I am a sucker. *Edit Again: Already Fretting

[TARM]

http://www.petfinder.com/petdetail/15645921?recno=7

So.  A few weeks ago this REW bunny came in to Bunny Lu.  He’s such a sweet boy and he’s young, but as we all know, the REW’s are hard to place.  Bunny Lu has a few of them that have been there for quite  a long time.

Trouble is a very social bunny boy.  Almost like a puppy!  You can’t walk by his cage without him sticking his nose out of one of the squares to be rubbed.

When I was at Bunny Lu on Saturday I noticed he’s starting to react negatively to shelter stress.  He’s lost some weight and when I opened his cage for pets (we have a little ritual) he was actually skittish and ran from me!   Of course I got worried and pushed away ideas of fostering him.

It just so happens that I brought Zinnia with me to take a picture for our website.  She was being so good (she always is but she was way more relaxed than normal)!  So I thought I’d put Trouble in a pen with her and see what happened.  She boxed at every other bunny I ever tried to introduce her to and I expected the same thing to happen…but she put her head down and asked to be groomed!  Poor Trouble has no clue about how to treat women so he didn’t groom her.  He tried to hump her instead, which she put up with, much to my amazement.  She did finally get tired of that and I got tired of sitting in the pen and pushing him off of her so I gave them both a break.  I’d say in all we did about 3 hours of “getting to know each other” before it was time for me to leave for the day.

I had no intention of taking him home.  I told myself that unless they hit it off like Digger and Marshmallow did he was staying at Bunny Lu.  But my mouth had different ideas and without even thinking about it I asked Mary Ellen if Trouble could come visit me for a week.  So he’s at my house, in a pen attached to Zinnia’s cage. 

Bonding efforts did not go well yesterday.  Fur flew and poor Troubs broke a toenail and it bled.  He has a red smudge above his right eye that I couldn’t get all the way off. 

I’m going to work with them some more this week.  It’s very interesting to sit in a pen and have two bunnies compete for my attention.  Zinnia crawls in my lap and reaches up to snuggle her head on my shoulder.  Troubs stands with his front paws on my leg and stares me in the eye until I give him lots of pets.

Keep your fingers crossed for us that those two get along.  The only way I can keep him is if he and Zinnia bond.  The only reason I’m considering it is because I have one cage with a single bunny.  This will bring me up to four pairs of rabbits and I can’t have any more.  If Zinni is destined to be a single bunny it will just about kill me to say goodby to Troubs. 

All bonding vibes are welcome and appreciated!

[Barbie]

Hehehe, you are a sucker But I can’t blame you! I like the REWs, and with a personality like that, how could you say no!? Hopefully Zinnia and Trouble will bond and then you can keep him! Leroy and Jeannie have their ears crossed, and my fingers are crossed for them!

[Barbie]

Btw, nice picture!

[MirBear]

aweeee

[Deleted User]

They will make a striking pair!

[TARM]

I know. I just keep thinking “OMG I have 8 rabbits”. But really, every rabbit person I know in real life has between 6 and 10 so….

[Deleted User]

No, you will have 4 pairs. 1 pair is like 1 rabbit. Don’t ever say 8.
when people say I have a lot of animals I tell them I only have 1 pair of dogs and 1 quartet of bunnies.

[MirBear]

lol! it makes it sound like you have so many less animals

[TARM]

Ha, good one Petzy…

[Deleted User]

What’s this bunny quilt behind you in the photo? It’s nice.

[TARM]

The rescue has a volunteer who makes gorgeous quilts and tote bags and stuff like that. She made a bunch of them and if you donate a certain dollar amount to the rescue you get a quilt as a thank you gift. They’re decorative, they aren’t very big, but they are beautiful.

[Deleted User]

That’s a good idea. These quilts probably fetch a nice $.

[Monkeybun]

i vaguely remember somebunny saying she was done after she got her flemmie.. no more bunnies… wonder who said that…hehehehe

[jerseygirl]

Mary Ellen must LOVE you!

[TARM]

She does…lol  But she might dislike me at the end of the week.  Bonding is not going well. 

