Foot Problem? Updated, Advice Please

[AbbyGirl]

I made another appointment with Hugo’s vet.  It seems like more problems are popping up.  I noticed these bumps sticking off the side of his foot that are red and he has no fur there.  He seems to flinch when I touch them even when he is in a trance on his back.  My poor baby.  Anyone have any ideas on what this could be?  I don’t take him in till Thursday and am just curious.

[Sarita]

Out of the side of his foot? I know alot of larger rabbits can get callouses on the bottom of their feet which MIGHT turn into sore hocks. But I cannot picture exactly what you are talking about on the side of his foot.

Poor Hugo.

[AbbyGirl]

I know. =( One of them seems to have broken open now and is soft and white. I’m trying to get him to the vet’s asap.

[Sarita]

That might be a sore hock then since it’s broken open. I know once he’s with you longer that these problems won’t be a problem. These things are usually the result of poor care in the past.

[AbbyGirl]

I was able to get a picture of it.  He sees the vet in a hour.  The one on the left is the one that seems to have busted open.  They are on the side of his foot.  He doesn’t even put pessure there.  I just don’t want him to get an infection.

[Sarita]

Let us know what the vet says. Glad you are getting him in sooner – let us know what the vet says.

[AbbyGirl]

I just got back. Hugo is resting in the kitchen. I found out that he has Pasteurella. She had to break open all the lumps she found on his feet and squeeze this hard white stuff out. I was sent home with an Iodine solution to clean them with twice a day and an antibiotic to give him twice a day for 14 days. Hopefully this will be it for my poor little guy.

[Sarita]

Poor dude! How did the vet diagnose the pasteurella?

[AbbyGirl]

She looked at it and when she touched it all this stuff oozed out and she said that’s what he had. She said she had seen a lot of it and it was common for rabbits that were caged on wire floors. Which he wasn’t.
I do have a question though. How do I put Iodine on his feet without him staining the floors of the apartment?

[AbbyGirl]

She also told me he came to us with it.

[Sarita]

Yes, most rabbits have pasturella, it’s not at all uncommon. With good care and a stress free environment he will be okay. Abscesses are related many times to pasturella.

Iodine? That’s a good question and I have no idea since it’s been along time since I’ve used this stuff.

[AbbyGirl]

OK, thanks for all your help.

[mocha200]

poor Hugo! keep us updated!

[AbbyGirl]

Well, I cleaned his foot for the first time. He didn’t like it. I had to get more of that yucky stuff out of his foot too. =(
At least he LOVED his medicine. He was begging for more. =)

[GrumpyBun]

Aww, Hugo! Please keep us updated. Poor bun.

Sending lots of healing vibes!

[jerseygirl]

Once the iodine dries it shouldn’t transfer onto the carpet but I guess he could re wet it when grooming.

You might be able to apply the iodine, wait for it to dry some, then put baby socks on his feet. If he allow it! lol  edit: if you’re willing to sacrifice a pair, you could cut a small bit off the toe end to allow his toes/nail to be free. That might not bother him so much and he might get around better that way. Just make the hole smallish so it sit firmly and stays in place.

The fancy schmancy word for sore hocks is “pododermatitis”. Did the vet use this term? As Sarita said though, Pasteurella can be behind some abscesses which it sounds like he had. Icky! Good to hear he’s well on the way to having all these things sort out for him.

[AbbyGirl]

Me too. =) She said it was not sore hocks. He does have some callused areas on his heels she told me to watch but this was definitely the Pasturella. He even had some up towards the top of his foot by his toes. Also, I don’t think a baby sock would fit on his big hind feet. LOL She said to make sure they got a lot of air anyway.

[jerseygirl]

oh, ok. Good to know! From memory iodine is pretty drying isn’t it? So it might not be an issue once it dries on the infected areas.

[AbbyGirl]

What I did was put down extra towels in case of spills or him trying to get away. Once I had it on there for a few minutes I was able to soak up the extra on his fur with a washcloth. Since he was a good boy I was able to hold him for a few minutes to let it dry. Thankfully he doesn’t seem to want to lick at it.

