Karl and “post-stress syndrome”

[Karla]

Karl is not coping very well with the loss of Jack. Anyone here with a good suggestion on what I can do, and well, a good guess on how long it should take for him to deal with it?

The situation now:

Karl is very nervous. If I walk around too fast, make a noise or  just get near him at certain times, he freaks out and runs around in panic and hides from me. I even caught him stress-humping Molly today. At the same time, he is actually much more interested in pets…I just need to do it at the right time without freaking him out.

Molly and him have been inseperable since Friday noon. They snuggle all the time and have become attached to the hip.

Karl reacting to Jack

I put Jack on the floor, and Molly went straight over to him and groomed him. Karl was obviously frightened and hid behind some boxes. He wouldn’t go near Jack until I stroked and kissed Jack, and then he slowly approached. After that, they both groomed him for about two hours and snuggled up against him. I know I was told to not remove him before they would ignore him, but I just really wanted to bury him, so I did remove him at this point. Perhaps it was wrong of me?

I just gave Karl some Bach’s Rescue Remedy (the one with alcohol…not sure if that is okay?!!) to calm him down, but I can’t really be giving him that every day. So what else? I give them their treat ball with pellets to calm them down as well.

[Sarita]

Hopefully since he has Molly he will heal faster. The Rescue Remedy is fine.

I’m not entirely sure that treats are calming – not that you should stop giving them treats, I just don’t think they will have a calming effect but I think the attention and the treat are positives for them.

I think petting when it’s the right time for him and continuing to encourage him to snuggle with Molly will help.

Vibes to Karl and to Molly too.

[Barbie]

Oh I’m sorry Karl is having such a hard time with this! While I’ve never had a situation in which I had to help a grieving rabbit, I suspect that Karl is just taking it harder than Molly. Was he closer to Jack than Molly was? Anyway, everyone (animals included) go through the grieving process at their own speed. I think what you’re doing right now, just trying to give him pets when he wants them and giving him toys and distractions is good. Make sure you keep them on a regular schedule for feeding/play time – I would think that especially during this, a consistent routine would be reassuring. And having Molly around him is probably helping too.

I wouldn’t advise using the Rescue Remedy on a regular basis… I’ve never used it before, so I don’t know if it’s habit forming, but you definitely don’t want him to have to rely on that to get through the day, and I would guess that the alcohol isn’t good for him.

(((((((HUGS to you and Karl and Molly and your partner!))))))))))))))

 

ETA: Just saw Sarita’s post about the Rescue Remedy… Like I said, I’ve never used it before, so if other people recommend it, then I’d listen to them, lol.

[Andi]

It may take a couple days, I found with my guys having another bunny buddy seemed to make things easier, When PitStop had only me after Ebony died (he never got to see her body) he was very attached to me.

I had a cat however, when his sister got outside and was killed he at first didn’t seem to do anything, but after a couple days he would start crying at cupbords (he thought she may be inside, she liked hiding in them), stoped eating, got really dirty, would get lost in the house ect. I actually got the name of a pet Psychic, and everything changed. She did memory imprinting and told us as nice as out cat was he wasn’t to bright, his sister sorta told him were and when to eat, and groomed him, when she left he didn’t know how to do those things on his own. After our session a couple weeks later we had a totally differnt cat, no longer affraid of new people, he was friendlier, healthier and cleaner.
I was desperate, and not a realy believer in some things, but this experiance changed that.

Hopefully this is just some mourning from loosing his friend, and that in a bit he will be back to himself.

[Karla]

Okay, glad to hear that I can use the Rescue Remedy (I gave him 4 drops and he is sleeping now), and Barbie, glad you remind me of the routines, because I have to admit that last night I didn’t let them in the bunny room/office for the night, but let them have free run, so if they needed to be near us they could go into the bedroom…but they didn’t exactly seem calm this morning. So, back to routines!

It’s not that Molly is not reacting. She freaked out Friday evening by running around and thumping and it was impossible to get near her. She was completely out of it. And she is very skittish too now, but not nearly as much as Karl is. So, Karl is my main concern. Molly is a strong-willed girl and she will be fine, but Karl is easily stressed out.

This is another reason for why I will definitely have a trio again someday…they really do not cope well with the loss of a buddy, so I can only imagine what it must be like for a pair.

Other tips are welcome!

[Karla]

Posted By Andi on 04/20/2010 10:17 AM
It may take a couple days, I found with my guys having another bunny buddy seemed to make things easier, When PitStop had only me after Ebony died (he never got to see her body) he was very attached to me.

I had a cat however, when his sister got outside and was killed he at first didn’t seem to do anything, but after a couple days he would start crying at cupbords (he thought she may be inside, she liked hiding in them), stoped eating, got really dirty, would get lost in the house ect. I actually got the name of a pet Psychic, and everything changed. She did memory imprinting and told us as nice as out cat was he wasn’t to bright, his sister sorta told him were and when to eat, and groomed him, when she left he didn’t know how to do those things on his own. After our session a couple weeks later we had a totally differnt cat, no longer affraid of new people, he was friendlier, healthier and cleaner.
I was desperate, and not a realy believer in some things, but this experiance changed that.

Hopefully this is just some mourning from loosing his friend, and that in a bit he will be back to himself.

What a sad story about your cat.

Well, now that you are talking about such things, I came to think that you can buy some kind of scents to calm down dogs and cats…not exactly a psychic, but an alternative method as well. Perhaps there is something like that as well for rabbits?