When I try to coax Zinni out of her cage to play with Troubs she retreats to her litter box.

When I pull her out and try to make them sit next to each other Troubs hauls butt to HIS litter box.

When I bribe them with scattered oats between the two cages they sniff noses for 5 seconds before they both stomp their feet and run in the other direction.

I thought it would be much easier than this but clearly I’m going to have to employ the bathtub.  Or the washer.  Or the car.  I’m not going to try to force it any more tonight.  I’m very disappointed though. 

[Kiley Rose]

Is he a flemmie too?

[jerseygirl]

oh…look at her ears there as he’s checking out her cage! You can always do something simple like swap cages or even just their litter boxes for tonight.

[TARM]

I think she’s afraid of him. Her ears are always down and back, his are always up and forward. And she’s usually the one who runs from him.

EDITED TO ADD:

Mary Ellen thinks he’s a NZ White.  I don’t know why she thinks that vs. FL White…but I’m going with it.

[Deleted User]

Posted By TARM on 03/15/2010 06:49 PM

I think she’s afraid of him. Her ears are always down and back, his are always up and forward. And she’s usually the one who runs from him.

But this is a good thing! The worst bonding scene is an aggressive large female meeting a bossy male. Zinnia might like a set-up where she can outrun him. Some pairings bond by ‘running it off’ — even if she gets mad at him for trying to hump, it is a good match by the sounds of it. Have some confined, boxed, sessions with these two first for scent transfers and then move to a bigger place with you in it armed with gloves and handbroom. My Mops was terrified of Lint, Lint very ‘forward’ with him. They bonded in a race so to speak

[TARM]

When they met on Saturday she kept putting her head down asking to be groomed and he had no clue what she was asking for. (He’s young, he ain’t got no game with the wimmin yet). But now…they just avoid. Ugh. I don’t usually adopt a mate unless they hit it off fantastically on the first date. I’m a very lazy bonder.

So Petzy thinks it’s a good match? I bow down to your experience.

[jerseygirl]

Maybe employ the L-shape bonding pen. https://www.binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/a…fault.aspx

btw, bonding {{{vibees}}}

[TARM]

There is no way I could leave my princes in a pen with a humpy boy.

[jerseygirl]

lol
Mmmm…am I sensing a tad of emotional involvement?!

[Deleted User]

Give it seven days, one session per day, to see improvement. If the only trouble is Trouble’s inexperience, it’s no biggie. Cluelessness is better than hostility.

Have you had many of those instant bonds? I feel that the more Zinnia settles in with you, in your home, the less likely she will accept another bun.

[TARM]

Every match I make at the rescue is pretty much an instant bond. I’m good at seeing who will go well together. When adopters get home it only takes a couple of days for the bond to cement.

Zinni didn’t like ANYONE I put in the pen with her. I was resigned to the fact that she would be an only bunny and I was OK with that until I wanted Trouble. She reacted to him better than any other bunny so I decided to give it a shot. This is more of a want on my end than hers…which I know rarely works. :0(

And yes. Emotional involvement.

[jerseygirl]

which I know rarely works. :0(

No, I don’t agree… It can work, just may take some time…

Your super lucky to have witnessed so many instant bonds. That’s a neat gift to have!

[Deleted User]

OK. That’s the magic touch. Picking out two bunnies and call it a bond to send them home just to cement! Wow. I have none of that. My bonds were a grind. LOL.

[TARM]

Yeah but I’m not much help to people when they have issues…lol

When people come in and let their bunny pick I ask questions about the general behavior of the rabbit and/or what their previous mate was like if they had one who passed away. Then I try to find the closest bunny to that. There’s only been twice when the bunny I selected wasn’t having it.

[MimzMum]

I’m thinking to encourage the grooming…a little banana on Zinnie’s nose? If you think it’s safe and Trouble won’t nip her there.

[TARM]

At this point I don’t think Zinni would sit still for him to lick it off. He’s nipped her a few times while humping her and I think she doesn’t trust him with those teeth.

