My adventures in independent rescue/outreach get harder — pics. caution.

[lazyhistoire]

This is really hard for me, guys.

I went to a local animal sanctuary (not rabbit specific) to volunteer and these people have NO IDEA what they are doing. I’m going to TRY to work with them – but geez man. I feel like I’m so glad I started doing SOMETHING in my area because this is what I found around here…. *sigh*

The rabbits are being housed … no wait, hoarded outdoors. One of them has head tilt that is not being treated. Another with a weepy eye, again not being treated.

These buns have urine scald all over their bodies – lack of litter boxes. Just hay everywhere – they go where they sleep.

Feeding time: A volunteer just dumps a bunch of food in a few different spots and the stronger buns get the food.

I brought them cilantro and parsley this morning and made sure everyone got at least a little bit.

This is the water supply:

I was crying the whole way home. A mix between that and wanting to hurl.

I even lifted up some wood panels and I found a litter of babies under there that are about 6 weeks old I think? They didn’t even KNOW about them AHHGHHH!!! 

 

[lazyhistoire]

I also wanted to add that I brought one of the babies home – the mom isn’t there..

It seemed to have wonky legs and needing veterinary care so I am taking him/her on tuesday for full bloodwork. If they find anything, I’ll know more about the rest of the litter too, hopefully. I’ll talk more with my vet about that.

This is Kramer:

We call him/her Cosmo right now because we don’t really know the sex.

His wonky sea legs are seeming to be a bit better – we even got a few binkies! So I’m hoping for good news at the vet.

 

[peppypoo]

WHAT?? How does that even qualify as an animal sanctuary? Are these rabbits fixed at all??  Also, head tilt can be contagious…did you let them know to separate that rabbit?

[lazyhistoire]

I DON’T KNOW!!!!! No, none of them are fixed and many need emergency medical care. I dont know what to do!! I tried to talk to her about it but she didn’t seem to know much. I’m sure she means well but GEEEEEZ…
when I asked about spay/neuter I got really shady answers from the owner and volunteers. They basically tell you yeah some are. There are over 50 though. They literally told me that they only separated the males and females, from what they think are… Idk how they know the difference if they don’t even realize how they are running a “sanctuary”, but that they “just keep having litters anyways!!”

My jaw nearly dropped. One of the babies was as old as Cosmo in the photos, maybe younger, but was missing streaks of fur. I wanted to take it to the vet ASAP but he’s with his momma. He looks really sick.

I’m going back this morning to bring the poor things some more cilantro and greens, and try to sit down with the owner about how the rabbits are cared for. However I don’t think it will do much…I will try to get some pics of the baby in need.

I just also want to add, this is how they are housing dogs and cats too. They’re all outdoors it just looks like animal hoarding…
They were smoking around the animals, there are cigarette butts, and they also even hinted that they might be smoking marijuana as they thought one of the dogs was stoned.

K, scuse me, I’m going to go hurl.

[lazyhistoire]

Oh yeah and one of the volunteers mentioned that they may get shut down (wonder why).
What will happen to all those buns?? To all the animals?

[lazyhistoire]

Didn’t see your part about head tilt, Pep, but of course I told them!! All of them, multiple times!!!
They said “no he’s fine! He’s so sweet! It’s name is Twist!”

Omg.

I’m crying again.

She started trying to talk to me about it though. The owner. Like I said I think she means well. I referred her to a vet that helped my sisters rabbit when it got tilt. We were scared but a year and a half later you can’t even tell she was ever sick.
All she said was no I took him there already. All the vets told me that it was bc he got dropped and they can’t fix it.
I explained to her how rabbits really get head tilt but she still didn’t seem to care much.

[Sarita]

I would see if HRRN has some advice for you since you are already in contact with them and see what they say.

I would also talk to a local Humane Society or SPCA to see if they have some advice.