[AbbyGirl]

Found another lump on his foot this afternoon. Back to the vet we go. Thankfully she’s not going to charge us this time. Hopefully the Baytril kicks in soon and these lumps stop appearing. I hate to see the vet have to hurt him like that. =(

[Sarita]

I hope so too. Poor Hugo.

[AbbyGirl]

We’re back. Hugo did good but this one hurt him soooo bad =( They said if anymore surface to call in right away. If I have to keep going back she said she would charge me one fee and I would be able to bring him in as many times as needed for it. She can’t figure out why he’s getting more though.

[Michelle&Lolli]

Awe poor Hugo. Healing vibes! Yeah, hopefully the baytril kicks in and they’ll stop surfacing. It’s no fun to have to go to the doctor all the time.

[Sarita]

I don’t know how you feel about doing injections but if they seem to be getting more and worse ask the vet about doing pen-g shots.

[AbbyGirl]

Instead of the oral antibiotic? I think I found 2 more this morning but they are still under his fur. Too hard to get at. She said that they must be under the skin and have to surface now. I hate having to clean all these sores. It makes me cry every time. It’s hurting him so bad now. I don’t want him to get anymore. =(

[Sarita]

Even along with the baytril. Ask your vet about the pen-g shots.

[AbbyGirl]

Thank you. I’ll do that the next time we go in. It’s too soon to get at the new spots so maybe tomorrow or Saturday.

[AbbyGirl]

Do you think that the wood pellet bedding could be irritating his feet? The vet seems to think that something has to irritate it for the abscesses to show up. The wood pellets I use are made for animal bedding by a local pellet stove store. His heels seem to be pretty pink and have white scaly spots on them. It’s the only way to describe it. I know I need to watch that for sore hocks but I’m not sure what that looks like.

[Sarita]

It’s possible due to his weight. Any open sore could be a sore hock – it would basically lead to an infection to open sores on the feet are definitely a risk.

I wonder if the Yesterdays News might be better on his feet or even aspen shavings.

[AbbyGirl]

I could check into aspen. He eats paper. I don’t mean he shreds it. He literally eats it like it’s a treat. He’ll eat a whole piece of paper if it’s laying on the floor. That’s why I don’t give him phone books to play with. He doesn’t have open sores on his heels though. I sprayed the pellets really good with water last night to soften them up.

[AbbyGirl]

Thanks for all the help Sarita. He hasn’t had anymore lumps surface that need drained. I called the vet and they said they give him a prescription to help with the pain. I didn’t even think to ask about that. I’ll keep you posted on his progress.

[Sarita]

That’s a relief that he’s had no more. Hopefully the pain meds will help.

You are such a great bunny mom.

[AbbyGirl]

Awww, thank you. I got the medicine that you recommended. Hopefully he’ll get some relief soon.

[AbbyGirl]

Hugo had the metacam last night and I knew if helped him when he leaped almost 2 feet in the air when doing a binky! The cutest thing I’ve ever seen. I knew the Baytril was working because he was more active yesterday, even before the metacam . The lumps on his feet are starting to flatten out now too. Still a little sore though. Hopefully he won’t need to go to the vet again.

[Sarita]

That’s great. I hope the baytril does the trick.

[AbbyGirl]

Just when I thought thing were getting better. I found a large lump on his front paw now. =( My poor baby.

Is it weird that it is on a front paw now? Should I ask about pen-g shots at this point? Do you think I need to ask her to do a culture to make sure that’s what it is?

I’ve been doing some reading online about it but it’s kinda scary and I’m not sure what to trust. Plus a lot of the bacterial things I am reading about are not on feet.

[Sarita]

It might be a good idea to do the culture and yes, do ask about the pen-g shots.

[Beka27]

Cultures never hurt. It’s better to know what you’re up against so the correct meds are being administered, rather than just playing a guessing game. He should also be tested for pasteurella since that is something the vet suspects.

[AbbyGirl]

Hugo went to the vet. She said that she wants to wait another 2 weeks before starting the pen-g because of his tummy issues. If he still has new ones then she’ll give it to him. He will be on the Baytril for 6 weeks now. She also did a culture since he had a new unopened abscess this morning. She said this is the strangest thing she has ever seen. Since it’s spreading to his front legs. Hopefully this will all be over soon.

