Is trancing or hypnotising a bunny…safe??

[The Rabbit]

I’ve just finished watching a bunch of videos where people lay their bunny on his back and he’ll lay still, so you can clip his nails and such. It seems like it would be painful and scary. I’d try it with my Bun, but it doesn’t seem safe. If the bun is rigid, won’t he be frightened and possibly harmed?

 

has anyone done this?

[Karla]

I’ve done it a few times, and I know it is very common to do it.

HOWEVER, I am very much against it. It is not painful, and some bunnies I have been told actually purr, while it is going on, but to most bunnies, I believe it is a scary experience. It is a violation of the bunny, if you ask me. Although it is relaxed and keeping still, it is still scared and uncomfortable with it all – it knows what it is going on, but is unable to move.

We did it the first few times for nail clipping until we found another way to hold the bunnies.

[Monkeybun]

Monkey is good with it at the RA outreaches we do, and she has no problems flipping over now and then. She’s a wiggle monkey So she isn’t completely immobilized at all! Moose is such a laid back guy, he just relaxes and lets the world go by. hehe

[Elrohwen]

I think it’s fine. Personally, I don’t feel it’s any more stressful than regular picking up and holding, so if it keeps a bunny still and lets you get done with nail trims faster, then it’s a good thing. I wouldn’t do it all the time or just for fun, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using it as a handling tool.

[Andi]

Someone posted this link in a previous thread – http://www.hopperhome.com/Trancing%…ity%20.pdf

I posted it for the girls I volunteer with to read over and give some information. I’ve asked for premision to copy and paste the discussion.

— It’s associated with the prey response.
When we do it, we aren’t doing it for fun and we don’t promote people doing it, especially if they don’t know how to handle a bunny due to the risk of them breaking their backs.

Remember when you troll the web, you have to take what you read with a grain of salt cause it causes alot of fear mongering.

Most of the rabbits never go into a trace….where their motor systems are inhibited…..the rabbits can still resist and they do. How many have you seen in a panic state after a nail trim??

I don’t have time to read thru it now but one has to closely look at the physiological responses they are talking about and make sure that aren’t just taking one result and running with it as being reflective of everything. —

—-Ok – quickly skimmed thru it

1) first they talk of TI as suggesting owners use it as an enjoyable bonding pratice – which clearly it is not – rabbits don’t like to be held period…..so it’s is not something any good bunny owner would do for *enjoyment*.

2) how can they tell the increase in HR & BP is not from being handled period….not being tranced but just being *picked up*

3) there are only 6 subjects….sample is too small…..you can’t get data from 6 subjects.

4) are these lab rabbits who are rarely handled or socialized or pet rabbits with owners used to being handled? Lops seem to be more relaxed or trance easier than NZ whites do and the study is on NZ whites (some only in the system for 2 weeks)

5) they state that some trance easier than others and struggled more than others….stress of being handled and the struggle alone would increase any rabbits HR & BP…..or any mammal. Changes in HR & BP occurs with changes of body positioning.

6) I don’t think they can have a good baseline (when a rabbit socialized or not), will have an increase in HR and thus BP, just from the fact that they are being picked up period.

7) they also are referring more to a full TI, which in all the rabbits I have worked with have never seen or had one go into a full TI.

8) is cortisol production increased soley by stress or other things as well (time of day, amount of sleep, body weight, genetics etc)

9) do rabbits perceive humans as predators in the same way they would a coyote or raccoon? Would the cortisol response be the same or different depending on the preditor? Perhaps the cortisol response is perfectly normal for them as in an increased heart rate etc…..things that are not normal for people. What is the normal range – that wasn’t shown anywhere.

We would need to know what an acceptable coritsol range is for rabbits…..for example, we know humans have a HR between 60-100 bpm which is considered a normal range….whereas rabbits naturally have HR’s much, much higher and but yet are completely within normal physiological ranges for rabbits.

Anyways, too many holes, sample size is too small and they cannot control their baseline data….. —-

—another point.