[Deleted User]

I am always surprised to read about other people’s bonding sessions with grooms happening so early on. I didn’t see grooms with any of mine pretty much until cementing.
The niping during humping is pretty instinctive, not like a bad nip, you know. Zinnia might be in a state of shock over all this and only start defending herself later on. But even if this is why she lets him, it still familiarizes them with each other.
How is your place TARM for neutral zones? Has Zinnia been everywhere?

[TARM]

We have plenty of neutral zones. The problem is that I only have one pen and Trouble is living in it…lol But I have enough grids to build a PetzyCube so I will do that tonight and they can ride on the washing machine. The laundry area is right outside of my bedroom door so I can park my desk chair in the doorway and play around online while the buns are stressing together.

They did awesome on the car ride home from Bunny Lu. It’s about a 50 minute drive.

[Deleted User]

You can just use a small room for sessions, too.
I think Trouble picked himself the perfect home… who named him that anyways?

[TARM]

He came into rescue with that name. I told him it’s an Oxymoron…lol

[Deleted User]

Aha, right.

[TARM]

I will take pictures of the buns in the PetzyCube. (I might even reccommend them to people when they call in with bonding problems and call it that…Petzy, you better patent that…lol) I’m hoping for a good bonding session.

[Deleted User]

Posted By TARM on 03/16/2010 10:51 AM
  (…)the PetzyCube. (I might even reccommend them to people when they call in with bonding problems and call it that…Petzy, you better patent that…lol)

 

I don’t have a business, a patent nor do I have insurance… I cannot be responsible for what happens inside a cube… can we just call it the bonding cube?

[TARM]

Ha, you don’t have to have a business to be an inventor…muahahaha!

[Deleted User]

I can just see it: me at the patent office trying to sell that thing, explaining its purpose… arguing the market base… LOL

patent office clerk: “so this is for rabbits?”
me:”yes, for bonding rabbits”
patent office clerk:”what is bonding?”
me:”it’s when you put two rabbits together to get along”
patent office clerk, laughing: “oh yeah, I know that! ‘get along’, eh?”
me: “no! bonding involves only altered rabbits.”
patent office clerk: “so why do they have to get along, for what?”
me: “so that they can live together, groomingly”
patent office clerk: “you are wasting my time”
me: “but people want rabbits to get along!”
patent office clerk: “there is a line-up, you know. You need to get along, as in ‘leave’.”

[TARM]

I did not build a PetzyCube.  I was lazy and I put them in a carrier instead. It was disasterous.

First I stalked my unsuspecting prey.

Then I set the carrier down in Trouble’s pen.  Trouble says “Wuz dis?”

Diz nawt PetzyCube.  Must be OK.

Zinnia sez “Wut?”

“Lady, stop flashing dat thingy at me, can’t yoo see I iz playin wif my rattle???”

“O look!  Mean bunny lockd up! Neener!”

“Wait, how dis happenz?”

“O noez!  Big puppy owtside!  Mean bunny inside! Halp!”

“Whew, puppy gone,..UH OH!  Bumpy ride with mean bunny!  Halp Halp!”

“I iz telling you now, all hell going to break loose in 30 seconds.”

And then they started fighting inside the carrier and almost fell off of the dryer.  I pulled Trouble out, he was on his back hanging on to Zinni with his teeth!  Zinni was crying and scared out of her mind!

This is not going to be an easy bond. 

 EDITED TO ADD: They were in the carrier for about 3 minutes.  I put them back in their enclosures and swapped their litter boxes.  I’ll build the cube tonight and try them in it tomorrow.  My preshus baybee is way too traumatized to try again tonight.

[Deleted User]

I for one enjoyed your session! LOL! I like this way of reporting!
well. I will have to agree with Troubs, ‘diz nawt PetzyCube’ — I have used carriers with similar results, i.e. fighting. You just can’t get to them fast enough and they are too hidden. Seriously give the cube a try. It will go better. You can leave it open and have your hand in with them.

[TARM]

Hey, how did you bond your quartet? I know you didn’t cram 4 rabbits in a cube…

[Deleted User]

Bonding groups is the same as bonding pairs, just many pairs. I paired up Neigey, my new bun, with each one of my trio until they had a peace deal going, then I cemented all four together.

https://www.binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/a…fault.aspx

[TARM]

And they won’t fight in there? Do you know what the difference is between the cubes and the carrier that keeps them from fighting?