[lazyhistoire]

Thank you Sarita.
I called HRRN already and they haven’t gotten back to me yet. I have another line to reach them where I will call today.
After I talk to the owner today and see if she’s willing or able to rehab the buns, I will probably have to call animal care services.

[brittbritt]

I really think animal services needs to be contacted. This is abuse especially if there are some with obvious medical needs.

[mocha200]

Its neglect! this is horrible! how can they even think that its ok!

[Monkeybun]

Did the owner talk to you yet? Whats the verdict, animal services coming in? These poor buns.. and other animals too, if they are being kept in the same conditions!

[Lintini]

Wow….that is terrible!

[lazyhistoire]

I spoke with the owner. She seemed quite taken aback, saying things like ‘oh my gosh, no one’s ever told me that. none of my rabbit vets ever told me that.’

The weird part is .. she mentioned she had talked to all these vets about it. I told her she needs to talk to a vet that is experienced specifically with rabbits. I told her who mine was and she said she had seen him and told her the same thing. There is no way that my vet would ever tell her anything like that.

The other vet she mentioned, is on the House Rabbit Society website. So this made me feel like it was mostly an act. I’m going to speak with both vets. I think she sort of knows that she isn’t doing things right.

Here’s the bun with tilt:

We talked for a little bit and I explained to her about how head tilt can be contagious but she just thinks that it was dropped on it’s head… uhh, okay? And I told her most of those rabbits have urine scald. She said she thought it was from the hay being wet. I told her she needed to house them indoors for starters, and they need to be using litterboxes. They also need to be seperated… they can’t keep having litters she doesn’t even know about! And sadly, I’m pretty sure one of them is pregnant again.

I gave them fresh water and herbs yesterday because no one else does anything for them .. there are loooooooots of flies around their cage. I tried to tell her about fly strike, too. Especially if they are living in wet hay, and most having urine scald.. ahhhhhhh

 

 

[MarkBun]

Contact animal services again immediately. This is NOT a rescue nor shelter. It is a hording/abuse situation.  It is people like this – who think they’re doing something good for the animals, that winds up causing such massive detriment and suffering for the animals.

If the animals are capable of reproducing freely, then they are NOT, I repeat NOT a licensed shelter or rescue. This is just someone who likes rabbits and collects them from other places. She thinks it’s better than having them euthanized but truthfully, in the long run, it isn’t.

[Helenor]

Oh goodness! I thought the yellowish color on the buns was natural until I looked again and realized it was urine. Poor things. I hope animal services will get them out of there soon.

[Sarita]

I suggest the vets as well. Vets are great witnesses when it comes to animal abuse and they want to help. They can help with statements to animal control, etc… as well.

[LoveChaCha]

Aw… this is sad Please call the animal controL.. this is.. no rabbit sanctuary :'(

[lazyhistoire]

I’ve been playing phone tag with 2 vets.
HRRN called me last night but I was downstairs doing laundry and missed her call and am playing phone tag there too. *sigh*

We will get this sorted out!!!

[Sarita]

Where is she claiming to get the rabbits from?

[lazyhistoire]

She wouldn’t tell me. I tried to ask about that, and the volunteers didn’t know either.
From what it looks like though, they just keep reproducing.

[Sarita]

That she won’t tell you where the rabbits come from (and she doesn’t have to be specific obviously) and she’s claiming to be a rescue does sound extremely suspect to me. Do you know how long she’s been a “rescue”? How did you find her?

Keep us updated – but don’t get to frustrated either.

[lazyhistoire]

She claims to be a sanctuary – I don’t think she rescues rabbits. I know she rescues dogs/cats and keeps them in similar conditions mostly. But if someone brought their rabbit or she found one, I’m sure she’d take it in.
I have no idea how long she’s been around but I found her on Petfinder.

I’m staying calm. Just trying to sort it all out and figure out the best way to professionally deal with this and stay level headed about it.
Trying not to get too emotional – it’s sad.

[lazyhistoire]

Update!!!!