Say you have a rabbit that is fearful of being held and getting a nail trim.

Measure the response of the scared rabbit, struggling against you while you struggle to trim its nails in an upright position.

Now try it with the same rabbit while it is on it’s back (held securely)…less struggle, less movement.

I would say the first would have a higher HR response or they’d at least be the same for the same scared rabbit.

Additionally,
CO= HRxSV

so if Cardiac Output (CO) decreases due to recumbancy or what have you, then HR (heart rate) has to increase as well to maintain SV (stroke volume) & thus CO.

Change of posture, increased sympathetic nervous system activity, and decreased parasympathetic nervous system activity can also increase cardiac output. A change in CO obviously then has an affect on BP. —

—I was curious as to how fast blood concentrations of cortisol levels change….I don’t think it would be immediate as it’s not a hormone but a steroid (I think)….anyways….I was thinking about something like that….if blood level concentrations take a while to increase, than perhaps increased cortisol levels only occur under *chronic prolonged stress* vs a temporary trance of 2 minutes or less. —

—OK…..so it is a class of steroid hormones that are produced in the adrenal cortex.
Corticosteroids are involved in a wide range of physiologic systems such as stress response, immune response and regulation of inflammation, carbohydrate metabolism, protein catabolism, blood electrolyte levels, and behavior.

The amount of cortisol hormone present in the blood undergoes diurnal variation, with the highest levels present in the early morning (approximately 8am), and the lowest levels present around 12-4am, or 3–5 hours after the onset of sleep. Information about the light/dark cycle is transmitted from the retina to the paired suprachiasmatic nuclei in the hypothalamus. The pattern is not present at birth (estimates of when it starts vary from two weeks to 9 months).

Changed patterns of serum cortisol levels have been observed in connection with abnormal ACTH levels, clinical depression, psychological stress, and such physiological stressors as hypoglycemia, illness, fever, trauma, surgery, fear, pain, physical exertion or extremes of temperature.

There is also significant individual variation, although a given person tends to have consistent rhythms.

So overall, I think with rabbits (a *high* prey animal), perhaps their level of stress is constant yet normal for them, so maybe increased cortisol lelvels may be normal….but again, I think alot goes towards the environment and handling they experience (ie in a home with an owner or in a lab, never handled) —

Anyways, I found it very interesting, other things mentioned was ‘Bunny death Flop” when they are happy, and feeding their young. Both are similar positions.

I’ve never had a bunny be in fear after I flip them for a nail trim etc. And if I flip them, they will fight/move if they don’t want to be, so obviously not panic stricken, specially if they take treats afterwards greedily. Stressed animals don’t eat.
I like the fact she mention what kind of rabbits was this tested on, happy house bunnies or meat rabbits? I see a Big difference on how they are handled.

My Rex was the only bunny I would not flip, it did upset him to much. I don’t agree that this procedure is wrong, but i do believe it’s the owners responcibility to make sure the rabbit is safe during this, and it be used not for ‘enjoyment’ but for procedures such as nail clipping.

 

[BinkyBunny]

Though it can be useful for things that may be necessary when all else fails, trancing is not something I would encourage for bonding and cuddling with your rabbit. It is a prey response — like playing dead, and of course they are doing that in hopes of “escaping”. Sometimes you’ll see a bunny “pop” out of it, sort of jerk up. That’s all part of that prey escape response which is meant to fool a prey into thinking it’s given up so the predator will let loose it’s grip and the bunny can jerk up and escape. People can misinterpret that as “relaxed”. Also, what can go with the trancing (or anytime a bunny is stressed) is immediate shedding. (this can happen at the vets too) I asked the vet about this and she said it’s another prey response. IF their hair can easily come out, the predator may lose it’s grip. So during stress, shedding can go into overdrive even if a bunny is not molting.

okay, so I gave way more detail. Bottomline: Avoid trancing unless you absolutely have to.

[Author]

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