[Sarita]

You mean like aromatherapy for rabbits?

[Karla]

Yes. It is called Feliway for cats and dogs, if you know it? It is some kind of device you plug in, I think.

But I just remembered someone in here saying that whenever she used scented lights, her rabbits’ litter habits were immaculate. So, I think it might be an idea to use a scent of some kind? Not sure what though…

[Sarita]

I would imagine soothing or relaxing scents like lavender (if you can tolerate this) would be fine. It certainly couldn’t hurt.

I use a wickless type candle thing for scents when I’m home because I like scents – not sure though if it relaxes my rabbits.

[Karla]

Lavender aromatherapy might be an idea! I think I will go get some kind of aromatherapy thing tomorrow from the Body Shop.

[LittlePuffyTail]

I feel so bad for your little buns. That’s so sad when they lose a buddy. They are lucky to still have each other at least. Sending Vibes your way that they will be back to themselves very soon.

I had previously done some research RE: aromatherapy for horses and read that Lavender is calming and will soothe and nurture a frazzled horse. Since bunnies are very similar to horses I figure it may help. Good luck if you try it.

[BB Administrator]

OOPS!  I’m in admin mode!    This is BINKYBUNNY. 

 

I’m so sorry Karla. It’s painful to go through this and watch your bunnies go through stress of loss. Since Karl wouldn’t go near Jack until he was encouraged – He may have already known. I wonder if there is a scent or something? The way your bunnies are reacting may not mean you took Jack away too soon. It may be that they are aware and are beginning the “coping” process now. Coping may be stressful. They’re managing this loss through thumping and fear. They may realize that their buddy is gone, and that may heighten their prey instincts.

Bringing the body to the bunnies won’t eliminate their grieving and stress, but the idea is it will help them understand there is a loss and get through it, otherwise, some bunnies will continue to look and wait, get depressed. (just prolongs the painful process).

So it actually sounds like they are aware of Jack’s loss and so now is the time to help them through it. Amazingly, some bunnies get over it very quickly, while others go through what you are seeing. My Jack also was unhappy for the first couple of weeks — and wouldn’t even eat unless I hung out with him and pet him for a while, then he would get up and get food. But other than that, he would leave his food plate full.

Jack was alone so it’s good your other two have each other to lean on, but you can still a play a big part in their comfort.

Here are my suggestions:

1. Keep everything as predictable as possible right now. Clean at the same time, Feed at the same time, etc, etc.

2. Spend more time with them petting them or just hanging out with them so they can once again associate you with something “safe and good”.

3. Watch their poos and eating habits carefully just to make sure they are at least eating and not suffering from any gi issues due to stress.

4. This won’t be forever, but they will eventually get back to more of a “norm”. It’s just something they will have to get through.  So just try to be as relaxed as possible about their own coping methods (unless they show health problems) and your being relaxed may help them.  Amazing how animals can be sensitive to our stress too. 

It took Jack about 2 weeks to get back to normal and eat without me sitting near him.

Hugs to you and your fuzzy crew.

Helloworld!!

[Sarita]

I agree with BB that some rabbits definitely are more sensitive than others. Toffee did not miss a beat when Twizzler was gone – I was ready for the worst but she was fine. Maybe the male rabbits are just more sensitive to loss of a mate.

[MimzMum]

I can’t tell you how this grieves my heart to see how hard Karl is taking this. And I’m sure Molly is too, it just shows differently.
Of course, how we are handling things like this will affect our furbabies too. It is something I’ve noticed with my cats, they have been pretty much all over me sine Shadow passed away, and at times it becomes a bit of a nuisance…but I realize they are only trying to let me know they are there for me and it does bring comfort, having those extra furry bodies around. The more time I spend with them, the more they heal me.
There’s no denying it, bunnies take it especially hard when a beloved dies…part of my worry with bonding my three…I know that if I lose one, the other two will probably become closer…but what happens when I am down to one? (I am not sure I plan on ever getting more bunnies, much as I ooo and ahhh over new ones here.) And yet, they all know each other is there, so I assume they would miss one even without being all in one space, like bonded bunnies.
Things like this can sometimes cause a bunny to pine to it’s own death…however, they can be incredibly resilient as well, and bounce back, especially if they still have a companion left. It just takes some time.
I would echo the other thoughts here, watching the routines and being sure there is no change in eating or bowel habits is key. Rabbits are creatures of habit, and structure is a mainstay for them.

[KatnipCrzy]

Unfortunately I am pretty sure that they do not make a phermone treatment for bunnies like the Feliway or DAP (or dogs).  But like others have mentioned I know that lavender is supposed to help soothe.  A greyhound I petsit for- I mist his comforter in his cage lightly with lavender water before he goes in when I leave the house.

The Rescue Remedy is fine to use as you did- though not sure that any more than 2 drops will do much- I thought that I read that the maximum dosage is what works and anything over that shows no additional effect.  And it is fine that you used the RR with alcohol.  Since it is a flower essence/homepathic remedy I wonder if there is lavendar in there?  But even though it is not addicting I think that Karl will just need to learn to adjust without continual dosing of RR.  It is nice that he has Molly to help him and they can comfort each other.

I am very sorry about the loss of Jack and I hope both you and your bunnies soon remember the happy times with Jack more than the sadness that you feel now.

Julie

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