[Sarita]

Let us know what the culture says. It’s probably good that he is on the baytril for a long while instead of just taking it away.

At least she is open to the pen-g and hopefully the culture will give you more insight.

[Michelle&Lolli]

His heels seem to be pretty pink and have white scaly spots on them.

This would be sore hocks. This site has info on them. http://www.rabbitnetwork.org/articles/sorehocks.shtml

Lolli is a mini rex and she gets them. Usually they are just skin tone bare spots, but I did notice on Sunday that the spots were red so I need to keep an eye on her.

[AbbyGirl]

Thanks for the link.

[AbbyGirl]

So, I called the vets office a little while ago to check on Hugo’s culture. I think she said it was a culture and sensitivity? The lady I spoke with got the results from the Dr’s desk. It said there was no growth meaning he didn’t have a bacterial infection. Now I’m confused. She said the vet should hopefully call me back today or tomorrow to talk to me about it.
Where do I go from here? He’s still getting new abscesses. Will he need blood work done?
Just thought I’d get your opinions while waiting impatiently for the vet.

[Sarita]

I would wait to speak with the vet – she will have more insight into the test and you can discuss the new abscesses that he is getting.

[Sarita]

Also, it wouldn’t hurt to get Dana Krempel’s insight into his problem.  She knows quite a bit and will probably have some advice.  Be as specific as possible about what you’ve done, what the vet has said and prescribed, and his background and you can send a photo too.

Here’s her link:

http://www.allexperts.com/user.cgi

You may not get a response from her before you speak to the doctor but you can always go back and ask her follow up questions too.

[AbbyGirl]

Thank you. I’ll probably do that sometime tonight after my girls go to bed so I can think a little better. Actually the vet just called. She thinks it’s viral and not bacterial and that the antibiotics are keeping it under control since the culture says no growth. She wants to keep doing what she has been doing. Draining new ones and staying on the Baytril.

[Sarita]

I’m glad the vet called. Let Dana know that as well. I can’t guarantee she will have an answer but I think it’s worth trying.

[AbbyGirl]

This may seem like a stupid question. How does an antibiotic help a viral infection? When it’s viral doesn’t it have to just run it’s course? She said the Baytril will help keep it under control. Is this something we’re always going to deal with now? I’m very confused…..

[Beka27]

I’m not sure. That’s always been my assumption, but your vet must have her reasons. Can you call her back today? It’s a legitimate question to want to know where you’re headed with his treatment.

[AbbyGirl]

I’ll be talking to her about it today. I’m taking a list with me this time so I don’t forget this time. We have to go in since I found 2 more spots today.

[AbbyGirl]

She said she could do a blood test since the culture didn’t show anything but I can’t afford another test. She said to use the Baytril for another 4 weeks and that it usually runs its course in 4-6weeks. I just can’t stand having to hurt him like that. It’s horrible. =(

[Sarita]

Sometimes it can take a long while for things to run their course and I’ve had many friends have to use baytril for this long as well to “cure” various ailments in their rabbits – I hope it works. It is hard to see our furbabies suffer and feel helpless to do anything (even though you are doing all you can do).

[AbbyGirl]

Sorry I didn’t update sooner. I’ve been working on our new house all weekend. Dana got back to me. Hear is what she said.

Dear Amy,

I have seen rescued rabbits who have come from a bad situation develop small abscesses on their feet like this. Even though there is no growth of bacteria, it is possible that opportunistic bacteria are taking up residence. I think that if these are superficial, then keeping up with Betadine flushes should be a good idea. As your bun gains in health, these types of lesions will often resolve on their own as his immune system takes up the slack.

If it *is* Pasteurella, then fluoroquinolone antibiotics should be effective against them. But topical disinfecting with Betadine is a good first line of attack, as long as they are getting better, not worse.

Hope this helps.

[Sarita]

That’s interesting and certainly worth discussing with your vet too. How have his feet been lately?

