Bonding a Fluffle?

[Babyfacecupcake]

Spay/Neuter
Are your bunnies spayed/neutered? Yes
If so, for how long (for each)?buttons about 4 yrs, patches about September 2019, ziggy mid February 2020, and velvet mid April 2020.

Housing
Please describe your bunnies’ current housing set-up (living together, as neighbors, etc.). Live in expens, patches, buttons and ziggy are right next to eachother. I have to swap the boys every night. There has never been any fighting through the fence for the 2 just when in an open space (i think i might have rushed the bonding process and did it too soon after ziggys neuter) a couple feet away velvet is in an expen (not enough room to have them right next to eachother.

Bonding background
Did you allow the bunnies to “settle-in” i have let all buns settle in for velvet (newest bun) its been about 2  months.. and the other 3 definetly have.
How would you describe your bunnies reactions towards each other (answer for each bunny): shy, scared, curious, calm, aggressive, excited, affectionate, etc.? Patches is affectionate with buttons and ziggy and aggressive towards velvet, buttons is affectionate with patches, through a fence doesnt care about ziggy, and curious of velvet, ziggy is affectionate with patches, indifferent of buttons, and im not too sure how he feels about velvet, and velvet seems to be aggressive with all she does flirt woth button through his pen. But now if she goes up to pens she doesnt seem to try to fight just walks away when they fight at the bars but if one of the buns goes up to her pen then she’s aggressive with them.
Have you done any “pre-bonding” (cage or litter box swaps, etc.)? With the boys I have been doing cage swaps since mid March. I haven’t done too much swapping with velvet just whats in the free roam area and when i clean litter boxes i save the clean litter and mix it up between all the litter boxes. I am considering swapping pens for everyone. If so, for how long? For about
Have you started sessions yet? I had started stress bonding for only a week about 2 months ago. But I stopped and allowed more settling in time for velvet. I did try a session last night with velvet and buttons. It went horribly and I ended up with a gash on my hand. (I didn’t realize the damage bunny teeth can do!)
How long have you been working on bonding your bunnies? The boys I started beginning of March and they got into a fight that resulted in a torn ear in the beginning of April so I haven’t tried them again since.
How frequently do you have bonding sessions, and how long are they? I was doing just 1 20 min session a day. 10 min walking around with them in a laundry basket and 10 min with making them cuddle and petting them. I have tried to just do the cuddle and pet and it results in patches and velvet pulling eachother fur out if i don’t do any stress work before.
Have you tried any stressing techniques? I have with the boys and I have been doing it with all 4 since I got velvet.

 

Buttons and ziggy I tried marathon bonding, stress bonding, having a small area, having a large area, taking them to a completely new place, taking patches out of the situation,  adding her into the bonding. But as I said I think I may have rushed the boys and tried too soon after ziggys neuter.

I think i am ready to resume some form of bonding. I am just very unsure what I’d like to start. My options are bonding all 4, bonding buttons and velvet, or working on the trio of buttons, patches, and ziggy. What do you think the best option is? I am very aware that whatever option will be a ton of work. I think id like to avoid marathon bonding. As I have no help. I have been thinking of continuing dojng the stress and then snuggle method if I decide to do any form of bonding with velvet and the other and if i decode to try just the trio maybe trying in a neutral space?

I honestly just want to do whats best for my buns. I love them all to pieces. If all 4 are bonded I think it would make everyone happier as they would have much more pen room and much more free roam time.

I am planning on doing a progression thread as well as open to any advice. Thank you all so much in advance.

[Babyfacecupcake]

7/23

I am going to give velvet some more time i think. I reintroduce buttons and ziggy woth patches. And it seems to be going really well. A little humping bit ziggy actually groomed buttons a few times which I was suprised about ( they have been peaceful neighbors for a couple months now, if they wanted to nip through the bars the could but choose not to) they have been snuggling up next to eachother. Not flopping but loafing. I have a pile of veggies and everyone are peacefully together. I think once the trio is happy I may introduce velvet doing the forced snuggle/stress bonding. Would adding her in possibly break the trios bond? Patches who has been bonded to ziggy and fell in love at 1st site has actually been humping him during bonding the trio. Im assuming this is normal?

