunneh'sMama]

One more question – I just thought of something else – what about the papaya and acidophilus (or whatever it’s called?) tablets that others give their rabbits? How important are these, and could I just give him little nibbles of papaya once a day or every couple days?  His feed has stuff in it to keep his yeast balance correct, so I don’t know if he needs those other pills.  Any ideas?  Thanks again!

[Sarita]

Many people swear by the papaya and papaya tablets to help break down hairballs in their rabbits. I like to use the papaya tablets as a treat because it seems they are very low in sugar if I read the package correctly. I would not give more than one or two a day. I hear many different sides as to whether this is necessary or not but I don’t think in any event it is harmful in small quantities.

I also give acidophilus tablets as treats because they are low in sugar and they come in flavors the rabbits like. I’m not sure if they really do anything to tell you the truth – some vets say they do and some say they don’t – some rabbit people say they help and some don’t. I don’t think anyone know for certain if this is something that is necessary for rabbits other than their own experience with it. I don’t think there is anything that is conclusive about helping with gut balance by offering these to your rabbit.

Obviously rabbits wouldn’t normally eat either of these things unless we gave them to them but we all love to give our rabbits treats because it makes us feel good.

[Sarita]

Okay now I’ve read the post that he is 9 pounds – wow. I would continue to give him the amount you are feeding him but measuring them out. He is going to be a big boy – I’ve met a few Flemmies and I have to say you are so lucky to have one. They are such wonderful rabbits. I would LOVE to see pictures of him. I’ve only met full-grown ones and just love their gentle mellow attitudes and just fell in love with them. He is so young right now and curious it might be just harder to get his attention but I know you will bond with him easily. He just wants to play right now :~)

[Sarita]

Is your bunny free roaming in his own area – a Flemmie almost has to be because of their size. If so a hay rack may not work for you. But you could build a free-standing one out of those neat idea cubes – I know someone who has done that.

[Beka27]

YES!!!  pictures!!! PLEASE!!!!

as much as i love my rabbit, and other’s smaller breeds like lionheads and such… i have a special soft spot for GIGANTIC rabbits!  i’d LOVE to have a huge rabbit someday!  wow… 2 months and already 9 pounds!  tell me… does that make bunnyproofing easier b/c he can’t fit into many places?  probably.  did you get him from a breeder?  and do you have plans to neuter him when he reaches puberty?  that will (in most cases) make your bonding process go much better and make him overall a more loving pet. 

welcome here!

[LittlePuffyTail]

Welcome! I can’t wait to see pics of your bunny! I want a huge bunny too! Mine only weigh 2.5 and 4 lbs full grown. I want a biggie bunny for snugglin! Your very lucky!

[Scarlet_Rose]

Welcome we’re glad to have you here!  Since your shopping options are kind of limited you might want to check out the following web sites and Binky Bunny too!

https://binkybunny.com/Default.aspx?tabid=55&List=1

http://www.oxbowhay.com/index.sp

http://www.americanpetdiner.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=americanpetdiner&Category_Code=Rabbits

Oh yes and check out your local Wisconson House Rabbit Society web site too!

 

[DustBunneh'sMama]

Thanks for all the nice comments, guys!  Check out the "Lounge" for some cute pics with captions that I took this morning.

As for bunny proofing for my big guy, right now he has an entire 7×14 room to himself with a standard store-bought cage in the corner with food, water, litter box and bed, then in the room he has another litter box, hiding tunnel, and coffee table to hide under with an old sheet to bunch up for fun, and tons of bunny toys!  The only thing in the room that is not his is the base for the cordless phone, and a cable for the TV in the other room. Long story, to get cable upstairs they had to run it outside up the wall from downstairs, then back through the wall upstairs and into the other room…it’s very ghetto! Ha ha. But, I got that black ribbed plastic stuff to put over the wires and cables so he won’t eat them, and right now he’s always in his cage when I’m not there so he doesn’t have access to them.

Pretty soon he’s going to outgrow his cage though, so I’m debating if I should make him another enclosure of sorts with those wire cube panels, or if I should just let him have the entire room?  I haven’t decided yet. Once he is full size, he would need an enclosure half the size of the room in order to have enough space, and that would cut down on his room to run, so I might just put his food, water, bed and litter pan in the corner where his cage is now and let him be free…we shall see!

[Sarita]

I would consider a puppy pen for a bun this size if you have to contain him – once he gets full-grown I don’t think the neat idea cubes cages will even contain him comfortably. You can even put 2 puppy pens (or x pens) together. You will want it to be tall too – at least the 3 foot tall one or 4 foot tall one – cannot remember what the height of the ones I have are for my bigger buns.

[Beka27]

it’s awesome that you have the option of a whole room, what a lucky bun!  i like the idea of (once he’s fixed and getting bigger) to give him the whole BUNNYPROOFED room.  an idea… if you have a store-bought cage with a solid plastic bottom… when he has the whole room, take off the top wire part and just use the big plastic tray to keep his food and water in, that way if it spills it’s not a big mess on the floor.  i’m guessing the NIC cubes could work for awhile… but like you said, eventually he’ll need at least half the room anyways… so you might as well just focus on top notch bunnyproofing.