 

I built my cube last night…

[Deleted User]

In the beginning, they will nip and try to chase in a tiny circle inside the cube, but because of the dimensions of the cube this is hard to do. You must push down the head of the nipper and calm down the other by stroking. They quickly learn that the cube is a place to just stay put. Once they do, you close the lid but you can quickly get to them if they nip. I believe that the carriers have more of a hide-out atmosphere, plus, most buns have been in one before and the rabbits tend to act territorially in them. The cube is just such a weird place for them, and it allows more effective exposure to stressors due to the square openings. I have used a blow-drier on an aggressive rabbit in the cube for example, just on low setting, and it stopped the nipping. You can use the squirt bottle also, or let Jezebel sniff at them, if you are looking for stressors.

[TARM]

Ha, yeah, Jezebel. Trouble just greets her nose to nose like “O Hai!”

[Deleted User]

If Jezebel knows not to hurt bunnies, why don’t you take advantage: open the lid and let her sniff at them. It may be a good distraction. My dog Enzo has helped me during bonding tremendously.

[TARM]

Oh, she would like to eat the bunnies. She was licking Trouble through the pen and Trouble let her. He obviously didn’t know she was tasting him…lol

[Deleted User]

Oh she wants to eat them? I see… Trouble is one silly bunny to trust a rabbit-eating pooch!

[TARM]

She’s very prey drivey. She’d chase a leaf blowing across the yard if it caught her eye. She’s getting better with the bunnies but I have the room they’re in blocked off so she can only get to them when I’m in there with her.

I’m not sure if she’d actually hurt a bunny or if she just wants to chase it. My ferrets have gotten out a couple of times and she didn’t touch them, she just ran around alerting me to the fact that “something was amiss and I must go check it out now”. Ferrets hide in tight spaces and one of them was in my daughter’s closet mixed in with all the shoes. Jezzy dug the ferret out and then pointed at it with her nose and I picked it up.

Regardless, I don’t take chances with the dog and the bunnies.

[Deleted User]

Jezebel looks like such fun. It’s a pity they introduced the BSL all over. I used to have an APBT. I had to get 2 dogs twice her size to replace her when she passed. I love this video from youtube. Just love it. Goes to show it’s all in the upbringing.

 

[Barbie]

I love that dog!! This is one of my faves…

[Deleted User]

Aren’t they the best?

[MirBear]

i love pitbulls. they are my favorite breed. to bad its against the law to own one here

[Deleted User]

I lived in Ft. Erie ON when I had mine. People that got theirs after the legislation took effect really had to give them up, put them to sleep.
I moved away and was happy because she didn’t need to wear a muzzle any longer in public… but she was old and died soon after.

[TARM]

I love that dog. And Pit Bulls are my passion. I know, hard to believe since I only have one of those and I have 7 rabbits.

I tried the PetzyCube. It was not good. I think they hate each other. They fought viciously. Both of them, not just one. They even tried to fight when I pushed down on their heads. I couldn’t move my hands to pet them, I had to pin them like that. Every time I let go they sunk their teeth into each other. These were not nips. They were ripping mouthfuls of fur out of each other. This is Zinnia’s home and it’s not fair to keep subjecting her to this just because I want to keep Trouble.

I’m going to have to take Trouble back to Bunny Lu. I’m so sad about that because I have fallen in love with him but I don’t have room for another single rabbit. I guess I will make it my mission to find him a good home.

[Deleted User]

I’m sorry to hear it didn’t work out TARM! But since you come across many rabbits at the rescue, you might find Zinnia an instant match one day.

[TARM]

Zinnia doesn’t want a friend. I wanted Trouble. This was completely my doing. I just have to not get attached to any more bunnies.  Thanks for all of your advice Petzy.  I really appreciate it.

[Deleted User]

Then Zinnia might like to join the Diva Club Rabbitpam started…

[TARM]

Ha! I missed that…I’ll have to go hunt down that thread!