I spoke to my contact at HRRN and sent them the photos. They are having a board meeting tonight and compiling an email to send to contacts in San Antonio and we are all going to pull together to try and help the buns.
I am going up there as often as possible to make sure they are being taken care of and they need to get healthy! My contact said I should do this as well. This is fantastic – hopefully we can make a real difference. I will keep everyone posted as we go.

[Tate]

Wow!!! What a sad situation but so amazing that you stepped up! Way to make things happen! Too many people would just feel like it’s “out of their hands”. You gave them a chance at life.

[lazyhistoire]

My contact just called – she contacted the board already and they are figuring things out.
She said that we may not be able to do anything.

Will have an update in about 30 minutes.

[mocha200]

crossing my fingers!

[Sam and Lady's Human]

How could they not do anything???

[peppypoo]

I’m holding my breath for you, hoping things turn out for the best .

Most cities have a limit on how many animals can be kept at a residence, with exceptions you need to apply for. If this “sanctuary” does have one of those exceptions, I’m pretty sure they’re violating all sorts of rules for it…I feel like there should at least be some way to get those animals out of there.

[lazyhistoire]

Okay, so I never got a call back tonight. Hopefully I’ll know something by the morning!

[Malp_15]

I don’t know if it is the same in your area, but here the SPCA needs to give 6 warnings before they can legally seize an animal. From my experience with rescues you need LOTS of documentation, so keep taking pictures! And if you don’t hear back from your contact in 24 hours contact all your local media. If they pic it up then you will have lots of people standing behind you to push it.

[Sarita]

Well, OneTwoThree, legally they cannot do anything. They may not have the resources either to help but maybe they can offer some advice or make some phone calls…sometimes that’s the best you can hope for.

[lazyhistoire]

Hey everyone, I’m still corresponding with HRRN.
I talked with one of the mentioned vets and she did take animals in to him, but he wasn’t able to tell me if they were rabbits. He did imply though, that they were not and told me he did disagree with the way she runs things. He cannot assist with low cost or no cost spay and neuter.

I will look into the local laws after work today. We want to try and help them first, though.

[lazyhistoire]

Hey everyone
I haven’t gotten much movement on this process. Just giving a quick update.
My sole resource from Austin tried to come through for me but basically are saying well, you can’t do much.
So, I’m coming down to making an animal abuse report tomorrow.
I hope this is the right thing to do. I feel very strange about this but these bunnies need to be safely housed indoors.
I am going to actively stay on top of this now that my work schedule has calmed down.

I will keep everyone posted.

PS – Peppy, was hoping to see you yesterday at the annual cleaning! Oh well, another time!

[peppypoo]

Sorry to hear that things aren’t moving along as fast as you would like . Still wishing you good luck with the situation.

I would have gone to the cleaning yesterday, except that it was the one weekend I needed to be out of town. Too bad it didn’t work out!

[lazyhistoire]

Malp,
Can you please elaborate on your comment about contacting local media?

[Monkeybun]

Sometimes local news stations and papers are quick to pick up an animal neglect case if its brought to them. It often spurs a response when other things don’t.

[lazyhistoire]

I’ve started to contact media and animal control.

[lazyhistoire]

Thanks Lesley.
This is a hard thing to do but someone has to and I will see this through.

[lazyhistoire]

I just dropped a megaton bomb of emails on ALL the local newspapers, news stations, and radio.

[lazyhistoire]

One of top local news stations has already emailed me and told me they are going to help!!!!!!

[lazyhistoire]

Hey everyone,
Just spoke with the reporter from the news station. We agreed that this needed to be taken care of.
They will be going out there tomorrow….. I’ll be there too feeding the poor buns.
I will let everyone know.

[peppypoo]

Wow, tha’ts great! Maybe you could also talk to them to see if you can get a blurb in about how rabbits are NOT low-maintenance fluffy little cute things, and that it’s exactly that kind of thinking that leads to situations like this.

