September Chat

[Azerane]

Here we are, a week in and no chat thread yet!

Thought I’d start things off on a positive. Luna’s weight has been poor since her E.c last year, she hovers in the 1900 grams range. It’s been over a year since she weighed over 2kg. Last month I started her on Burgess Excel pellets, instead of Oxbow. I picked the Burgess because it has double the fat content. She’s only been fully transitioned since last week and I weighed her today and she was 2090 grams. Early days yet to know whether it’s a once off or a trend but I’m excited to see how she goes. Still a 100g change for her is 5% of her body weight which is a big deal. If I can maintain her above 2100g I’ll be thrilled. She should be around 2400g but anything above 2kg is a win in my book.

[LBJ10]

That’s great Azerane!

[Azerane]

Thank you!

I think a rabbit being deaf doesn’t really seem to affect them much, pretty common in lops as you said. They adapt really well.

Angry rant time. Jasiri (cat) had a fecal test done last week. I was expecting the test results at the end of last week, didn’t hear anything. I rang first thing Saturday morning to be told that the results were in but no one could give them to me (only Vets can provide results and they were overbooked) but my vet who ordered the test would be back in Tuesday and could give me the results then. I said that wasn’t ok because obviously my cat is sick and I want to get her started on medication ASAP. I was told they would organise something for Monday. Vet is closed Sunday, Monday morning (today) rolls around and I ring the vet first thing in the morning again to make sure that someone is going to call me. They say yes, it’ll be after lunch but before 3pm. It gets to 4:15pm and no call so I ring them. I get told there will be no vet available to tell me today but they can organise it for tomorrow, I said I waited all last week already. She said test results take time, I told her that they had the results since last week. I get put on hold for a little while, then I’m on with the senior vet nurse, she was very nice and apologised but again no possible way it could be done until tomorrow but she would personally make sure it got done first thing in the morning.

I don’t like to be harsh about vets because I know they get busy, I know they’re often over worked and under paid. But how do they not allow time in each day set aside for calling clients with test results? Why do I have to wait so long just for a 5 minute phone call so that I can get her started on medication. Would they have made the effort to call me sooner if it was something serious? Why is providing a diagnosis and medication not a priority? In the meantime, Jasiri has been going off of her food and having more and more of an upset stomach. That’s what makes me mad, is she has to suffer for longer because I can’t get a 5 minute phone call. All that being said, maybe there was nothing in the test result.

Ok, I’m good now 😀

How is your day going?

[Bam]

Azerane, I’m sorry about Jasiri 🙁 I hope it’s nothing really bad. It’s weird you have to wait so long for the test results, hopefully that means it isnt really bad!

Great Luna-news though! It feels so weirdto have a bun that’s a hard keeper, the problem tends to be the exact opposite with buns. I was always so happy when Vilde hadn’t dropped under 1500 grams on his twice weekly weighings. With Snöa, I don’t want her to go over 2 kilos.

Here she is, looking out over what she has realized is the Kingdom of All Things Yummy, aka my mum’s garden:

 

[jerseygirl]

How sweet!   I think I recognise that spot. One of my fave pics of Vilde is him looking out this same window. 🥰

@talesOfTybalt my past lops both eventually had some build up in their ears. I was afraid it was abscess but I was able to massage the base and get stuff out some. The vet also injected an antibiotic direct into a lump and this helped get gunk out through ear too. Rumball had great ear control he was mainly trouble-free with his ears until very late in his life. Even then, it wasn’t anything to chronic. Might be worth checking if Tybalt has got some build-up causing hearing loss?

@Azerane Happy to hear Luna is starting to gain. I hope Jasiri comes good soon too. Pity one of the other vets couldn’t call on behalf of the one you had seen.