[DanaNM]

Glad to see the trio is going well! 🙂

Adding the fourth might upset the trio, but hopefully since they are used to her presence it wouldn’t. But it’s possible.

Some humping sounds normal. Trio dynamics are different than pairs, so Patches prob feels the need to so some dominance over Ziggy. The hierarchy might change again in the quad.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Do you think adding the velvet later on will cause the boys to fight when they aren’t with velvet doing bonding sessions? In their pen/free roam time. (Once we get to that point)

[DanaNM]

It’s really hard to say! So you just have to be prepared in case it does. Sorry if that isn’t a satisfying answer. :p

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

I did another bonding session a few nights ago it went well. Some humping but nothing out of the normal or bad behavior besides if I put too much hay buttons guards it (so definitely no litter boxes) today I tried to do a bit of the living room area where they are also allowed to play at and it didn’t go well. Ziggy was lunging and grunting towards buttons. So we will stick to the kitchen for a while. I just throught that part of the play area would be easier since I don’t have to pick them up out of their pens. What are your thoughts on every other night working on the trio and on the nights I’m not working on the trio working with the 4 of them? Will that confuse them too much? I’d like the 4 of them to get along eventually but id also like to try to not have to do  3 different play times each day. As I’m going back to work amd it makes play time and bonding time much harder. Thoughts?

[DanaNM]

I think if you can handle working with all 4 together, it would be better to work with the 4 at the same time since that’s the main goal.

The space is definitely important and should be as neutral as possible, so I’m not surprised that it didn’t go as well when you gave them access to the living room. I sent you a video from the head of the San Diego HRS a while back as a private message that might be good to review. She is a bit more tolerant of nipping and fur pulling than I am, but she talks about the importance of the space and working with the whole group.

You might even consider going to a friend’s house with all of them for a long marathon, as Margo suggests. I’ve used that technique in my last few bonds and it really works well when you don’t have goo neutral space at home.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

The main issue is that no matter the space velvet attacks once she sees the other rabbit. When they share any space. But with a barrier (where they could possibly nip) with buttons she doesnt nipbor fight she will flop next to his pen. I think she does really want a bun friend i just dont know how to get passed the initial fighting whenever she sees another rabbit. So I was thinking of doing some stress bonding and forced cuddle time in a laundry basket.

[DanaNM]

Stressing can really help in situations like that. I have had good success with car rides (have someone else drive so you can monitor them). Having them in a bin on top of the washing machine can work well too.  Will Velvet calm down with petting? Petting whenever she sees another bun or another bun approaches may help a lot too.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Unfortunately I don’t have any help. I was putting them all in a laundry basket and just walking around with them for 10 min and that seemed to stress them out enough so they don’t fight and then i would sit down with all of them still in the laundry basket and pet them for 10 min. When i had tried just velvet and buttons she did well with just being pet and me not allowing her to move. I feel the biggest challenge is velvet and patches. Especially if i did the marathon bonding. Patches may be acting that way since she has only seen her in the living room, which I’m she she thinks of as her territory. So its probably just territorial behavior between the 2 girls. But I think now that velvet is more settled in I will do the stress bonding/snuggle method. And maybe start with a 5 min walking around/ 5 min petting?

[DanaNM]

That sounds like a good plan! If walking with them in the basket works that’s a lot easier than driving.

You might even do a “stress sandwich” of 5 min stress, 5 min petting, then 5 min stress.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Sounds good! I plan on starting tomorrow!  Thanks!!