[LoveChaCha]

Posted By lazyhistoire on 05/15/2011 05:46 PM
Hey everyone,
Just spoke with the reporter from the news station. We agreed that this needed to be taken care of.
They will be going out there tomorrow….. I’ll be there too feeding the poor buns.
I will let everyone know.

 

Good for you I wish I could help. I am glad that this is being bought to the attention of the public. Let us know how it goes tomorrow.

[Malp_15]

lazyhistoire I’m so sorry I totally lost this thread and just saw your question

but you basically did what I had in mind anyway The only thing I was going to say was that if you didn’t get contacted after the email to follow up with a phone call, but that is GREAT that they got back to you right away!!!

you’re doing a great job! Give us the link to the article when it comes out, I definately want to see it!

[Monkeybun]

Posted By peppypoo on 05/15/2011 06:22 PM
Wow, tha’ts great! Maybe you could also talk to them to see if you can get a blurb in about how rabbits are NOT low-maintenance fluffy little cute things, and that it’s exactly that kind of thinking that leads to situations like this.

 

Yes, definitely mention that buns aren’t a “Get ’em and forget ’em” kind of pet. Theya re more like cats and dogs than a hamster, but not as snuggly and willing to be carried around as most cats and dogs either. Silly buns being all complicated..

[lazyhistoire]

Thanks for the support guys! I’m working around with local contacts as well. I’ve read some awful reviews online about this place too so I know this is right. Thank you all! I will def keep you updated on what happens.

As for getting a blurb in, I’m going to try. Although I’m trying to remain anonymous in this whole thing because the owner’s kinda REALLY mean… and.. yeah..

I’ll be there working with the bunnies so maybe I can use that to get in a blurb

[lazyhistoire]

OOh and also, I’ve started talking with the Bunderground Railroad about this already and we are going to try to activate on this but the bunnies have to be seized first – legality issues

[lazyhistoire]

I have them cornered on every front.
I’ve contacted a cruelty officer, they are going on to check on the situation and so is animal control. I am in touch with 3 local news stations, one of which is interviewing me tonight. About to call a 4th that asked me to call them.
I’ve been out there all day in the hot sun shoveling up the urine soaked hay and they were so happy to get fresh hay and water
I will bring these animals justice!!

Someone here in SA mentioned to me that it may just be a person who likes animals and/or a hoarder and just using this for tax breaks. She has a LOT of negative reviews on her shelter and one of the news stations I spoke with said they’d already had calls on them before.

[lazyhistoire]

Oh and. I think we lost a few buns.
The baby in the photo without hair passed. I asked if there were any others and they wouldn’t tell me.

[lazyhistoire]

But there were a lot fewer bunnies this time ’round..

[lazyhistoire]

AAHGGHHH GUYS!!!!!!!!

The girl I’ve been corresponding with who has been helping me out through this just emailed me this:

Omg you’re not going to believe this: First, I just called them (our local humane society) and they said because they’re a shelter they can’t do much of anything. The girl just told me to call the city facility. Now get this: in doing the search, it led me back to the ASPCA website and that sanctuary is on the list of contacts!

[LoveChaCha]

Tax breaks, sounds about right :/

What the? The ‘sanctuary’ is on the list of contacts? *insert angry face here*

I’m so sad that the bunny passed

[Malp_15]

oh wow, I would definitely share that with the newspapers! I would also write a letter to the ASPCA showing your concern and forward your pictures. You could also make a facebook group and share it with everyone. Maybe even post about it on craigslist and other sites like it? I was thinking to about going to your local vets and talking to them about it? Vets are regularly asking the SPCA to follow up on animals that come into clinics, so maybe some of them will help you? The more people that call the SPCA and humane societys about abuse, the more likely they will act on it.

I don’t know you, but I’m really proud of you I wish I lived closer to you so I could help Definitely let me know if there is anything I can help with online or something.

