Pair #1 sound pretty good to me. You just really never know which one will end up being dominant. Ithink they just might need more time together and longer sessions if you can.

Pair #2 sound a little like my Baby & Dino that never worked out. Baby thought she should be dominant but doesn’t have it in her. But yet when she would kiss/lick Dino she wanted him to kiss/lick her back and when he didn’t she would just nip him. If you see no positive signs over the next few bonding sessions, they think about stopping for a week or two and then start up again. If still no luck, I’d call it quits.

The bond should be somewhat easy and both buns at some point should seem like they want to be together. If they don’t want to be together, it’s not good to keep trying to push them into a bond.

Seem like you have your hands full and good luck and keep us posted…

As far as Part 1, I agree with you about albino male rabbit observation – I also did a bonding with a albino male bun, and he would mount like crazy. Sometimes we would have to pick him up off the female because we were afraid he was going to have a heart attack, and he would just keep mounting mid-air, haha. Anyways, to get them to fall in love…well, its something you can’t really rush, so I would just recommend continuing the positive bonding sessions that you are having now, and I think eventually they will work everything out. I don’t think there is anything you should force on them since they are doing well progressing on their own.

As far as Part 2, I think it can still work. I think you need to try some “stress bonding” techniques. I would put Rupert and Smokey in a box together, and take them on a car ride before you start their bonding session. This will make them both a little nervous, and hopefully they will then snuggle together during the car ride. Once you get them inside for their bonding session, set them right next to each other, and just keep petting and petting their heads. Hopefully this will get them used to being next to each other and get used to each others scents.

Two sets of two has to be the first step. Since they are all your rabbits (meaning permanently living in your care) you should be able to get it accomplished because you will have time. Try it in different set-ups, with stressors, and without… and if you find there to be issues you can always take time off and try something new.

Bonding sessions can be frightening, so rabbits tend to act defensively and territorially. As long as the well-being of the rabbits isn’t compromised, I would keep trying, with caution, and it sounds like that’s what you’ve been doing.

It’s nice when they hit it off! You definitely do not want a fight to ruin it for them. Are you thinking of moving Smokey and Rupert into Rupert’s pen? If you can sleep nearby I’d say yes. A neutral pen would be safer, but you know Rupert best, if he doesn’t take Smokey’s invasion into his zone as trespassing then it should be OK.

Well done! Seeing them must spur you on to get the remaining pair bonded. It sounds like you’re a good way there with the next two. Just persist with neutral territory until they spending more time together. It may be territory related or just dominance really. They just have to sort that out between them.

Before bonding, I had read it was important that you handled your first bunny first and the new one second, like when you’re putting them into a pen for instance. I did this but found I actually needed to reverse it with my doe. (The buck was the new addition). If I put her into the area first then she observed me coming back with the newbie, she was more aggressive toward him. If he was already there and then it was me & her then coming into the area, she was better. Maybe see whether your doe perceives things that way? It’s just a small thing but it did curb some aggression during my bonding experience.

What are you currently up to with them? Neutral territory or are you trying them in their living spaces? Are you in a pen with them or observing from outside of it? You mentioned her being materialistic…I’m thinking a new pen (for their permanent home) with a combo of their things in their might help. Due you think she’s like that about “her stuff” as a security thing?

Maybe stress bonding like a car ride might actually help things move along if they reacted that way to that stressful vibe.  Just a guess, but it really sounds close, like they’ve got to just work out these few things.  It seems to happpen like that – they have this sticking point then all of a sudden they’ve sorted it.  Perhaps you and your husband can remain a bit more distant and appear busy (but really supervising) during their time in the living room.  The longer the periods they spend together like that, the better.  My memory is sketchy now but I do remember I had similar issue with my doe and “jealousy”/aggression (whether it really is jealousy).  I wonder if it’s more like they have a view of who is part of the warren/family and who is not so try chase the intruder out.

So is Smokey the Wooly and Rupert the Dutch?

hehe “Hello Kate” Actually, I am also Katie!
It’s funny, some other members had various reasons why I have “jerseygirl” screen name. It’s my 1st bunnies name, my Doe Jersey. She’s the white and tan one in my siggy. The other is my Buck Rumball. So in Australia we have a confectionary called Jersey Caramels (probably named that after Jersey cows). My doe is the same colour as these and when naming her this one stuck. When I got the boy I decided he should have an edible name too – hence Rum ball, another sweet.
Jersey wooleys are here in Australia but not too common. Can you actually shear the coat like Angoras can? I wonder whether that would help with fur explosions?

