Luna & Dash – advice please!

[MamatoLush]

Hey! I am really sorry for the longggg post. Just looking for some advice/clarification on a few (or a lot of) things.

Luna is 11 months old, spayed in January. Soooo gentle and calm. Never had any aggression from her. Very very chilled out, our Lazy Luna. Quite a nervous bun (obviously they all are to some extent but her more than average). Dash is 1, neutered in March. Equally as gentle, no aggression from him, either. He’s our Detective Dash though, he is everywhere lol. He’s like a hyper toddler and it’s hilarious. Luna has been with us since October. Dash only came in April so we are still really getting to know him and him, us.

Luna had free roam of the house and would peek in other rooms but had the living room very much as her territory before Dashy’s arrival. Initially, I had them side by side, Luna in her usual cage that is used for toilet/food/etc and Dash in a pen. I made 2 errors. I went to bed thinking all would be well as it was double fenced. Dash being new, I didn’t realise he was an expert jumper as Luna doesn’t jump at all really. I woke up to Luna in her cage and Dash running around the living room (Luna’s living room 😂) living his best life. My second error was that I wanted to combat the obvious jealousy she’d have been feeling so put Dash back in his pen and let Luna have some free roam time in the same room. She made a beeline for him and there was a little bit of aggressive behaviour shown at the bars but she stopped as soon as I made movement. I felt very nervous so from then we kept the door shut and let her continue with the living room and let him have the hallway and my daughters room. I then swapped their toys and things for a few days and then let them swap rooms on trial. Neither showed any signs of stress. Flops from both etc. I got past my nerves and did a first introduction in neutral ground (my bedroom), they ignored each other for a bit, then lots of nipping from Luna. Rabbit researcher me said “that’s fine”. Panicky bun mum me said “IS THAT A NIP OR A BITE? WHAT DO I DO?”. And then I realised.. my nerves would affect them and this was best left to the professionals.

So fast forward.. they went to a rescue for bonding on the 12th. The rescue kept saying that they were a “slow” bond but by night 2 they were in together all night and had no bad behaviour. Day 3 they started to groom each other. From then on, they spent 24/7 together and were perfectly behaved for the next 8 days. On leaving they were in a 8×8 space. I collected them yesterday morning and set them up in a 3×2 in the kitchen. Again, they have been perfectly behaved. Usual bonding behaviour (I think).. Dash mounted Luna once or twice so obviously trying to sort out the hierarchy again. A few times I’ve seen them nose to nose, both with lowered heads and both being stubborn so I’ve been doing lots of bunny magic. They’re eating together, cuddling up, Dash is laying on Luna and she’s happy with it, we’ve had flops from both, Dashy is mirroring Luna lots and watching over her while she sleeps, mutual grooming etc. Just all the positive signs you’d hope to see. I literally slept on the kitchen floor last night to keep an eye and they were just cuddled up all night.

So my questions are, and I’m sorry there’s lots of them….. 

1. Should I be separating them at night?
2. CAN I separate them at night? I’m a bit lost on when it would be seen as them being too far into the bond to be separated or if it’s ok to separate until they’re living completely freely together?
3. When can I assume they’re fully bonded?
4. When can I assume it’s safe to expand the space they’re currently in?
5. I have white vinegared the living room to within an inch of its life but am worried about the carpets/sofas.. How do you neutralise fabric?
6. How risky would it be to put them in a pen in the living room now? We will obviously do what we’ve gotta do if it’s safer not to but it’s really hard to supervise 24/7 etc with them in the kitchen. They’re spending all their time trying to get out which I feel may delay them being focussed on each other? And honestly, I just miss them lol ☹️
7. Kinda going back to question 2… Tomorrow is the one day that nobody is home to supervise. I assume I need to split them up before we go out all day and have them in separate rooms? But just wanting confirmation that this won’t harm the progress we’ve made?

Again, I am so sorry for the length of this.
Any additional tips please throw them at me.
Just want the best for my babies and feeling unsure.

Pictures are of them in the last 24 hours since coming home 🥰
Thank you!!!

