Starting over with Ruby

[Susanne]

As some know, my bunny boy Elmer passed away last week. Memorial post to be written once I can handle it.

After Ruby got depressed into a light stasis, I decided she shouldn’t be a single bun. We are going speed dating tomorrow! The rescue actually has some of her siblings. Apparently she was dropped off with her liter and some adults, and her mom was already pregnant again and had another liter the following month.  Anyway, one of the boys hasn’t had luck with bonding so maybe this is his lucky friend. He also has 2 brothers that are bonded and they asked if a trio would be an option so going to have them meet as well.

Is there such a thing as an easy trio bond? I said I’d consider bringing the pair home if they hit it off speed dating, but it scares me to go through a tough bond with 3 rabbits given my limited experience.

[Susanne]

Well the 3 didn’t fight, but didn’t click either so I didn’t want to go there.  All the dates went so well, not one nip or lunge! Makes things so hard. The place will swap if the bonding doesn’t go well which was a big reason I chose the place farther away.

I ended up with a small lionhead mix, another red eyed white. They kinda look alike. I can’t say he was the one I’d pick if just for me, and honestly nothing much happened on their date. I liked that they were both grooming near each other and just seemed incredibly calm. I really want an easy bond so I went with my intuition on that.

He is a sleepy boy and just got home and getting settled.

[DanaNM]

That sounds very promising! And awesome for picking out and REW! <3

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

Yes, so far he is settling well. Ruby has started marking a little, and aggressively chasing him down the fence, but I’m not too worried because she’s also spending time sleeping at the fence and has really perked back up. She is flopping and doing binkys again 🙂

Here are some pics, I’ll update once I start bonding sessions- but hoping it goes smoothly.

[DanaNM]

Awwww he’s so cute! And just look at them laying near each other! 🙂

Also such a smart idea with the 2×4 to keep the buffer between the fencing! Will have to steal that idea!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

I can’t remember where I saw the idea for the 2×4, but mine aren’t quite 2 inches so hopefully not a problem. Xpens straight across don’t work very well but it’s what I had…Ruby did get to him but only “fake” bit him. I repositioned the bricks to keep the fencing farther apart.

He has become a hyper boy. I thought he was 1.5- 2 yrs old but he’s so active I am skeptical. I’ve swapped them a couple times now. Ruby is getting upset. There is more marking but nothing horrible, the boy is chinning everything including me. With Elmer and Ruby there wasn’t this much marking and such. I think I’ll start with a date Friday and decide on method depending on how they interact.  These bun buns are a lot of work 😉

[DanaNM]

I usually like to let them just settle in for a week with no side swaps, then do side swaps after that, but if he seems very settled then it’s your call!

 

 

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

Yeah, I wasn’t sure but played it by ear. The way I set up the enclosure was that one has the run of a hallway and second bedroom (while still having a part of the room with the other bun), and I wanted to let him run around more. And he did a lot of zoomies and binkies! He actually did seem settled within a couple of days. He is not very skittish which is interesting.

[DanaNM]

That’s great! Some bunnies really do make themselves at home pretty quickly. 🙂

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

Update! I did our first bonding session earlier. I was fully planning to cut it after a few minutes depending how it went, but I ended up keeping them for an hour and a half.

I thought it went really well! Not love at first sight or anything, but I think they’ll be able to work things out after a couple weeks or so. I purposely did this during sleepy time so a big test will be once the new guy is more awake and energetic.

There were many positive things. Ruby already groomed him a little, she flopped on his head twice, they started falling asleep with their heads together, ate together, etc. The only negative was Ruby got aggressive at him twice. I couldn’t tell exactly, but looked like she bit him (lightly), then I went to intervene and she scratched me so I guess she was boxing him too. He did not retaliate at least. Right after that though it was good again.  He also really got up in her butt a couple times which I moved him from.  So, a few minutes of tension from that but mostly they were pretty relaxed 🙂 I of course facilitated with lots of pets.

 

[DanaNM]

OMG that looks like it went AMAZINGLY!

