Putting bunnies in their new cage?

[Hass]

Hey guys ! So this is my first post here and I was wondering if someone can help me out. I have 2 Netherland dwarfs, Luna (female, not spayed) and Ghost (male, fixed almost 4 weeks ago). I used to keep them on separate floors until I got Ghost fixed. They did meet a few times and Luna actually got pregnant once but unfortunately the babies did not make it. So when I got ghost fixed I moved his cage upstairs right next to Luna’s to get them used to each other and for him to have another bunny with him while recovering. I put a plastic divider between their cages (he loved to spray). A few days after the neuter the spraying stopped, so I removed the divider and they kinda kept sniffing each other through the cages but she bit him once, so I pulled their cages a few more inches apart. 2 weeks after his surgery, I tried to start bond them in the bath tub, but Luna absolutely hates the bathtub and just kept trying to get out. So instead, for the past 2 weeks, I have simply been letting them out of their cages together and have them just run around the room, which has been amazing. No fights, no grunts, nothing. They run around together, lay down next to each other (well she lays down and he just sits next to her, he doesn’t lay down much), and sometimes I put them food together which goes smooth. He grooms her a lot, she does not groom him at all, but anytime he runs towards her she immediately puts her head down for grooming. He has humped her but only a few times. She has not humped him at all. Their cages are open so they go in each others’ cages and hang around, together or alone. He likes to sniff and explore her cage while she likes to eat his hay lol. I can usually go around the house and leave them alone with no fighting or any other violence or tension, and when I come back and check on them sometimes their laying next to each other, sometimes they are not. But I have never found any fur or injuries or other signs of fighting. The only maybe negative thing I notice is that whenever he comes up behind her and sniffs her butt, she will move away from him. Idk if thats fine or not but apart from that they have been great, especially from all the horror stories I hear about bonding bunnies.

My question is is it a good time to move them in together to one cage? Neither have been territorial about their space and they seem to enjoy being together. I just don’t want to leave them together overnight and have them fight when I’m asleep. I have locked them in one cage a few times but not for long (like a half hour or so) with no problems. Is it time to take the next step and put them together? And is there anything specific that I should do to when I put them together to avoid taking a step back?

[sarahthegemini]

First and foremost, males can remain fertile upto 4 weeks post surgery…are you sure she isn’t pregnant?

[Hass]

I cant say 100% that she isn’t but she is most likely not pregnant. Last time she was I did not know she was pregnant until 6 bunnies popped out of her and that was a shocker. I just thought she was getting fat because she was not running around a lot and they had never been together outside their cages together. The only time I saw any humping from him was 9 days ago, about 3 weeks post op.

Would it affect their bond if she is ? Obviously I don’t want her to be but if she is how would that change things between them ?

[sarahthegemini]

Posted By Hass on 2/02/2017 1:33 PM

I cant say 100% that she isn’t but she is most likely not pregnant. Last time she was I did not know she was pregnant until 6 bunnies popped out of her and that was a shocker. I just thought she was getting fat because she was not running around a lot and they had never been together outside their cages together. The only time I saw any humping from him was 9 days ago, about 3 weeks post op.

Would it affect their bond if she is ? Obviously I don’t want her to be but if she is how would that change things between them ?

Well, you can’t really bond them because her hormones will be going crazy 

[tobyluv]

You cannot attempt bonding until your female has been spayed and recuperated. You should keep them apart until then.  Her normal hormones can bring aggression, which can mean fighting and injuries. If she did happen to be pregnant, her hormones would really be fluctuating, and she certainly shouldn’t be put with another rabbit. Besides being necessary for bonding, by spaying her, you will eliminate the possibility of uterine cancer, which is very high.

[sarahthegemini]

It’s worth mentioning that just because you’ve only seen him hump her once, doesn’t mean it’s only occurred once. You said yourself that you leave them unattended. She could very well be pregnant again. What makes you think it’s not likely?