[Azerane]

@Bam, yes I’ve always had to be careful that Apollo doesn’t gain too much weight, and yet all this time I’ve been fighting to put weight on Luna. I’m excited to weigh her again once it’s been a week 🙂

Well after my angry rant it turns out that there is no medication to give Jasiri. 🙂 She does have problems, she has salmonella (possibly either from our parrot Dory, or more likely from a batch of bad food she had a couple weeks ago). In addition to that she also has high levels of clostridia in her gut. The vet said a small amount is normal for cats and suspects it’s only high due to the salmonella infection. There’s no treatment to be done when she is relatively well, but I have had to isolate her in one room away from Jasper. I disinfected all the litter trays today and still need to do all the surfaces, floors and parrot cage. I had intended to do it all today but time did not allow. I’m told the yuck poop should resolve itself within a couple of weeks, but she has to stay isolated until it does, which she is not going to enjoy since she is a very busy cat. My plan is to have her in the bedroom with us during the night (and Jasper in the rest of the house), and then shut her away in a different room during the day, so she can at least have a little bit of variety in her routine.

[DanaNM]

I’m glad to hear about Luna’s weight! That is so frustrating about the vet and Jasiri. Hopefully time will clear things up.

I’m slowly recovering from covid, picked up on my way home from a trip, after dodging it until now. I’m thankful I got it on the way home at least, rather than on the way too my vacation!

Bun Jovi is hanging in there. I thought I was seeing improvements with the panacur, but I think that may have been wishful thinking. He really isn’t able to move around much anymore due to his hind end weakness and is likely going to be “laterally recumbent” from here on out. He’s still eating and pooping well (as long as I put piles of food near him) and can manage a drink at the water bowl. He still snuggles with Myra and will even chew on some toys, but it’s heartbreaking to see his little legs splayed out at weird angles. 😥

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[jerseygirl]

Oh (((Bun Jovi)))

I’m sorry you didn’t see continued improvement. Do you think giving some Vit E + selenium would be worth a try?

[Bam]

(((((Bun Jovi)))))

 

[DanaNM]

Oh I haven’t heard of giving vit-E and selenium. What dosing do you use?

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[DanaNM]

well wouldn’t ya know it, I found a liquid multivitamin for rabbits. Ordered some, will report back once I try it! It didn’t have a ton of reviews but appears to be sold mainly by vet retailers so I think it seems safe. In my discussion with my friend at the rescue she did mention that some addition nutritional support or a probiotic might be good for him given all this medications.

 

 

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Bam]

Tomatoes are traditionally given as a potassium supplement as an acute measure for baby buns that present with floppy bunny syndrome.

Vitamin E is another acute intervention for the same symptoms. The general recommendation is to squeeze the contents of a vitamin E capsule directly into the bun’s mouth. This recommendation doesnt say anything about the strenght of the capsule contents.  I’ve sort of assumed its about pure wheat germ oil. Small bottles of wheat germ oil can often be bought in horse supply stores. What the bun doesnt consume you can consume yourself (in smallish doses over time).

I dont think it’d do any harm. Since vit E is soluble in fat, it mustnt be overdosed over time, but a single dose or two would probably not be harmful.

[prince dorian the bun]

Hope the vitamins help BunJovi, poor little guy.

Glad Luna is gaining weight! & hope Jasiri gets over her gut stuff soon, at least you don’t have to try and force meds… never fun.

Nothing really new on our end except also recovering from covid which I had managed to avoid until now. Dorian and Miu are doing great other than Dorian started shedding again! Seriously I can pull a handful of fur out of his forehead alone and I don’t get how this is possible. I am sort of wondering what his breed he may actually be as I am realizing the density of his fur is much thicket than other buns I have met. It’s also really soft like silk. He was my first bun so I had just though all buns were like that but now having helped my neighbor with her foster buns and Miu I am realizing he’s especially silky. Oh and it’s nail trimming time, or I should say bunnies being overly dramatic time. I don’t know which of them is worse… Miu will struggle and get herself all worked up and panting, while Dorian will squish his face up pathetically squeak at me as if I am cutting his paw off when I haven’t even done anything yet.

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

@Azerane: Whoop, congrats on Luna, and I hope that you’ll get Jasiri’s test results soon! We’re awaiting test results too, and it’s nerve-wracking.