I’m so excited for you! I have actual tears in my eyes seeing them all relaxed together. <3

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

Thank you! This is only my 2nd time bonding and although they got cuddly, Ruby never got aggressive towards Elmer so it feels a little mixed. BUT yes it’s so sweet to see, especially with everything Ruby has been through. I hope they continue this way!

[Susanne]

Well I spoke too soon. There was aggression tonight. Ruby kept nipping and I’m honestly not sure exactly what happened but I tried to move them apart and got bit.  I think I set Ruby back down and tried to end positive but they weren’t having it. I tried to move max and he bit me, then picked him up and he clamped down on my finger 🙁  I’m not sure if that was for Ruby or me picking him up but it’s pretty bad.

Do you think it’s best to wait longer for the next date? Maybe next week.

[DanaNM]

Aww, bummer! But some ups and downs are normal and to be expected as the buns settle in a bit with each other. I think it’s fine to go back to shorter dates (or even pre-bonding), whatever you feel most comfortable with. I think since things have been moving pretty quickly I’d prob slow the pace a little.

Is your hand OK? I hope you had gloves on! They can really surprise you with those bites. I know I’ve gotten overly confident in the past… when I was trying to bond mine into a quad Cooper got my wrist in this spot that made my thumb numb for about 6 months!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

Yeah, it’s too bad, I was really hoping for them to work like it did with Elmer. I appreciate your support, bonding rabbits is so hard it makes all the difference to have a place to get help.

I of course worry it’s not a good match. They are still marking quite a lot. Max also is very stinky, like as if he hadn’t been neutered.  He humped Ruby a couple times until I pulled him off, and he urinated on her or something because her tail was wet 🙁 The boy has much more energy too, and I do wish he was more friendly with me. He isn’t shy but doesn’t like me petting him much and bite-y. Elmer was the opposite.

Anyway, I’m not going to give up yet but feeling discouraged. She just doesn’t seem to like him. I definitely moved too fast, and let the date go too long yesterday hoping they’d have an easy bond. I’m going to keep swapping areas but wait a little bit for more dates. I’ll start with shorter ones next time.

I did not have gloves on.. I even had a pair nearby but had not put them on. He got one bite on the side of my finger and sliced it open at the top. I didn’t know rabbits would bite like that!

[Susanne]

And ouch about your thumb going numb!! I’m wearing gloves for sure on the next meetings!

[DanaNM]

The smelly-ness can come from just being territorial! Cooper was SO stinky when i brought him home, even though he was neutered! I def had some “oh no” thoughts with him at first, but it did calm down once they were bonded!

I agree more pre-bonding will help a lot in this case (or even just no swaps, let them live side by side for a few weeks, and spend some time bonding with the new bun without the bonding stress). Bunnies respond to stress in different ways. I’ve noticed Cooper doesn’t often act scared or shy, but he gets very “reactive” and hyper when he is stressed or frightened. I wonder if Max is more unsure of his surroundings that he’s letting on, so it comes out as being high-energy?

It’s an emotional roller coaster re-bonding after the loss of another bunny, try to just take it one step at a time. Most bunny pairings DO work out, but most also take a bit of work to get there.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Susanne]

I think it may be better not to swap for now, my only issue is space. In hindsight it’s not the best set – up but I can’t change it now. With one of them able to leave the room anytime, they aren’t getting as much exposure to each other as I wanted.

Right now Max has about 50 sq ft, which isn’t horrible but seeing him run up and down the hall makes me want to give him more. I am thinking about how I can set up a play area for him in my living room vs swap them.

Good to know about Cooper, the stinky-ness was concerning! And you may be right about how he is responding to stress. Meanwhile, I think Ruby is still down about Elmer so all that could be contributing to their reactions to each other. Ruby was grooming him, grooming herself with his head under her feet, and later almost provoked him to a full blown fight (I’m at least thankful they didn’t hurt each other or actually fight).

[DanaNM]

50 sq ft is totally fine (esp as a temporary set up!), so don’t feel bad at all. It’s only temporary! He may actually feel less territorial knowing he has less space to “defend”.

The stinky-ness is crazy. I think they can control it by exposing their scent glands? Recently I revamped Cooper and Bonnie’s pen, and Cooper smelled super oniony again for a few hours!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

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