[Babyfacecupcake]

Just an update. The buns are definitely stressed. Unfortunately the only way to get them out of their pens is to get a broom and kinda force them out. I could call them and give them a treat but I dont want them to associate being called as a bad thing and then not come to me when i need them to come (like putting them back in their pens after free roam time). And ive been walking around for 5 min and then petting for 5 and then walking for 5 and then putting them all back after about 15 to 30 min after they have calmed down a bit i give everyone a cookie and then time for bed. The past couple days they seem so stress from the 1st half of the session I’ve been able to just walk for 5 min and then pet them and pause to see their reactions to eachother. They are all so stressed that they barely move. I do keep a close eye and typically a hand on velvet at all times. She seems to be the one that is the less stressed out. My “problem” is after the few encounters I’ve had with her and my buns have all been negative. So if she moves and maybe she is moving to groom one of the other buns i kinda freak out and stop her. Id rather be safe than her nip someone and cause a wound and then set back the bonding even further.

[DanaNM]

Do keep an eye on their overall stress levels (make sure everyone is eating and pooping, and largely goes back to normal after the session). It’s normal for them to be annoyed at you though, unfortunately.

You do need to let them interact. I know it is hard to know when to intervene, but you shouldn’t stop her from approaching all together. Watch her ears. If her ears are forward, that is curiousity/interest, and wait and see what happens.  If she approaches her her ears back and tail up, that means aggression and nips are likely. In that case I still wouldn’t push her away, but I would pet both bunnies and kind of press them down to calm them.

Not sure what kind of space you are working with, but when I’m not doing stressing, I prefer a large area. That way there is more time to assess what a rabbit’s intentions are, and they have more space to move around naturally. If you consider the role of fear and the “fight or flight” response, if you have no space to flee, your only option is to fight. So I have better luck with big spaces once I get to the point of letting them interact more. Small spaces I end up just petting them A LOT.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Yes they all have been eating/drinking/peeing/pooping normal.. just during the session they are stressed. they all will come and get a cookie afterwards and then get either veggies or pellets. (I will give either veggies or pellets before the session and the other after the session) I have been purely working only in the laundry basket so far. So telling body language is hard. Typically Velvets ears are up like she is curious. But when I did the session in the kitchen with her and buttons it was the same ears up tail at normal level. And then she will go to fight him once she sees he is in the same space as her even if it is neutral. Even if he doesn’t engaged with her at all. He will be minding his own business. How do i know when i should stop purely stressing and go to a larger space where I can sit with them and allow them to possibly interact? In the basket they dont try to nip at all but I think it may be due to being stressed that they don’t try to nip.

[DanaNM]

Ah, I see. At some point you will just have to try and see how it goes.  Setting short time goals helps too, even if it means stopping the session before they interact. Not interacting is actually a conscious decision in rabbits, so ignoring is OK if the previous behavior was fighting. You might be surprised at how much stressing can help.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Tonight session I did half the walking time for Ziggys sake he has had a little bit of a drippy nose since he’s a bit overly stressed. However this didn’t really help velvets case to much as she did try to nip ziggy and buttons. I did the laundry basket method again. While I am petting her she doesnt try to nip or get away. Do you think i should continue the laundry basket snuggle method until there is no negative behavior? Or try to stress them for 5/10 min and then allow them in a bit of a larger space (my kitchen with blankets down) and pet velvet the whole time while allowing the other 3 to wonder if the decide to for maybe 5 min?

[DanaNM]

I think either of those options sound fine. 🙂 Could alternate what you try maybe?

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

<p style=”text-align: left;”>Unfortunately im going to have to pause bonding. ZIiggy has shown some signs of GI Stasis. After bonding Saturday he took a cookie and ate his veggies with no issues. and then Sunday afternoon when I let him and patches out for free roam time he didn’t really want to come out. And then later on when It was veggie/pellet time he didn’t get excited to eat or even care that there was food. Which is very unusual. I tried giving him a cookie and he refused it. So i ran to the store to get some bananas (his absolute favorite) and he took it right away with no issues. I do have some critical care on hand so I gave him a some in a bowl. He didnt eat it right away. I had to separate him from patches. (she is a piggy and will eat anything i put down) but they were right next to eachother with a gate separating them and if they wanted they can groom/flop next to eachother through the gate. last night/this morning he did eat most of the critical care (i had to mash up more banana in it to get him to eat it) and a good portion of his veggies and looked like he may have nibbled on his pellets. He did also come out for some free roam time late last night. And this afternoon by himself. Amd is currently out with patches. He still isn’t really wanting to eat much. I purchased some baby gas meds. Any dosage suggestions? Its simethicone 20mg ( i did give him 0.3ml from a suggestion I found through google) he weighs about 3 to 4lbs. I  checked the fresh litter box I put in this morning and there are some poops in there which is good! (This was before patches was let out for some free roam time with him)But does it sound like beginning stages of stasis? I did give him some spring mix with spinich (which he has had before) and the batch might of had more spinich than normal or stress from bonding? I feel like a horrible bunny owner. When should I start trying to bond again? And should I try to bond with a different method? I didn’t get the chance to try a bigger space with petting velvet. Any advice on Gi Stasis is welcome as well.</p>