[LoveChaCha]

I would join the facebook page.. and pass it on. There was a zoo in Canada that has animals in bad conditions and SOMEONE posted pictures of it on facebook and it got around and caused quite a stir with the public.

[Malp_15]

yeah, its in Toronto

[lazyhistoire]

I already have a FB page and a blog on this particular shelter
Though I didn’t name it

http://www.facebook.com/pages/SA-Rabbit-Rescue/103532039735522

and this is the blog:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/SA-Rabbit-Rescue/103532039735522

[lazyhistoire]

I’ll try newspapers I guess … though I got a call from an officer yesterday telling me if I don’t stop they are going to file lawsuit against me. FOR WHAT? I don’t know, harassment apparently, but they can’t because I didn’t harass them.

I’m disappointed in the newscast – it’s in spanish and I don’t know if anyone can understand it but basically, they didn’t even talk about the rabbits. The only thing mentioned was that I work with them. I talked with them on camera for about 10-15 minutes and they used 5 seconds of a clip.

I don’t know how these people are getting by.
Here’s the newscast

http://univision41.univision.com/noticias/video/2011-05-16/denuncia-contra-refugio-de-animales

[lazyhistoire]

Oops let me repost the FB. you can find the blog on that page.

SA Rabbit Rescue

Promote Your Page Too

[lazyhistoire]

:'(

I did the blurb and everything. I was trying to get across a message that this can happen, that rabbits aren’t like “livestock” they are indoor animals, and they need help. I was hoping for help.

[Sarita]

Unfortunately I think you are seeing the limitations and frustration you will have as a (rabbit) rescuer. There will be some things you can effectively change though and this may still be a victory for you and the rabbits still but it just may be later rather than sooner.

[lazyhistoire]

They were bathed with puppy shampoo before I got there yesterday and cleaned the entire pen for them… there were a lot less … I think more than just that baby died. Maybe some got away. I would run away too…

*sigh*

[LittlePuffyTail]

This is so very sad. I’m just getting caught up with your thread now. It’s awful how in the US and Canada, neglect is not enough to remove animals from a person. They have to physically inflict pain for it to be cruelty. Things need to change. Many sanctuaries end up like this unfortunately. It’s not a sanctuary to just throw food at them and let them fend for themselves.   The picture of all the bunnies in a circling trying to get food really bothered me.

Don’t give up! I know it’s frustrating but with regards to animals one person can really make a difference. Bless your heart for all you have done.

[lazyhistoire]

What do I do?

[Sarita]

Well rabbits are classified unfortunately in most states as livestock.

I think at this point, you need to just take a step back and assess the situation and realize at this particular point in time you may not be able to do anything since you are not getting anywhere with the authorities who have the legal authority you do not.

Your only other option is to try and help the rescue by educating them and helping with their rabbits.

[lynnbunn]

Oh my goodness. I read your adventure and I cried.
This is horrible.

All the luck and good wishes possible. :’)
Poor bunns.

[Lintini]

Wow …I was so happy on page 2 and now I get to page 4 and I feel like I was punched in the stomach several times. I cannot believe they have the link to her “sanctuary” on the ASPCA webpage. Thank you for being so brave and trying to help the buns though. We all appreciate it.

[jerseygirl]

Ugh! I’ve only just read this thread. These situations are so complicated! I admire what you are doing lazyhistoire. Takes guts to go up against something like this. Bureacracy and BS can get in the way. What about contacting some out of state rescues and find out what they’ve done in the past? Find out what the steps were to get real action to come about. Have you sought out past volunteers at this “sanctuary”? They could have been wanting to take action but didn’t know how to go about it. It could be good to gather more witnesses and work as a group.

ETA: That baby without the fur….it looks very much like a congenital condition. The survival rates aren’t very good I’m afraid. I think it occurs when there’s inbreeding.   It’s sad that one was born in such a place and lived such a little life. Too much about all this is sad.