@Dana: hope you’ll get well soon! And I’m really rooting for Bun Jovi’s new treatment.

@Dorian: get well soon too! Could Dorian have some Nethie in him? Nethies have a very dense double coat that’s very soft. They have rollback fur instead of flyback fur. It’s really easy to test: stroke them against the direction of the fur, and a Nethie-type coat will roll back slowly.

Nethies get spectacular moults, I’ve had the same with both Breintje and Owen. Molly doesn’t have the Nethie coat structure, so she moults easily and neatly. Owen is still patchy and has a hula skirt 🙄🙃

 

Sitrep here: Molly’s behaviour is going from bad to worse. She’s become downright aggressive and dangerous. It’s fun to have a unique bunny, but it’s not fun to have a “rare case” bunny.

She suddenly started to attack Owen through the bars and just keeps attacking him. Now she has a pen surrounded by another pen at 10 cm distance. They are still in the same room, because they both stopped eating when we moved Molly to the bedroom.

Molly also attacks us when we have to change her litter box etc. Painkillers don’t change her behaviour and she has no other signs of illness. We took her to the university veterinary hospital twice now, and it wasn’t an adrenal tumor or a botched spay.

We’re awaiting the results of the blood tests now. We’ve also been asked to participate in a scientific study because she’s such a rare case. They gave us some blood tests for free because they rarely get this much data from one rabbit. A lot of vets in training come to our appointments, because they want see how the doctor treats her and learn from the case.

At this point we just hope that they find some clue, because her behaviour is awful. I’ve worked with her so much over the last months, building trust and managing her anxiety. It feels like it’s all for naught.

To end on a happier note: Owen found out that cuddles are awesome! Sometimes he gets so happy when he’s petted that he takes a break to binky around the room, but he always comes back for more. It’s surprising that he’s so cuddly at such a young age, and he’s an absolute delight to watch when he’s binkying!

[LBJ10]

Ellie – Could the behavior be anxiety-related? Would she benefit from taking some melatonin? Or even wearing a thunder shirt? Well… if you could fashion one that small, that is.

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

Yes, it could be, she’s a very anxious rabbit in general.

If it’s caused by anxiety it’s odd that she suddenly switched her style though: she used to withdraw when scared. This lunging, boxing and scratching at everyone is definitely new.

We were aware that she has mood swings and that this makes bonding with Owen difficult. I just never thought that she’d attack us too. I though that we had built up quite a bond over the last cottons of months.

When you have to change her water dish or give her food she scratches at you and growls. It’s not a box & retreat either, she keeps going for you.

I’ve gotten some nasty scratches from her:

Those are some good suggestions, I’d asked the doctor about anxiety treatment, but he wants to go the medical way first.

We know that she hates to wear anything: she didn’t eat after her spay, and we found out that she just hated the medical shirt 🙄 After we took it off she was nose-first in the food bowl.

We are giving her valerian drops to help her relax. If she keeps lunging etc I’m going to ask the doctor about anxiety medication again.

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

She is doing better in the new setup with her little moat: Owen can’t get close to her, but she can see everything that happens.

I try to do a little relaxation ritual before bed: petting Owen and introducing him to being brushed/combed. He’s taking to it well.

Molly flops as close as she can get, and she starts to purr before he does. I talk to her too while I’m petting Owen. As a part of the ritual I’m offering her pettings as well after I’ve petted Owen.

Sometimes she lets me stroke her nose a couple of times and she licks my hand. Sometimes she lunges and scratches at me. Teens… 🤷‍♀️ Ah well, I just want to make sure that she doesn’t feel left out.

[Azerane]

I’m sorry to hear about Bun Jovi, hopefully some supplements can help set him on the right track.

Ellie, sorry to hear about Molly’s difficult behaviour, hopefully you can get to the bottom of it.

Weighed Luna again today and she seems to be holding steady,  2095g today, a change of only 5g from almost 2 weeks ago. I might try increasing her serving size a little.