[DanaNM]

Aw, bummer. How is he doing now? This can happen with too much stressing, so you were right to pause. I’m guessing the stress was what did it. Can you syringe feed him? You can also mix some banana into the CC to see if he will eat it that way. If he hasn’t eaten anything on his own in 12 hours you are in emergency territory and should go to the vet. Keep offering favorite greens as well (cilantro is a good one to entice a bun that won’t eat) and just try to get him to keep eating.

If it’s gas, simethicone can help, I usually do 1 mL, every hour, for three hours, along with a tummy rub. If that doesn’t work, then it’s prob not going to help.

Once he is 100% back to normal, you can resume, but now you know to go a bit more slowly (maybe only do stressing on alternate days or every three days). You also might try some other techniques that don’t involve as much stress. They might have even gotten over a hump with the stress sessions you already did, so it might not be as necessary anymore.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

But I was shortening the amount of stress time. Idk I was thinking maybe stressing just velvet and patches and then doing a session in the kitchen with the 4 while maybe petting/holding down velvet. Neither of the boys seem to really care that she is around. And neither have tried to nip her. Through a gate or during any sessions I’ve done its just velvet who needs to get use to them. And with the way patches acts when she sees velvet concerns me as well. What do you think? He is eating and he is pooping. He still isnt his normal self though. Where he goes crazy for food and is binking and zooming around but he has been hopping around a lot more and coming out when the door is open. He will take the critical care mashed up with banana in a bowl as long as im not watching him. (I think he thinks im going to try to pock him up) I did see him munching on some hay last night as well. But he still isnt really taking cookies from me. And seems off.

[Babyfacecupcake]

<p style=”text-align: left;”>he is still coming to me when i click through to get a treat (i think he thinks its banana) and again he ate all his critical care from last night and almost all of 2 handfuls of wet veggies. I saw him pull a couple pieces of hay to munch on. But again he just normally goes right for anything i put down which he isnt doing. He kinda is like eh ya i guess I can eat some of that.</p>

[DanaNM]

Glad he’s doing better. 🙂 Bonding in itself is stressful, even without intentional stressing, so it sounds like he just needed a wee break. You could always keep working with the other buns while he recovers if you feel like it would be helpful, but a few days off might do everyone good.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

I think Ziggy is finally in the clear. He took a cookie from me and was doing binkies so im assuming he wouldn’t be doing that if he was in stasis still? . (I had to have him away from patches due to monitoring his eating/pooping) they seemed to have a few little tiffs but seem relatively back to normal. Im having big issues with patches and velvet. Velvet was able to slightly move the plastic from patches pen that I have up during free roam time so they cant nip and it looks like she may have gotten patches lip again 😔 it doesn’t look bad though just a little red but no cut just missing fur. I dont have a separate area to free roam but I also don’t want anyone to get hurt. Which then brings me back to maybe doing the marathon bonding? I’m honestly really scared to do it with knowing how velvet reacts anygime she is near a bun. I was reading an article on marathon bonding (different than the video) she starts with a very small space and suggested to keep the buns together all day and if there is a bad tiff then they stay in a crate all day going on car rides/shopping in a pet stroller, etc. So i guess excessive stressing in a sense. But im scared to do to much stressing cause I don’t want ziggy to go back into stasis. Why can’t they just love each other already! I dont think the boys would try to attack velvet in neutral territory. But im honestly not sure what patches would do. Im pretty sure velvet will start a tiff if i allowed her to hop around.i don’t want to rush the bonding process but I dont want anymore injuries! Or possible injuries. I know velvet wants a friend. She literally flops next to the buns (with a barrier) any chance she gets. I dont understand how to get her past the fight mindset when there is another bun in the same space as her.

