Trying to bond two males!! (one which everyone thought was a female…)

[lunalove]

Hi everyone!  I decided to get my 5 month old mini lop spayed, and surprise surprise… she is actually a he!!  It wouldn’t have been a problem except I was adopting a new boy on the same day (a 10 month old dwarf/holland lop).  I didn’t want to back out of the adoption because he needed a home and I felt really sorry for him. 

I put them in seperate cages at first and they were sniffing each other.  As they weren’t biting I decided to let them out for a few minutes.  IMMEDIATELY it was a race to see who could hump the other first!  They just constantly do this, depite one of them being neutered.  Suddenly there were signs of fighting so I immediately seperated them. 

It is always Luna (5 month old neutered mini lop) who manages to gain the dominant position, but Smog (10 month old un-neutered dwarf lop) just won’t give up!

Does anyone have any tips on bonding a neautered male with an intact one?  I’m very inexperienced with rabbits and I don’t want them to get hurt.  I’m going crazy here – I hate keeping my Luna in a cage! 

[Monkeybun]

Don’t try to bond them until both are neutered and a month after. Hormones can cause alot of aggression and they can be very territorial. Mounting isn’t always about making babies, it’s a dominance thing too. It’s how they sort out who the Top Bunny is.

Get Smog neutered and try again Same sex bonds can turn out just as well as opposite gender ones

[lunalove]

I’ve heard a lot of bad things about male rabbits being very hard to bond, even when fixed. Is this true? I’m a student and will have to save up to get Smog neutered, which will be a waste of money if I have to give him away if they don’t get along :/

[bunnnnnnie!]

I really have zero experience with bonding, but I will say I just adopted a neutered rabbit, to join my home with my intact male rabbit.  The intact boy, Zeus, is getting fixed before we start the bonding.  For now they can visit through the cage bars, and there’s been no fighting.  They’re very curious of one another.  So I would say bonding two males is most definitely possible, it just depends on personalities.  Zeus is a very laid back, doesn’t care about anything bun.  West is a more timid bun, so Zeus’s laidback nature should work really well with West.

[Monkeybun]

my 2 girls are bonded. I am in the process of bonding my boys. It can definitely be done

[Sarita]

It shouldn’t be doable as long as both are neutered. You will need to realize that it may not be easy, but some bondings aren’t. That doesn’t mean yours won’t but you are going to have to know that with any bonding, it takes time, commitment and perseverance. Bonding is stressful for rabbits and for owners but as long as you are committed you can do it.

[Sarita]

Also you mention that you may have to give Smog away if it doesn’t work out – when you adopt a rabbit, you want to make a commitment as well to keep both rabbits even if the bonding doesn’t work out. I hope that you will do that.

[lunalove]

thanks for the replies everyone!

I’ve made an appointment for Smog to get neutered in 4 days time

Sarita – If the bonding really doesn’t work out I may have to give him away (not to just anybody though – I would ask them about their home, accomodation, other pets, experience with rabbits etc) because I am a full-time student. I wanted a companion for Luna so she (I’ve decided to keep calling her she haha) doesn’t get lonely when I am at lectures. I would feel so guilty if I had two lonely rabbits all locked up in cages all day! I couldn’t do that to any living creature.

[bunnnnnnie!]

Posted By lunalove on 01/05/2012 07:36 AM
thanks for the replies everyone!

I’ve made an appointment for Smog to get neutered in 4 days time

Sarita – If the bonding really doesn’t work out I may have to give him away (not to just anybody though – I would ask them about their home, accomodation, other pets, experience with rabbits etc) because I am a full-time student. I wanted a companion for Luna so she (I’ve decided to keep calling her she haha) doesn’t get lonely when I am at lectures. I would feel so guilty if I had two lonely rabbits all locked up in cages all day! I couldn’t do that to any living creature.

But even if you screen a potential adopter very well, it still ultimately comes down to once that bun is out of your hands, you have no idea what kind of care they will receive, and if you realize they ARE receiving poor care, there will be nothing you can do about it.  Are you comfortable with knowing that?
 

[Sam and Lady's Human]

I’m also in the boat you shouldn’t adopt unless you know you can give a forever home, its just not fair to the poor bun. I’m actually really surprised they didn’t neuter him before they adopted him out!

However, I’m just going to cross my fingers and hope for a good bond You’ll have to have patience, it can take a few days to a few months for a pair of any gender mix to bond. I think you have a lot going for you in that both boys are young, they aren’t quite “set in their ways” hah. You can start by having their pens near each other, and about a week or 2 after Smogs neuter you can try to start to switch pens to help mix the scents. They both might lose litter habits until they are bonded, in marking wars. That’s always fun to clean up. I noticed that if I put some of Samsons poops in Ladys litter box and visa versa, they started marking their own boxes more, conveniently

[lunalove]

not really   I seriously messed this up, all I wanted was a friend for Luna   It would have gone so well if she hadn’t turned out to be a boy!  I just hate having the bunnies in cages, it makes me really upset and I couldn’t bear it if they had to spend their whole lives practically living in a little bunny jail.  Urgh, I messed up so bad!!

