Ive got me a biter

[Ang]

Moreland has a huge rabbitude! he is a biter i say no and press his head down to the ground and he comes rightback at me. today he bit at me four times and then finally got me in the thigh.  i dont know what to do at this point.  he is very shy/ skiddish and is a biter.  i am willing to work with him and i am not sure if its because he is back in the bedroom by himself instead of out in the main areas of the house.  i like that he has his own room and was wondering if i should put his x pen up in the living room and bring him out daily via carrier and have him be in a localized place. i have had him for two months now, he has came a long way but i dont like his biting. 

 

 

[bunnytowne]

Hmm neuter time.  Does he bite you when you stick your hand in his cage?  OR anytime he feels like biting you?  Some rabbits will just bounce right back up and bite you again. You can try holding him down longer.  Or… holding your hand above his head so he can’t bite you while with your other hand do what you need to do.  Holding Cotton down didn’t work good.  When he bit me I would put him back in his cage for a little bit. He seemed to understand that and stopped biting. Also I would say NO when he started to come at me.

Anyone else have any ideas?

[Ang]

Thanks BT he is nuetered. its not just in his cage its in his x pen and area around him. he growls and comes at me. i say no and me putting him in his cage yeah right. lol he hated being picked up. hes just a feisty terd.

[Balefulregards]

While I am NO expert, I think More socialization can not hurt. Even if he can hang out and observe you in the x-pen- watch, smell, listen – I have to believe it is a good thing and will help him feel less skittish.

[Ang]

I am working on the socialization. I do not know what to do anymore. this morning i was in his room giving him his hay and pets as i was about to leave i was walking out he lunged at me and ran after me growling. he is always growling at me and being extreamly aggressive lately then nice the next minute. i dont know what to do? i am seriously confused!

[Beka27]

this is tough.  how much research have you done on the aggression topic?  here are a couple articles (the HRS one is a new one since i last scoured the site and talks mostly about aggression after spay/neuter).

http://www.rabbit.org/faq/sections/aggression.html   HRS- FAQ: Aggression

http://www.rabbitnetwork.org/articles/agressive.shtml  HRN

here are my thoughts, i’m just typing them out as i think ’em, so sorry if it seems rambling: 

i think Moreland is very intelligent and i think he *might not* be getting enough interaction from you.  how much time per day are you spending with him in his room?  exercise time needs to be more than space to run and play, it needs to be about socialization as well.  i know it SUCKS b/c he is being aggressive so it’s making you want to be with him less, not more.  but this can really set the tone for his life with you.  you need to be dominant.  you need to force yourself to spend more time with him, even if it’s not physical contact.  talking to him is important.  he needs to be able to see and observe you, and learn you are not a threat.  that being said, you might want to consider moving him into a more central family location, at least for awhile.  his own room is nice b/c he has space, but it’s isolating him.  that might not be as big of a deal if he had a bonded mate, but the fact that he’s a sinlge bun makes me think this is not an ideal location for him.  it sounds like he is being territorial of the whole room, everytime you walk in, you are in “his Cage”, so i think limiting his area might fix this.  a smaller space to be territorial of will transfer that power back to you.  it is your decision if he comes out to play, not his.  can you put an xpen in the living or family room, wherever you spend the most time?  not just during the day, but permanently?  i think i remember you saying the aggression really got bad after he was moved to the other room…

also, a routine might help… feeding at the same time, cleaning at the same time, out of pen playtime consistently.  aim to do everything within the same 10 or 15 minute timeframe everyday.  use code words.  when you feed any food (pellets, hay, veggies) say “dinnertime” or “num-nums” or whatever you want to let Moreland know that it’s time to eat.  at playtime, “wanna come out?” or “out?”

i think this could actually turn into a big bonding situation for you.  are these some things you think you can do, or no?  please respond back, i want to hear your thoughts on this, what you think might or might not work…

[kralspace]

Hi Angelina,

I think Beka may be right, my dedicated nipper is the one bun out of the 6 that demands much more attention than the others. She’s a white rex, Lola and our schedule revolves around her. As soon as I get up and go in the kitchen to fix my hot tea, she’s hanging over the condo side giving me major stiink eye and thumps until I feed and pet her a bit. Nobody else is even stirring.