[stinkybinky]

Aww this makes me feel a heavy weight on my chest. Maybe you can take more photos, videos, and try to speak to those who are really concerned about rabbits in the rabbit sanctuary business and try to get a support group to do something. Show them evidence of what’s going on, send it to the newspapers…try to put pressure. ? If you decide to create a petition in your town (I definitely will try to sign though I don’t know if it’ll make a difference but lots of numbers will help bring the cause to attention?), that’d be good…to improve living conditions, try to get a grant from the city..I don’t know It looks like a horrible place for rabbits. The newspaper contact you are doing sounds like a good path! Create bad publicity to put pressure How many rabbits are there currently?? I know rabbit shelters seem to be packed or do not have enough resources?

[Beka27]

What I don’t understand: Rescues, shelters, and sanctuaries must provide vet care for their animals. The vet care has to result in TREATMENT. If treatment isn’t possible, the animals need to be humanely euthanized. And rescues, shelters, and sanctuaries should not have animals reproducing under any circumstances. At that point, they cease to be a rescue and become a breeder, whether the breeding is “intentional” or not. It’s obvious that the vast majority of those rabbits are related. If you have 20, 30, 40 rabbits that LOOK THE SAME… they are NOT independent rescues.

I cannot believe that the local authorities won’t do anything about this. This is like all of those “hoarder” shows, and worse. I’m not sure if you’ve seen those types of programs; in many of the cases, the people are “rescuing” animals, but they are taking too many in (too quickly) to spay/neuter, and then they are reproducing too fast to spay/neuter.

What other rescues/organizations have you contacted? Have you contacted any of the rescues that have been involved with some of the larger animal seizures around the country (I think there was just one in New Mexico if I remember correctly?) Maybe you need to go further out than “local”. Have you contacted PETA and sent the pictures to them?

[stinkybinky]

That’s a good point Beka27..I never thought about that, the rabbits so LOOK exactly the same. They all happen to be white rabbits. While hoarders ‘love’ what they hoard, they are not mentally stable to care for them in the right way. -_-

[Nova]

This is really easy to sum tup: Animal hoarding resulting in neglect

Animal control should be contacted…. Not sure what country you are from but in the US there is the US Department of Agriculture and each State has the dept. as well. They would be on that really quickly.

[BunnyDuck]

I just read through all of this and I think that I found their website based on the information in this thread. This is some statements they have on there website for you to be kept up to date..

“UPDATE 1/2/2012
Happy New Year Yes, we are still here. And, yes, we still have about 36 dogs that need to be placed. Thanks to fellow rescues and community, we no longer have any cats. Please come by the shelter any day of the week between Noon and 3:00pm if you are looking to adopt or foster a dog. Time is of the essense.

UPDATE 11/30/11
In reference to Mr Conger, of KENS5, article today: Though Animal Friends is losing its physical location we still will still be working with our foster homes and actively looking for adopters for those foster pets needing permanent placement. We do not want our foster homes and volunteers to feel abandon, we are just at a different phase of our rescue mission. Animal Friends has removed all of the roadblocks and wishes to continue forward through this transition. There are still so many little faces out there that need our help.Fostering can be very rewarding, if interested see our Volunteer/Foster page and contact us via email or call.Thank you for your continued support.

UPDATE 11/15/11:
Animal Friends is under new management and though we are losing our physcial location we will still have animals in foster homes that will need to find their permanent home.

There have been several allegations made against our shelter the past few month, none of which have proven to be true. We have had authorities from Bexar County and the City of San Antonio come out to our shelter and all have reported our shelter to be up to code. Despite our eviction date of December 5th, Animal Friends will continue its mission of helping homeless animals and move forward. Our new management structure has nothing to do with these allegations and all to do with helping the animals find homes. If anyone has room in their home to foster or adopt please contact us immediately. “

[Sarita]

Please read this thread in regards to responding to old posts…thank you.  The post is pinned in the Lounge section.

https://www.binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/a…fault.aspx

[Author]

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