[Sarita]

Yes, actually I agree with Beka free run is the best for him but if you must contain him the x-pen is an option.

[MooBunnay]

As he gets bigger you can probably consider the room he is in his “cage” – to keep it open you could consider putting a baby gate in the doorway, then you could see him while you’re walking around the house. From my experience the Flemish buns don’t leap over baby gates all that well – but I did know a Californian bunny that couldn’t be stopped by a NIC cage. I adopted her out, and two days later I heard from her new owner that she had “declared” herself a free range bunny, so your bun might do that too once he gets older

[Beka27]

and moobunnay brings up an excellent point… is your goal to eventually have him have an area larger than that room?  i’m obviously not familiar with the set-up of your home… but is it possible to proof the whole house and just make (let’s say Bedrooms, bathroom, and computer area/room) off limits?  because really… 7 by 14 feet is not that big of a running area for such a large guy.  it’s good for being contained when you’re not around… but he’ll also want out with you or with the rest of the family.  the nice thing about rabbits is they do make such wonderful house pets… i would definitely be planning ahead to how he’s going to fit into your life and home, and it sounds like he’s off to a great start.

[DustBunneh'sMama]

Thanks for all the tips everyone!  I think eventually he will not have a cage in the room, but rather will just have the whole room. Right now, I leave his cage door open and he always goes back into his cage to use the litter box, which is wonderful after just a week, and at only 2 months old. When he gets too big for his cage, I will just take his food, water, litter and bed and put them on the floor where his cage is now. He doesn’t run around very much at all. When I come in the room to see him, if he’s in his cage he hops out to see me and when I lie on the floor with him he will do a few binkies and check me out, but then he pretty much just lies around in his various favorite places. I’m not sure if he’s ever really going to be the "running" type!  Ha ha. He’s more of a deluxe model that doesn’t expend a lot of energy. In fact, I decided to vacuum his room yesterday, now keep in mind he’s only been at my house a week and when I got him he was in an outdoor hutch with little human contact. So, I cleaned out his litter boxes and went to vacuum up the stray dust and litter pellets and thought he would completely bolt when I turned on the vac, but he just kept lying in his big litter box in the corner of his room. He didn’t even go in his cage or anything, and I vacuumed right around the outside edge of his big litter box right where he was lying. So, needless to say, he’s not the really jumpy type.

In my house, all of the bedrooms are upstairs, then the living room, dining room, and kitchen are downstairs. I do have 4 dogs which I would not trust with my precious bun, so if we took him downstairs to play, it would definitely have to be a planned thing where the dogs were put in their basement kennels first. I want to give him more time to get really good at the litter box thing before I expand his area to play, just so he won’t have an accident in the living room. That would be bad. But, he can’t ever have the entire run of the house because of the dogs. He will always be upstairs and can possibly go in the other rooms besides just his room, but we would need a lot more bunny proofing up there, and a very sturdy baby gate so the dogs can’t come upstairs at all.

[Beka27]

i see, wow four dogs and a bunny that’s gonna be the size of a dog… lol.  what kind of dogs do you have?  some dogs and rabbits can be bonded, with supervision of course.  i think even just having the run of the upstairs would be great for him.  he may get more active when he’s more comfortable (it’s only been a week)… or you may just have the most mellowest bunny ever!

[Gravehearted]

wow, he must be such a cutey! I would recommend a very sturdy gate for sure, since not only for the doggies – but also the bunny. My friend has a half flemie and she moves stuff around – like x-pens and gates with great ease. She’s so strong that it’s pretty hard to keep her in or out of anything when she’s determined.

Glad to hear the vacuuming didn’t upset him. I think flemies are often pretty mellow, so it makes them a good choice for families.

I have mixed thoughts on bunnies getting their own rooms. It’s great since it gives them a nice amount of space to run. But, bunnies are so social that they often enjoy being around the family and hanging out with everyone. There may be some way to bunnyproof more of the upstairs so he can spend more time with all of you.

[DustBunneh'sMama]

I’ve only had him at home for a little over a week now, so I’m going to wait until he is really comfortable in his own room, then I will start leaving the door open and putting litter boxes in the other rooms upstairs. I also got a 2nd baby gate for the top of the stairs, so there are now 2 gates between him and the dogs. I’ve left his bedroom door open a couple times when I’ve ran and got something for him, but he hasn’t approached it. One time he did sit and watch me go out the door and looked like he was thinking about hopping over, but he stayed in his room. I’m sure with time he’ll get more adventurous!  I’ve also decided against the x-pen or panels. He can just have the whole room. He has done perfect on his litter training and always goes back in his cage to use the potty. The cage door is always open and his food and water is in there. When he gets too big for the cage I will just take it out of the room but leave the large litter pan and then rig up something for his water bottle to hang from. I have a bit of time though. He’s only 9 lbs. right now, so he’s got some growing to do before he becomes a full-fledged "giant" of 17-20 lbs!

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