[AbbyGirl]

No new ones since that last time I took him in (Wednesday?). One of the old ones filled back up but the others seem to be healing up nicely.
Is the fluoroquinolone antibiotics that she mentioned something different than I am using?

[Sarita]

You are using baytril correct? That would be a fluoroquiolone antibiotic.

[AbbyGirl]

Thank you.

[LittlePuffyTail]

Sorry to hear Hugo is having these problems. That’s nice of your vet to only charge you the one fee. My advice: Don’t let the internet scare you! It makes every symptom seem like a death sentence. Really, I have scared myself and made myself cry many times by thinking my bun had something terrible when it turned out to be something minor.

((((((Healing Vibes for Hugo)))))))

[AbbyGirl]

Thanks! I was so thankful that the vet did that. It takes less than 5 minutes when we have to go in. It’s hard not to let the internet scare you. That’s why I’m so happy I have you guys to ask. Thanks for all the help. =)

[AbbyGirl]

We took another trip to the vet today. When I got there I found out it wasn’t our regular vet. This vet doesn’t usually see rabbits. They did not tell me this when I made the appointment. Since he was just draining the abscess I guess they thought it didn’t matter. Well, he man handled my poor little guy. He was kicking so hard I almost dropped him! Needless to say I was pretty upset by the time I left. It usually takes a few minutes for his vet to drain one because she takes her time and lets me reposition him after he’s been kicking. He had it done within 60 seconds. He squeezed his poor foot so hard. Then he cleaned the open wound with peroxide which she does not do. I’ve never seen Hugo kick so hard.

Sorry for my venting. I’m still a little upset. I could use some advice though. Hugo’s foot is VERY sore now. He won’t let me touch it without kicking. I have to continue to drain and clean this one for the next few days. I gave him the metacam as soon as we got home because of how sore he was but he was still kicking this evening when I put the iodine on him. He’s never done that before. It is very red and swollen too. Is there anything I can do for him? Can I put something cold on it? Any suggestions on how I can try to clean his foot. It’s hard to hold him and clean it by myself. I don’t have anyone to help me hold him. He kicked the iodine that was on his foot everywhere this evening.

He’s been under the table all day now and I just want him to feel a little better. Sorry if I’m rambling. My thoughts aren’t all together because of all of it. Thanks.

[Michelle&Lolli]

Awe poor poor Hugo. Give him nose pets and kisses for me!

Is he putting any weight on his foot? If the bleeping vet squeezed that hard, he might have broken his poor foot. If he’s putting weight on it, then he’s probably just super sore and has had enough of this poking at him crap. I would try putting something cold on his foot if he’ll let you. Otherwise, I’d let him be and watch him and see if the soreness and swelling calms down after a bit. It might just be that everything is inflamed and angry. Poor boy.

[AbbyGirl]

Thanks. That’s what I was thinking to. I know his foot is not injured from it, he’s just very sore. He is hopping around fine but he is very protective of his foot now. Even when he stretches out he puts his one leg out and pulls the other up under him. He had 8 lanced before this and we never had a problem. Only when 3 were on top of each other but he still didn’t hurt this bad. He’s not too mad at me. He just had some extra pellets up on my bed and is now laying with me. I’ll try a cold washcloth maybe.

[Sarita]

Oh no! Poor Hugo. How is his foot this morning? Did the vet ever give you metacam for him?

[AbbyGirl]

Yes his regular vet gave it to me when he didn’t want to use his litter box because those 3 were all so close together and sore. I gave it to him as soon as we got home yesterday because I could see how bad he was hurting. I’ll probably give him one more dose of it today so he’ll feel better. It’s not as swollen and red this morning but it’s still sore. He’ll let me look at it a little bit but he’s still kicking when I clean it which is very unusual for him.

[Sarita]

It must still be sensitive. Are you still giving the baytril?

[AbbyGirl]

Yes, for another 3 weeks.

[Sarita]

That’s good you are doing it more long-term.

[AbbyGirl]

The vet said for 6 weeks. I think she’ll reevaluate after that. I’m sure if he’s still getting more closer to that time that she would again extend the amount of time he is on the Baytril.

[Author]

Messages