As soon as I get home, IT’S TIME TO LET HER OUT, NOW! She has lost quite a bit of weight because she’s always, I mean always on the move from room to room. She’s not really destructive, just active. I have bunny boxes with hay and toys in every room (in the corners where they like to try and pee-mark) and she runs from one to the other.

She loves to binky in front of the other condos and start a ruckus. After making sure all is right with the house, she begins following me around like a puppy, if I stop to do something, she keeps moving making wide circles around me until I start walking again. Open the fridge, she’s there, sit on the couch, she’s there. She’s not that demanding of physical attention, like holding (God no!) or petting beyond a nose rub, but she does want to be involved with you.

Or maybe she’s just the nosey neighbor who wants to spy on everything I’m doing?!

[Ang]

Beka, that is a great idea. I thought of moving him out of the room and mulled it over but some people disagreed however im not sure if i explained what is happening properly. I am definately moving him this weekend at least untill we get our bonding process down. sometimes hes good sometimes he is bad its purely strange to me at least, im new at all this. I do agree with him not getting enough attention. i do go in there but lately have been busy. it would be much easier if he was centralized where we are at all times. i will try these suggestions and try and work through them. i love him to death already but hes very agressive. i usually doge the bites and push his head down but he got me good yesterday and today he was just raging at me. literally like a little attack rabbit. i do have a routine with his feedings. i need to work on his socialization routines etc.

[Ang]

kralspace – i can just picture lola following you around! that is so adorible. at this point if moreland follows me i freak out because its always associated with mMmMm ankles!

[Beka27]

it doesn’t hurt to try and see what happens. keep posting on how things go with him (even if you just keep updating this same thread). these tough situations, while FRUSTRATING for the person involved) are a great learning opportunity for others who might be going thru something similar.

[Lightchick]

Do you have a water spray bottle? Can you try spraying him when he attacks your ankles as self-defense? (I’m imagining you doing a sort-of sad dance to get away from your raging rabbit…which would be funny, until you accidentally stepped on him trying to get away…)

Also, I saw a British how-to-tame-your-vicious-pets show once (and I actually read about the same topic in a rabbit book, as well), and this British family had this ENORMOUS lop who lived outside in the backyard (I know we don’t approve of outside buns, but it was seriously dog-sized, and cruising the backyard!), and the lop would ATTACK all the members of the family with the exception of one, whenever they walked out the door. They seriously stopped going in their own backyard. One of the trainers’ suggestions was to wear high boots to go in the backyard so the rabbit couldn’t actually get flesh, and to absolutely NOT flinch when the rabbit attacked. Obviously, when the aggression was met with fear, it only got worse as the rabbit decided it was the boss. (She also suggested more socialization with the family, as well!)

Lizzy used to lunge when I’d reach in her hutch, and she did get better, I think because of a combination of factors. But the fact that I stopped tolerating her aggression definitely helped. She HATED me at first, when she started getting a face-full of water everytime she growled, but now she’s a much more pleasant bun… And she no longer minds me in her space at all.

I also did the limiting-of-her-space trick, and it seemed to work with Lizzy, as well. And now that she’s not psycho-attack bunny, I’ve re-expanded her space, with no ill-effect.

[Balefulregards]

I wonder if he lunges because he doesn’t want you to leave? I know it is counter intuitive, but some times when Coco is seriously pissy, she wants MORE attention – and I lay on the floor and adore her properly.

I did notice when school went back in session and I was gone more that she was more aggressive – but I do think it was because she went from LOTS of attention from me to me being gone 75% more.

When I taught preschool, my rule of thumb was that the kids being super rotten actually wanted MORE attention, and would do anything to get it – even if it was negative.

 

And as an aside, I also have used the water bottle to give Coco a squirt when she is being particularly rotten. And now I only have to say “No” in the firm voice and she gives me the foot flick as she beats it out of the area. But the water bottle remains in the room – just in case.

[MooBunnay]

Angelina – do you find if Moreland nips at you more or less depending on if you have just spent time with your other rabbits? I had a friend who had one insanely jealous rabbit – I mean, if she even wore a T-Shirt that smelled like a bunny that her bunny didn’t “recognize” she could get some real nips and bites. Perhaps Moreland is just really bonded to you and is very jealous?

I also have a bunny that will dig at my feet as I leave the room, and I find that he just usually wants me to give him a treat before I leave- then if I give him one he will just dig at my feet again.