[Deleted User]

https://www.binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/a…spx#162993

[TARM]

Ha! Thanks! I don’t think Zinni is a diva though. She’s such a snuggle bunny and loves attention and being held. She just doesn’t want to share her space, I guess.

[TARM]

OK my heart shattered into about a thousand pieces this morning when I went to feed everyone and Trouble was so excited to see me. Since his pen is hooked to the front of Zinnia’s cage I have to step in there with him in order to feed her and Amber’s boys. When he saw me coming he started running back and forth and when I stepped in with him he stood on his hind legs and rested his front paws on my leg and begged for pets. I fed him first and he ignored his food and just kept begging for attention, which I gave to him, of course. I know he’s not used to getting it and when he goes back to Bunny Lu he won’t get as much as he’s getting now. I fed the other bunnies, then stepped out of the pen to feed Tank, Ranger, Marshmallow and Digger. Trouble still ignored his food and stood on his hind legs with his front paws resting on the pen…just watching me. When I was done in the bunny room I walked past his pen and he followed me as far as he could and then stared at me. I reached in to give him nose rubs and after he got those he finally started to eat.

He was already stressed at the shelter when I brought him home. He’s now gaining weight and is much more calm. I’m afraid of what’s going to happen to him when he goes back to Bunny Lu. :0(

[Deleted User]

TARM, you do know that you can bond him to Zunnia but it woud involve some effort. With bonding, it isn’t so much about the bunnies, as much as it is about the owner. If you are a stubborn person or like a challenge you will get it done. I was thinking last night about you and if I were in your situation I would hold some sessions at Bunny Lu away from your home. Won’t someone there help you out?

[TARM]

Yeah, they would, I just don’t like to see Zinnia upset. She didn’t ask to be attacked by a maniac boy rabbit. She’s perfectly happy with the way things are now. I keep thinking it’s selfish on my part to force this on her. Trouble will find a home, even if it isn’t with me. He’s not in any danger, which is why I don’t want to put Zinnia through the trauma of a difficult bond. If he was in danger of being PTS then I might think differently.

That probably sounds really stupid but I know if I was Zinnia I would be very unhappy with me right now.

[Deleted User]

TARM, I have to smile now… you and I are on the opposite spectrum from one other when it comes to bonding. I have no problem forcing a bond but I see your point, too. You really just want Zinnia to have the good life. Good for her, and since Troubs will find a home, it’s all good, except for you… who wanted to keep him.

[TARM]

Of course Mary Ellen will want me to force the bond because we have a few REW’s who have been at the shelter for way too long. No one ever wants big white bunnies with up ears and red eyes. They all want cute little lop eared bunnies in different colors. People are so superficial. Gr.

[Deleted User]

Posted By TARM on 03/18/2010 07:52 AM
No one ever wants big white bunnies with up ears and red eyes. They all want cute little lop eared bunnies in different colors. People are so superficial. Gr.

 

Agreed.

–Your thread here, TARM, is kind of ironic; there are pitbulls gently playing with chickens and rabbits sinking teeth into one another.

[TARM]

lol I know! Perfect representation of me though. I have a pit bull, a rottweiler, 7 rabbits, 2 ferrets, and 2 human kids…and we all live peacefully together. Not everyone can pull that off. :0)

[rosalie68]

just a thought: maybe u can try a trio with a pair of your other bunnies.

[TARM]

Yeah…no. Marshmallow tries to pick fights with him during her out of cage time and my other two pairs are both sets of litter mate brothers. I did briefly consider it though.

[TARM]

Tonight I put Zinni and Troubs together in a much bigger area, at the entrance to the house with the hallways blocked off so they couldn’t escape or hide. They were on a wood floor so they were a little slidey AND THEY DIDN’T FIGHT AT ALL! They didn’t groom or snuggle either but they did sniff noses a bunch of times. There wasn’t a growl to be heard! It was beautiful! Hopefully this is a good sign. I’m trying not to get too excited but it’s hard not to. They were together for almost an hour. I can’t wait to put them together again tomorrow! If I have time, I have to work the Pet Expo and then babysit my nephew, but I’m going to try hard to squeeze that in.