Well I don’t know if I’m helping but I’m certainly cheering them on. C’mon Smokey & Rupert!!  It feels so close……

Posted By bunnymama on 08/11/2009 06:53 PM

The bond should be somewhat easy and both buns at some point should seem like they want to be together. If they don’t want to be together, it’s not good to keep trying to push them into a bond.

There are rabbits that can’t or shouldn’t be bonded, say, for reasons of high risk of injury or disturbed personalities due to abuse etc. In general, though, I can’t say I agree with not pushing a bond. I have bonded pairs of buns that without a doubt did not want to be together. It took more work and tricks and time but in the end they bonded and these bonds turned out to be some of the most dynamic ones. I have bonded pairs that were called by Cupid and personally I have found some of the harder bonds to produce a much richer social life especially in multiples.

Everything sounds very good to me, actually. Smokey needs time to accept and adjust. I would give Rupert and her positive atttention together at the same time. Like petting them both on your lap or feeding craisins to them simultaneously. You might always see some jealousy with her but it doesn’t have to be a deal-breaker. Rabbits are so complicated

 edit: I don’t know if you are planning on a quartett at some point out of your 2 pairs, but especially when bonding small herds you end up with having to push somebunny just a little bit to make it happen. — I wonder at all what  the probability is of finding 4 rabbits that all instantly love one another.

It really a personal thing so if you feel you’re ok with a trio and a 2nd bonded pair (i.e.Smokey & mystery bunny) then go for it. If a quartett is your dream then I say try bonding Rupert to Benny & Flo and if all goes well – then test Smokey with the new trio. The dynamics may be very different then. If bringing her into it is a no go – then go on to let her chose her own pal.  Like I said, it’s your personal choice – this is just my suggestion – no idea if it’s the practical way forward as I have noooo experience with more than 2.

I find quartett bonding very intriguing but challenging. Some people have said the more bunnies there are to bond the easier it gets. I can’t agree with that as far as quartetts are concerned. Quartetts are still small enough that each bun has to be paired-bonded to each bun. This means a quartett consists of 6 bonds. I also found that a dispute between two buns in a quartett can draw the other buns into it, and upset good bonds. If it was me in your situation I would not quit and get more rabbits to make a separate pair. I don’t personally like the idea of separate multiples because you always have to worry, what if they escape and get in a fight with the unbonded ones? That’s just me being a worrywart, though. Keep setting up Rupert and Smokey for bonding. Supervise each encouter as tiring as it may be, as long as you prevent them from fighting you can wear them out to the point of tolerating each other. That’s all you need to do. It’s just time-consuming, but it will work.

Posted By katiep on 11/12/2009 08:10 PM
Rupert is sweet, he will NOT groom. No tricks like bananas on the head nothing….he just won’t! “You can’t make him and that’s that!” At least thats what his face tells me when i tried. So in that regard he is being dominant. He doesn’t mind being mounted but it’s the grooming that sets him off. He gets frustrated when nipped (he’s very sensitive about his butt!) And Smokey needs someone to kinda push around and “show who’s boss”.

Katiep, I read back your reports and thought some more on the issues that you are seeing during your bonding, and this one described above particularly reminds me of my rabbits Lint and Deirdra. He wouldn’t groom her, bananna on head or whatever, but he also didn’t allow mounting. He still bonded to Deirdra but after 5 months now of livng with her, he still doesn’t groom, maybe a single lick or two once in a bluemoon but that’s it. He does snuggle with Deirdra, though, and she has accpted that’s just how he is. Rabbits are very quirky and not every bond/relationship has to follow a strict pattern, i.e. they must groom each other or mount each other.. I have a trio where nobunny is permitted to mount. Even though when two of them were a pair there was lots of mounting.

You mentioned a younger rabbit might be a solution for Smokey as she could shape him into what she wants. I don’t believe young rabbits make easier bonds, from what I’ve read and my own experience; young rabbits are known for competitiveness and volatility which can manifest as aggression during bonding.

Is there a setup/scenario which works for Smokey and Rupert, such as dinner time together, or sitting in your lap together? Stick to holding sessions of that type where they tend to get along or even ignore one another. I would imagine that Smokey is going to clue in that Rupert isn’t going to groom her. When you said it’s “the grooming that sets him off”, do you mean that her grooming him makes him mad, or her asking to be groomed?

I feel that if you can get Rupert and Smokey to tolerate one another, then being integrated in a quartett in the future will make it better for them. Sometimes, a not-so-ideal bond improves as part of a multiple herd by distracting from the conflict between one of the pairs.