[Hass]

While I do understand that, they have been basically hanging out together for at least 6 hours a day for the past 2 weeks. There has been absolutely no fighting or aggression from either of them (not even when I let them out the first time) and plenty of grooming (he loves grooming her) and lots of flopping next to each other (especially from her). Even when they go back to their separate cages, I usually find them on the same sides of their cages. I can leave them together in the room unsupervised and check on them when needed. During this time, again, there have been no fights or injuries as I usually find them cuddling together.

Would her being pregnant suddenly change this ? If she is pregnant, then she I want to get her spayed, but the cheapest place near me right now is asking for more than $300. As a student with a lot of extracurricular expenses at the moment, I cannot afford to get her spayed but will probably do so when I am able to financially. The neuter cost less and for him it was an absolute necessity since he was spraying everywhere and had absolutely no good litter habits whatsoever. I could not take him out of his cage since since he would go anywhere and everywhere (still haven’t had much luck with his litter training, she was very easy to litter train).

Here are a few pics of them hanging out (she’s the black otter, he’s the chinchilla)

[Vienna Blue in France]

From reading your post I think it’s now four weeks post neuter. Letting them out together should be done under strict supervision but do not leave them alone until they are fully bonded. Certainly do not shut them in a cage until they are fully bonded post her spay.
As Luna is not spayed her hormones can(will!) change quite quickly and she could become aggressive towards Ghost without you realising and start a bad fight and that would put any future bonding at risk.

Yes, some bonds are harder than others. But if you prevent them fighting now, your chances of an easy bond will be better later.

Certainly keep them nearby in their cages and let them freeroam seperately in the same space. It will get them used to each others presence and their smells.

Its probably not what you wanted to hear, but its advice to be taken seriously….

Please Keep in touch and let us know how you get on

[Hass]

It’s worth mentioning that just because you’ve only seen him hump her once, doesn’t mean it’s only occurred once. You said yourself that you leave them unattended. She could very well be pregnant again. What makes you think it’s not likely?

True. But when I did see him, I had not left them unsupervised before that. So when I did see see him, that was the first time he humped her. And he has not tried humping her since then when I am around. Yes, that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t do it when I am not. But if she is pregnant its most likely from that time, which was 9 days ago.
Again, I am not checking whether it is good to bond them or not. They’re already past that stage. I have seen absolutely no negative signs and only positive ones. I’m just not sure if putting them together is fine or not.

[Hass]

Thank You for the advice. Spaying her is not an option for a few months at least, for financial reasons. I understand that her hormones can change quickly, but would they change all of a sudden after 2 weeks of grooming, laying next to each other and basically free room time together with zero aggression? 

[sarahthegemini]

Posted By Hass on 2/02/2017 4:27 PM

It’s worth mentioning that just because you’ve only seen him hump her once, doesn’t mean it’s only occurred once. You said yourself that you leave them unattended. She could very well be pregnant again. What makes you think it’s not likely?

True. But when I did see him, I had not left them unsupervised before that. So when I did see see him, that was the first time he humped her. And he has not tried humping her since then when I am around. Yes, that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t do it when I am not. But if she is pregnant its most likely from that time, which was 9 days ago.
Again, I am not checking whether it is good to bond them or not. They’re already past that stage. I have seen absolutely no negative signs and only positive ones. I’m just not sure if putting them together is fine or not.

But you’re not past that stage yet because a bun full of hormones and a bun without can act very differently. She could snap at any moment. I know it’s not what you want to hear and she may not change at all, but the point is she could. 

Basically I think putting a neutered male and an unspayed female in a cage together is asking for trouble. Add to that a possibility of pregnancy. ..

[Hass]

So would keeping them in separate cages but plenty of supervised free roam time be the best option until I’m sure she’s not pregnant ? Spaying is just not an option for a few months until I can afford it.

[LittlePuffyTail]

That’s what I would do. Supervised together time and keep them in cages where they are still close and can see and smell each other.

[Author]

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