Yay!

[mocha200]

yay!!! hope they learn to like each other.

[Monkeybun]

(((((((Z&T vibes))))))))

[Deleted User]

great! I suppose the cube was the opposite of what these two needed! Some rabbits get extra territorial in a small space and totally freak for that reason, or some get panicky because they feel they have no escape. I recommend NOT using the cube again for Z & T! LOL!

[TARM]

I tried again last night and we were in there for a good 45 minutes. Things went pretty well but towards the end Zinnia got ugly with Troubs and Troubs actually looked kind of nervous being too close to her. We ended on a good note and I’ll try again today. I think she might be territorial of ME. She didn’t like him crawling in my lap at all. :0(

[Bindilicious]

Hey, Tarm, I have been following this thread and just wondered how Z&T were doing today.  It is really a small world – I have been on Bunny Lu’s sight several times even before I found BinkyBunny and I have just realized from reading this thread that you volunteer there.  I work in Winchester and live just over the WV line in Hampshire County so I am close by.  As soon as Bindi is spayed, I am thinking about a friend for her.  Hope Zinnia and Trouble are doing well today.  

[TARM]

Bunny Lu has TONS of single boys right now! If you come bunny dating on a Saturday I’ll be there. :0)

Yesterday we did a bonding session that lasted about 45 minutes and then Zinni started getting snarky with Troubs and he actually looked like he was afraid of her. I’m going to try them again a little later in a different spot and see what happens. I’m hoping that if I keep changing up the locations I can keep Zinnie from biting him. He really is a sweet, sweet bunny. And he loves it here. I DO NOT want to give him back.

Did you go to the pet expo in chantilly this past weekend?

[Bindilicious]

I was so excited about the Pet Expo and could not wait to go until I realized I had to work Sat. and Sun. at the hospital.  Every month I work one weekend and you would know if fell on that date .   I liked Oliver on the web site, but it says he doesn’t like to be picked up and I so want at least one bunny that I can pick up and snuggle with.  Bindi is obviously not going to be one of those bunnies.  I’m sending you a PM because I have some questions for you if that’s alright. 

[TARM]

Yeah, Oliver does not like to be picked up. It’s a shame because if you can wrangle him long enough he’s very skwishy! Feel free to PM away!

[TARM]

OK, so Zinnia and Trouble have been loose in the living room for almost two hours with no scuffles. They’ve only sniffed each other twice. They seem to be putting a lot of energy into ignoring each other. Is this good or bad? Ugh, I need to get so much better at this…

[MirBear]

TARM it sounds like your extreamly nervouse about this bond. could thoese vibes be passed along to zinnia, you know like how dogs can smell fear, feel tension ect… maybe its actually you not her… im not trying to be mean, i do it to. i baby my girls, you baby zinnia… i have a little suggestion.. could you possibly have someone at bunny lu bond them. or attemt to bond them.. i have a feeling that they have a very good chance of bonding… but i do belive that zinnia needs someone who wont end a bonding session if something happens… if you had someone who thinks of it more formal than personal, maybe they have a chance at a very strong bond?

 

 

no offece intended

[mrmac]

No scuffles are better than some scuffles. They seem somewhat interested in eachother since they are sniffing eachother, even if it is only occasionally. I would just let them be in the same area, when they are ready to move to the next step they will. I really do hope this works out for you TARM! (((Bonding vibes)))

[TARM]

I am not offended. And I think I’m pretty relaxed when I’m with them. I sit down with a book and read while they do their thing. I only act like a nervous ninny when I’m telling you guys about it. Tonight I didn’t get near them. Trouble kept coming over to see me but Zinnia stayed on the other side of the room. They don’t try to fight through the bars on Zinnia’s cage either, which I see as a good sign. I’m hoping that if I keep letting them out together they’ll gradually get to know each other. I’m very excited that there was no fighting, even though I didn’t force them to be close together. With other bunnies I’ve tried to introduce her to she went after them as soon as their feet hit the floor.