[Liza]

Oh my… believe it or not, our Velvet used to be just like your Moreland. While she would leave my husband alone and actually liked him a lot, she would charge at me, she couldn’t even stand it when I entered the dining room (where her x pen is set up). That’s the reason she came to us. Euthanasia would have been the other way out of the shelter. Since we are experienced with aggressive rats, we decided to foster her (she is ours now, we adopted her). I knew how aggressive she was when we took her in. My husband was the only one who could approach her, which of course made him feel like a million dollars! All that bunny attention!
Anyway, what I did was put her x pen in the dining room and I covered it so she could relax and have her own space. Whenever I opened the x pen, I would not enter it (that was like suicide because she would charge like crazy!). I put the babygate up so she had limited access to the kitchen and dining room only. I would fiddle around in the kitchen and ignore her until curiosity got the best of her. Each time she was nice and came to see me in the kitchen, I would give her a little something (a tiny piece of carrot, a blueberry, a papaya cube, parsley…). The next step was I sat down on the floor in the dining room and pretty much ignored her – until she could come and investigate me on her own terms.

Velvet is not a complete lovebug who also has a sweet bunny boy for companionship. Velvet is a highly social rabbit (she loves all rabbits and many people), she is super intelligent (we have her boyfriend Dancer as comparison… he is not the brightest light out there… poor boy) and just wanted to have more positive attention at all times.

I strongly believe in Moreland and in the bond you two have. Patience and perseverance can turn this boy around!!!

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

Keep us posted! Sounds like you have lots of great suggestions to try out

[Ang]

le update!

so my baby bunns is a happier bun well so far

this last weekend he was out in the living room after us coaxing him out of his hutch and chasin him out of his room. once he was out there we let him hang out and he was a binkyin boy. He was a lot more nicer and had no growls/ lunges. We did this again yesterday. What i think his problem is that he was not getting enough face time, and the time he was getting was freaking him out. When he is lunging and being agressive is when im petting him and go to leave. I still dont know if i should kick him out of his room and move him to a more central location? or if i should just pull him out every day?

i dont mind bringing him out everyday but its a task to get him out. i have to literally shoo him out of his cage, then he runs to one spot corner him then shoo him down the hall. Picking him up at this point is out of the question because he always jumps and i dont want him to get hurt.

any suggestions on wrangling my little turkey would be much appreciated!

[MarkBun]

Open the door to the cage then just walk out of the room. Turn on the TV and just wait. He’ll come. Buns are too curious not to eventually come out and see what’s up.

If you need to, you can use X-pens to make a corral chute for him to follow from his cage to the living room.

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

One addition.

Open the door, drop some raisins on the ground, then walk away and watch TV He’ll definitely come out LOL

[Lightchick]

I agree with Markus and K&K…if you have to haul/shoo/chase him out of his domain, you’re just helping to reinforce that “humans are mean!” Best to not force him…

[Ang]

this weekend we tried letting moreland do the free range thing in the living room with x pens set up of course in areas buns not allowed. he did very well friday night and saturday night we left him there again last night as well asss drum roll! today so lets see if hes good. he gets checked on at lunch. he is doing much better and becoming a more social bun. i think the own room thing was not good for him in this case because he wasnt getting the face time he needed. we are on a slow track to becomming 100% free range and a happy bun at that. i havent been bit for days! wahoo!

i appreciate all of the feedback from everyone. now im a little bummed i bought a hutch for him because he never uses it anymore!! we may dissasemble it and store it for later possible future bun or just put it out so he can go in it if he wants. but who would when you got the whole house!

[Beka27]

can he get in and out of the hutch by himself? i have found that it’s still a good idea to have a “bunny only” space for them, you can put a litterbox in there, blankets if he likes blankets, some water and food. you might need to confine him at times if you have company over, you are cleaning, or working on something in an area he can get to easily. if he is mostly in the living room now (which is great!) can the hutch be moved somewhere in the living room so he can have access to it if he wants?

i’m glad he’s doing better. i know you were doing what you felt was the best thing for him by giving him his own room, biut everybun is different, what works for one might not work for another. it might have been a different situation if he had a bonded mate, but for now, it sounds like you are on the right track.

[Lightchick]

I agree with Beka…mine aren’t free range, but they LOVE their hutch! They go into it on their own to hang out, even if the pen door is open, sometimes.

Congratulations on a non-biting bun! That’s awesome! (He’s SOOO pretty! He looks like TuckerBunz’ Tucker…)

[Author]

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