[Sam and Lady's Human]

Noo Luna don’t feel bad, you can do this! You’re putting the cart before the horse (or whatever that saying is!). Wait until Smog is neutered, then work on bonding the right way, neutral spaces and all that.

What are they living in now? Is Luna a room bunny? You’re right that cages are too small for rabbits, but there are other options, I’m sure we can help you figure out something that works

[Sarita]

Luna you didn’t mess up. This is the way I look at it…you know that even if they have to spend the majority of their lives in a cage, they are safe and well cared for. In all honesty, most rabbits like their cage, they feel safe and secure there…it’s not all bad. You just have to make sure that you have a nice set up perhaps a nice x-pen for each rabbit if you can manage that or if you need something more vertical, you can build a nice cage out of cubes.

Don’t feel hopeless or bad, you need to try the bonding and feel free once you are ready to post for suggestions and ideas when you get stuck or frustrated with the bonding.

[lunalove]

Ok, I’ll try to stop freaking out haha. I just hopehopehope they can bond, because I care about them both so much, they’re like my babies lol! I just want them both to have good lives you know? And Luna hasn’t been in her cage in weeks… so when I put her (him lol) in today she stared at me and got onto her hind legs, begging me to let her out
I recently got a two story cage so there’s more room, and if the bunnies bond they would only be in their cage for 8 hours a day, max.
I’ve been googling like crazy and it’s upsetting stuff – so many people are adamant that two males can never bond/it’s very unlikely! Doesn’t make me feel very confident :/
But again thanks for the replies, as I said I’m new at all of this stuff and I just want them both to be happy x

[bunnnnnnie!]

Posted By lunalove on 01/05/2012 10:53 AM
Ok, I’ll try to stop freaking out haha. I just hopehopehope they can bond, because I care about them both so much, they’re like my babies lol! I just want them both to have good lives you know? And Luna hasn’t been in her cage in weeks… so when I put her (him lol) in today she stared at me and got onto her hind legs, begging me to let her out
I recently got a two story cage so there’s more room, and if the bunnies bond they would only be in their cage for 8 hours a day, max.
I’ve been googling like crazy and it’s upsetting stuff – so many people are adamant that two males can never bond/it’s very unlikely! Doesn’t make me feel very confident :/
But again thanks for the replies, as I said I’m new at all of this stuff and I just want them both to be happy x

 

I really think you have a very good chance of bonding them.  Like I said, I have two boys in my house, and they enjoy visiting through the bars already, and it’s only been a few days, and one of them hasn’t even been neutered yet.

Browse through the bonding section, and read some stories on some male-male bonds.  It’ll make you feel better to know other peoples’ experiences.

[Sam and Lady's Human]

Here’s my personal opinion on the genders, I would bet that the reason there are mostly boy-girl bonds is simply because most people want 1 boy and 1 girl and then they bond them. It seems far less common for someone to actually pick 2 of the same gender (unless they are sibilings, maybe?) than to pick what they think is different genders and find out later that they had the gender wrong Now obviously it happens, but I think for the most part, thats how it goes down. I honestly think that rabbits don’t care. And I’ve read of many girl/girl and boy/boy bonds that are great I also think that a lot of the “it has to be girl/boy” people that you read on other sites are basically clueless, and will try to bond a set without altering them and doing it the right way, neutral spaces, positive reinforcement etc. I was a bit panicked when I came home with Lady because now I have 2 girls, but I noticed a lot of the nay-sayers also didn’t even really try to bond them, they just put them in one space or another and were surprised when they fought. Anyway, it’s just my opinion on the whole thing, theres nothing scientific to back it up or anything. Just makes sense to me

[LBJ10]

My boys love each other. No problems after Leopold got all the humping out of his system.

[Sarita]

I agree, there is nothing scientific. Bonding takes alot of commitment and time.

You don’t need to give up, you haven’t even tried yet :~)

[lunalove]

thanks everyone! i feel a lot more positive about it now

[kralspace]

My trio has 2 boys and they get along just great. They were each pair bonded at one time or the other with Pringles so you would think they would be very jealous of each other but they snuggle and groom each other as much as they do Pringles.

I have my single charlie in the connecting condo and he does very well by himself. He can lay next to the grids in touch with the others (except Daisy) if they want or just hang out looking at each other.

If you haven’t visited the website about how bunnies talk to each other, please do. It will make you feel a lot better because bunnies do spend a lot of time just laying around looking at each other as much as actively touching or grooming. And sleeping most of the day. We may think it’s lonely, but it’s just bunnies being bunnies. If the 2 of them get along well but in separate condos, that wouldn’t be bad at all and they might eventually get so used to each other that more interaction would be possible.