The lady who is really good at bonding just had twins so she can’t help me. Mary Ellen is generally too busy to spend a lot of time supervising bonding bunnies, that’s why I’ve taken on a lot of the bonding stuff. But like I’ve said before, I haven’t matched up anyone who didn’t like each other.

Oh yeah, there were no poop wars either.  Trouble pooped by the gate where the dog was whining because she wanted to chase the bunnies but there was nothing in the room from either one of them.  Litter habits in their cages is also still very good.

[mrmac]

When doing my trio, Delilah was very aggressive towards Dexter- Running full speed at him though the pen bars, nipping, their first intro together and she attacked him and Dexter screamed. Their interactions sound positive, ignoring is always better than fighting. No poo wars is ALWAYS a plus!

[jerseygirl]

But like I’ve said before, I haven’t matched up anyone who didn’t like each other.

My feeling on this is they don’t hate each other. You saw in their first meeting at Bunny Lu a good thing. I think you’ve just seen them react (maybe due to stress or territorality) to a situation they didn’t like. That they’re not trying to attack one another now after their previous scuffles, to me means they don’t hate each other.

Ignoring is good. They (mostly Zinnia) are allowing one another to be in the same space and going about business as usual. A larger space would be like the casual grazing, play & socialising area in a wild rabbit colony. Though it might not seem like it, there is probably alot of subtle communication going on between them. Sorry, I’ve been reading on rabbit behaviours…lol !

Oh, and Zinnia’s territorial or jealous(?) behaviour over you that you’re seeing totally happens – in my opinion.

@ Bindi, if you visit Bunny Lu, let TARM pick out someone for Bindi to meet. She has a good track record!

[Deleted User]

TARM, you seem to have some bunnies on your hand that like the big space! This makes things so much easier as you won’t have to worry about transitioning them from small space to large later. Go for it! Let them have those supervised meetings in the big space until they begin to be more curious in each other. Ignoring is VERY good! Two thumbs up for Trouble and Zinnia!

[TARM]

No, I just have to transition them from a large space to a smaller one. That’s the part I worry about. They HAVE to share a cage.

Thanks for the feedback guys! I hope this really is a positive thing and they aren’t just toying with me…lol

[Deleted User]

Posted By TARM on 03/23/2010 05:42 AM
No, I just have to transition them from a large space to a smaller one. That’s the part I worry about. They HAVE to share a cage.

Once they get along in the big space and trust each other, like snuggling etc, it shouldn’t be a difficult transition to move them into a cage as long as you give them enough time in the big space, and as long as that cage is totally neutral.

[TARM]

I might as well just go ahead and adopt the little stinker. I know I’m not going to send him back. We’ve got, what, 10 years to get them to like each other enough to share a cage?

[Deleted User]

well, if you put it that way… LOL. I have not heard of any bonding to take that long! “Little Stinker” is a nice name too!
OK. Since it’s official that he’s yours, time for a new round of photos, I think.

[TARM]

omg You should see him when he has out time. He is so curious, his litter habits are awesome, and he hasn’t tried to chew on anything yet. He’s such a good boy! Zinnia is a wire addict. If it has wires or cables she must chomp them. *sigh* Amber’s boys are really good too but when they’re out of the cage they poop everywhere. Tank, Ranger, Marshmallow, and Digger have to stay in the bunny room. They will hide and run and they are almost impossible to catch in the livingroom.

[TARM]

I was going to take a video of the bunnies loose in the livingroom tonight but I dropped my camera and broke it.  There’s been lots of fighting and one major kerfluffle that resulted in a huge hunk of fur being ripped out of Zinnia. 

When I say lots of fighting I mean that clapping my hands loudly, yelling “No!” and squirting them with water doesn’t make them stop.  This is not just boxing and lunging.  I don’t know what happened tonight that was different from last night, but whatever it was…it isn’t good. 

[Deleted User]

This is the challenge in the big space, how to stop them when things start to go wrong. Mrmac on here has used a large trash bag filled with empty soda cans to shake at her rabbits during bonding. The other thing I might try if I were you is the bathtub with the drain open and the faucet splashing water into it. You want to find a stressor now that yours respond too.

[TARM]

OK. I’ll try that tonight.