Jasiri seems to be on the mend, she’s pooping less which is good and her last one was almost completely normal in consistency. I’m hoping for another two normal poops before she doesn’t have to be isolated anymore, she is getting a bit antsy, lol.

In other news, Apollo’s moult is something spectacular this year, he’s basically exploding. I brush him twice a day.

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

@Azerane: yes, the moult is really weird this year! Owen’s been moulting since July and he still has a hula skirt. He’s got that double thick Nethie fur, so it keeps on going.

 

On that note: I got my first licks from Owen today! I was petting him and gently scritching his bum where he’s moulting. His first lick was tentative, and when I praised him and scritched some more I got a whole barrage of licks! He actually sought out my hand, it wasn’t just reflex licking. 🥰🥲 I’m totally over the moon!

He’s getting more eager to interact with us, and he found out that I have all the time to pet him. He doesn’t like to be petted on the sofa or the bed yet, so I had to join him on the floor.

But… the first steps have been made: this one is going to be a massive cuddlebug! I’m so happy 🥲

[DanaNM]

Yay for Owen snuggles!!! I love when buns start coming out of their shell! Bonnie has decided she likes Tom now, probably because I always pick her up for nail trims etc, so he’s been referring to her as his girlfriend. 😆

So it turns out my vet has very likely given me the wrong panacur dose for Bun Jovi. So when I was dosing him myself from the paste I got at the feed shop, he was improving. Then when I switched to the pre-loaded syringes he got much worse…. and I finally got past my covid brain fog enough to confirm the concentration they gave me, and they did not put enough in the syringes. When I questioned them on it they doubled down that it was the correct dose. (For reference, they only gave me .2mL per syringe of the 10% panacur solution when the dose should be 20 mg/kg… at his weight that would be 0.36 mL).  UGH My pet sitter confirmed that the whole time I was gone Bun was doing fine with no major changes in his mobility. So I will definitely be going back on the dosage I had calculated, starting the whole panacur course over again, and finding a new vet!

 

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

@Dana WHAT??!! What a bunch of ***redacted***! They’ve gone through elementary school, so basic multiplication shouldn’t be an issue, one should hope. And you want to be sure, really sure, when you’re dosing medication. Even experienced nurses calculate twice.

This is just awful, I’m sorry that you had to meet such an awful vet. You should be able to trust them on these basic things, without checking their every step. Please don’t blame yourself.

I hope that this didn’t hurt dear old Bun, and I hope that he gets better with the proper dosage!

 

 

About Owen: yes it’s awesome that I’m getting the first signs of actually being bonded to him! He’s always been an extroverted bunny who loves to be petted, even by strangers. He’s the life of the party and the centre of attention, but he didn’t return affection until now. It’s that bond and reciprocity that I love about bunnies, so I’m really happy to see this in Owen now ^_^

[Azerane]

Luna’s a little champion, still putting on weight. She now weighs 2117g. Weighing over 2.1kg is inedible for her. New goal is 2.2kg now 😀

[DanaNM]

Way to go Luna!

Bun Jovi is doing surprisingly well too! He even hopped around the room last night! (?!) This little dude just continues to surprise me. A week ago I thought he would never be able to stand again… and now he’s hopping around…!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Ellie from The Netherlands]

Whoop, we’re piling up the good news here! I’m so happy to hear about Luna and Bun Jovi! Man, what a difference a different dosage can make…

 

More good news from this side: Molly is a bit calmer and hasn’t attacked us this week. And Owen finally decided to try sofa snuggles! (My knees and back are overjoyed…)

He isn’t very comfortable yet and sits on the other end of the sofa, but he’s trying out his options. Sometimes he lays down or wants a couple of pets from me. Sometimes he runs off as soon as I touch him, and sometimes he turns into a mop:

My goodness, he’s really early with snuggles like these… He’s barely a year old. Most dwarf rabbits would still be bouncing off the walls and only sit down to eat or poop. He’s exceptionally cuddly for his age, even if it only lasts for a couple of minutes.

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