I like the page on “Gazing”…lol Good luck

http://language.rabbitspeak.com/

 

PS, don’t feel bad. Pringles went from  girl to boy to girl

Daisy was certified girl then boy..lol

[avarismom1]

my boys are inseparable – that had to be separated until about 3 weeks after their neuters – but during that time I had their cages near each other where they could see one another – and I switched them into each others cage every couple of days. They LOVE each other. They cuddle and groom one another constantly – and I had people who i have known for years from rabbit rescue tell me that eventuially they would have to be separated. Nope, they adore each other

[Lintini]

My boys were easy to bond, they had a scuffle before and worked it out. You shouldn’t have too hard of a time once they are both neutered. You should never try to bond unaltered rabbits. Just don’t give up and I’m sure you will have a great pair!

[lunalove]

Update! When I was doing a switchover, Luna ran off to find Smog. I was about to seperate them completely when I realised that they weren’t fighting! Luna will go over to Smog for a sniff (no more violent face humping like last time!!) and Smog will just run away a little. Smog was even brave enough to give Luna a little sniff. Is this good news or am I just getting pre-maturely excited? They are still out of their cages and together in the living room since they are both behaving very well. Oooh, and right this second, Luna had several chances to mount Smog and she (he) didn’t!! Very proud.

[Sarita]

That’s good! Is Luna neutered yet? It’s best not to try bonding until he is neutered.

[lunalove]

Yes, Luna has been neutered but Smog has not. I AM SO HAPPY RIGHT NOW. They are in the hallway, and were stood side by side (each others nose sniffing the other’s butt) and neither tried to mount!! they just had a good smell of each other. Thank you so much everyone, I’m a very pessimistic person and was really worried about all of this! You’re all so nice :3

[kralspace]

Yea!!!!!! not fighting is always good news!

[Sarita]

You really should wait until Smog is neutered before you try bonding.

[Sam and Lady's Human]

Yup I agree with Sarita. Its hard to be patient, but its for the best of the bunnies, as they can really damage each other if they feel the urge, and since one is still hormonal, that can come out of nowhere

[lunalove]

Oh yeah definitely, they were only out together for about 5 minutes Can’t wait for the neutering and for their hormones to settle down! I think they’ll be very happy together

[KytKattin]

Good to hear they don’t come out swinging at each other! I had two girls that could never be bonded, but that was because the one girl wanted to be an only bunny (which she will be in about 2 weeks! lol). Def wait until after the neuter, especially because often times vet visits (that require surgery) can break bonds. Once you do start to bond them, I recommend putting them through a traumatic experience together, like running a vacuum cleaner near them.

[Sam and Lady's Human]

I just want to note you might not need to traumatize them, some reserve that for tough bonds or as a last resort

[KytKattin]

Haha, you’re right. I meant more as a final “cement”. Since by then you will probably need to vacuum anyways!

[Sam and Lady's Human]

Posted By KytKattin on 01/06/2012 12:50 PM
Haha, you’re right. I meant more as a final “cement”. Since by then you will probably need to vacuum anyways!

 

I wish my girls cared about the vacuum! They’re like, whatever Mom. I’m hoping if I give them the same “Mom” look I give my children, they’ll just behave themselves haha.

[lunalove]

another update if anyone is interested:
I let both boys out when I was cleaning the cages, and they behaved extremely well! Smog groomed Luna, they ate together, and cuddled side by side! there was binkying, flopping to the ground and everything. They seem to love each other a lot – is it still necessary to get Smog neutered? He’s a very shy bunny and it looks like he may be more on the submissive side, with no sign of agressiveness whatsoever.

[Sam and Lady's Human]

I just read your thread that one sprayed the other, thats not a good thing. You *need* to keep them separate. I know its hard, trust me I’ve waited over 2 months and am still waiting 2 more weeks because its what is best for my rabbits. Its not that long in the scheme of things, and it prevents a long list of possible injuries. I just read another thread elsewhere that her bunnies fought and one bit large chunks out of the others ears
Smog may be acting mellow because he’s new to everything there and is out of his comfort zone. But once he gets more familiar, he could very possibly change.

For what its worth, my girls groom through the bars but I’m still not introducing them. Its just not responsible, and frankly I don’t have the $$$ for emergency vet bills, so I’ll wait Even though it sucks waiting hah.

[lunalove]

yet ANOTHER update haha! I took Smog to the vet today to get neutered, and guess what – he’s actually a she!! No wonder the two got along so well – it was a classic m/f pairing. I’m a bit concerned that she might be pregnant though as she lived with her brother when they were both unfixed and there was a looot of humping, and Luna had a go too! But it’s all looking fine so far. Anyway, they’re both doing great and thanks for all the advice!

[Elrohwen]

I hope she’s not pregnant! Male bunnies can get a female pregnant for 4 weeks post-neuter, so there’s a chance. Definitely take her in to get spayed immediately in case she is pregnant.

[Jenna, Chubs & Comet]

My boy Chubs wanted nothing to do with any female rabbits when we were bunny dating! He was very aggressive towards them. Comet is so mellow and doesn’t have an aggressive bone in his body which is just what Chubs needed. They are both boys and have been very happily bonded for about 2 years now It’s definitely possible! Bonding is hard no matter the sexes of the rabbits, just be patient and think about the end result which is very worth it!

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