 

 

 

[Wick & Fable]

If you are unsure and cannot supervise at night, I don’t see it being bond-impairing to have them separated by a pen wall perhaps. I have two -somewhat- bonded rabbits who free-roam together, but at night when things seem a bit tense, they share a divided x-pen.

You can never be sure about expansion until you try. I would say they should be able to get along with no problems for at least 24-48hrs within a certain space before expanding. If you get feedback they aren’t ready, that’s OK– back it up and try again later and expand the window to 3-4 days of no problems perhaps.

I honestly wouldn’t put much more effort in trying to deodorize and neutralize everything because rabbit noses are so much better than ours… your rabbit is going to know that was originally their territory and free-roam space. Do the best you are willing to do. If any covers can be washed, that’d be fine, but ultimately there are likely scents and also the general visual that your rabbit will pick up that cannot be erased by human cleaning.

For trying in the living room, you could try, but I would recommend waiting until there are definitely no problems in the current kitchen space. With technology though, if you have a laptop or live with someone with another phone or something, you can set up a Zoom/Google Meet/video call with a device that’s spying on your rabbits. I actually have done this with my two -somewhat- bonded rabbits. They go to the bathroom in a pen and I set up my laptop on the counter so I can watch them from my phone wherever I go.

For leaving them, yes, you want them separate. They don’t need to be in separate rooms. If you’re worried about them harming each other through a single grid wall, you can put 6in of space in between them. I think it’s important that they still be able to see and smell each other from now on.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[DanaNM]

So, I’m a little confused by the timeline. Let me just clarify, so they spent 8 days at the bonders and were perfectly behaved? Then came home, and haven’t fought or had any aggression? They are eating together, cuddling and grooming? Does either bunny seem tense or nervous around the other?

To me that sounds bonded! If they’ve been together 24 hours with supervision and you haven’t had any fights (AFTER spending over a week together with great behaviors), personally I would not separate them and I would feel OK with leaving them home unsupervised, BUT I would leave them in the current space they are in. The fact that they cuddled up all night in a brand new space (and a less neutral one at that) to me is a sign they are bonded and you prob don’t need to worry so much.

Mounting is normal in bonded pairs. As long as you aren’t seeing aggression or it turning into a scuffle then I think they sound fine. At this point, if you feel you need to separate them, I would not put them in separate rooms. I would do side by side pens, and you prob don’t even need to worry about extra barriers etc. To me they sound bonded and putting them in separate rooms would be distressing to them and could affect their bond.

Going nose to nose a lot is also normal, I would try not to intervene so much and see what happens. My pairs will often smoosh their faces together and just fall asleep like that (not every request has to be met!).

I would wait till you have the weekend to supervise to move them to their permanent home. I usually clean and rearrange the pen, wipe with vinegar, remove old toys and hides, and give a brand new litter box. I wouldn’t worry about the sofas etc.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[MamatoLush]

Thank you for your replies!

Yes, exactly. Since the 14th they’ve been together 24/7 and there has been 0 bad behaviour. They’re totally relaxed with each other.

I too felt as though it seems they’re bonded and that separating would harm that. The volunteers at the rescue were pretty confident that they’d made firm friends and would be fine. I’m on bonding groups on Facebook though and they advised that I should be supervising 24/7 still at this stage so I felt really unsure and started doubting my judgment lol.

I went out for a few hours on Saturday and Sunday and again, they were absolutely fine. Came home to them loafing side by side. I’m about to leave for work and Dash is flopped and Luna is grooming him.

Feeling reassured, thank you! ♥️

[DanaNM]

That’s great, I really think you are in the clear with how long they’ve been together at the bonders and they way you are describing them. If you had just started marathoning I would def give a different answer. 🙂

I also have found that problems tend to occur at night, when the buns are active, so I usually feel better about leaving buns unsupervised during the day when I know they will be sleepy.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[MamatoLush]

We got home at 6 after 11.5 hours and they were cuddled up asleep ♥️

[SweetPotato]

OMG they make such a cute pair! Both are absolutely stunning ❤️ Bunny bonds are probably the cutest thing there is on Earth (other than the buns themselves ;))

[DanaNM]

Awww I love that! Yay for cuddly buns!!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

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