[MirBear]

a car ride might even work…

[TARM]

Mir, unfortunately I am the only driver in the house and my daughters are not willing to put their hands near fighting bunnies. Even with gloves.

I suck. I said I was going to do the bath tub and the car but I didn’t do either one because I came home, sat down, and did not get back up. I’m exhausted. I did let them out in the living room, expecting that to be a short time out, but there was no fighting today. The was barely any sniffing either but definitely no fighting. They were out for almost 4 hours. When Zinnie got tired she went and settled down under the table. Troubs sat by my feet and watched TV…lol I didn’t snuggle Zinni for very long. She will sit on my lap forever if I let her. I did snuggle with Trouble. He’s a good snuggler.

[Deleted User]

I call that a session! Good work TARM

[TARM]

Another volunteer from Bunny Lu is going to pick up Z and T from me tomorrow night and keep them for the weekend at her house.  She can keep them longer if she needs to but we’re starting with just the weekend so as not to cause me anxiety.  :0)

[Monkeybun]

Ooo a totally new place for them, could be interesting!

[MirBear]

good plan!

[TARM]

And better yet…I won’t be there to wring my hands and fret.

[Monkeybun]

You’ll just be at home where you will wring your hands and fret lol. Admit it

[TARM]

of course. but they won’t know that.

[jerseygirl]

How will you go without your Zinnia? btw, officially congrats on your new rabbit Trouble. Wonderful!!

[TARM]

I’m going to have to be brave. And probably call the other volunteer a lot. She’s gonna hate me…lol

[TARM]

OMG I’m already fretting.  My stomach is in knots just thinking about handing them over tonight.  And Troubs isn’t even mine yet! 

I completely trust this person 100% and would trust her with any of my animals, including my dogs, and I don’t trust ANYONE with my dogs (just because the one isn’t good at all with strangers and the other is dog aggressive and can be difficult to manage at times) but just the fact that they won’t be at home is really messing me up…lol

 

[MarkBun]

It happens. I remember the first day I came home from work while my buns were over at SaveABunny being bonded. First time I came home in over 5 years that Maryann wasn’t there to greet me with the demand of a treat. The house seemed really empty then. But when I went to pick them up and I saw her grooming Dono, it was the first time I cried in a long time – that didn’t involve a great amount of physical pain.

[TARM]

Awww, Mark, that’s so sweet! *sniffle*

[MimzMum]

I’m that way anytime my buns have to go to the vet, not just because they’ll have something medical going on, but because it really IS quiet in here without all three of them present. It’s like some weird hush comes over the other two…like they’ve been chatting away with their whiskers all day or something and all of a sudden no one is talking.
I know, weird, but I’m like that. ^_^
((((((((((((((((good bonding vibes and no hand-wringing for TARM))))))))))))))))
My guess is, the new space and you not there to unconsciously give one or the other a reason to be snippy out of loyalty or anything will mean an easier bond for them. And then life can get back to happiness and rose petals! ^_^
Plus we’re here for you during the time they are off on their adventure…feel free to bend as many ears as you can reach! ^_^

[TARM]

Thank you MM. I got an update via facebook, no flying fur so far and they shared greens! I told her she’s already gotten farther in a couple hours than I have in two weeks! Fingers crossed!!!

[MimzMum]

COOL! ((((((((crosses fingers, toes, eyes and 3 pairs of bunny ears))))))))))))))

It’s like when you take kids to the doctor…they put up a big fuss ‘cuz you’re there int he room with them (my kids always did for shots) but if you leave them with the doc and nurse, they have no one to put a show on for. ^_^

[TARM]

Bad news. Zinnia is on the way to the vet. She has almost a 2 inch gash on her leg where he grabbed hold of her and wouldn’t let her go. I won’t be adopting him.

But (!) the girl who tried to bond them really likes Troubs and she’s going to try him with one of her girls to see what happens.

I’m sad but I Zinnia should not have had to go to the vet for an injury caused by my desire to adopt another rabbit. She’s going to stay a single girl.

[MirBear]

well thats good and bad, awwe for zinnia and yay for troubs.. know we know WHY he was named that

[Author]

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