[DanaNM]

I can’t say for sure, but personally I have never gone for the marathon when buns are trying to fight badly. I tend to save it till the end, when I know they are close but just need more time. I know it can work for some, but to me it just seems way too stressful for everyone. I certainly wouldn’t want to go for it with Ziggy at this time. It sounds like Velvet and Patches have some bad feelings between them, and in my mind that would be a very hard marathon. I feel a lot better about marathoning when I know they are mostly able to communicate without fighting.

The one time I tried the small space marathoning with buns that weren’t initially doing well (they fought at first, but seemed bonded after about 6 days of marathoning in a very small space), I ended up with a broken bond and an injured bun 5 months later. I know it can work for some, but since I had that negative experience I won’t be using that method again. I also didn’t like the feeling of forcing them to bond in that way. I guess a good measure would be to see if they try to fight in a small space. Some people do have good luck with very small spaces (I just never have).

In all of this, it’s important to put bun’s safety first and remember what you are asking them to do (essentially an arranged marriage!). The goal of bonding is to provide them companionship and a happier life. Some methods of bonding seem more geared towards the convenience of the human and less about the welfare of the rabbits. Over time (I’ve now bonded I think 4 pairs personally and advised many other ppl on this forum) I’ve been trending towards methods that are more focused on building trust between the rabbits and going more at their pace. Velvet just may not be a good candidate for this group, or at least not with Patches if they have so much bad blood between them. A quad is not an easy feat with even an easy combo of buns, so there isn’t really a shortcut unfortunately.

I don’t mean to sound discouraging, because it did seem like you were making some progress with the strategy you had, so I would personally continue with that plan. The small hiccup with Ziggy was hopefully just that, a hiccup that you can work past if you keep an eye on Ziggy’s stress levels more closely.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

That definitely does make sense. I feel the bad blood between the girls is purely territorial though. (It always happens when the other bun goes up to the other pen) As patches had never tried to nip her in the basket even when i was just focused on petting velvet and allowing the other 3 to do their own thing if they wished. Or they wpuld rearrange themselves while walking and patches wpuld purposely go snuggoe with velvet when i originally put her in the opposite side of the basket. I think i will just continue the original method and try to stress ziggy out little less. Maybe not as much walking around. Im not too sure. He has been the one most stressed since day 1.

[DanaNM]

Poor Ziggy. 🙁  And that makes sense with the girls. I’m anxiously anticipating when I finally start working on my trio, because I know the girls are going to be the hard part. I’m hoping that going to a totally neutral space will be helpful with mine, because Myra is for sure being a bit territorial.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Yes I wish you the best of luck on your trio! I’ve heard of some very easy bonds with girls. And of course a whole new place should definitely help. Ive just never dealt with a bun whose fight instinct is so high. (Flight or fight and velvet definitely fights) I’m not to sure how to get past it but keeping ziggy in the clear. When i was doing bonding woth just the trio he was a little stressed but not as badly as anytime he’s in the basket. Once he is in the basket his nose starts running and you can just tell from his breathing and ears that he is not happy. What would you think of giving them run of the whole kitchen and putting velvet in a separate pen in the kitchen? I think I’d be able to stress buttons, patches and velvet. But ziggy seems to be too delicate (and I still am stressing him out just getting him out of his pen)

[DanaNM]

I support experimenting with different sizes of space, physical locations, and levels of stress, since different things work better for different bunnies.

Have you heard of using a stuffy/surrogate with bonding? The idea is you get one rabbits scent all over a toy stuffed bunny, then put it in the other bun’s enclosure. You can even do this as part of pre-bonding. I haven’t done this personally, but it might help Velvet take out her fear on an inanimate object?

Other question, not sure where you are in the world, but in the UK there are lots of professional bonders… you might look into whether this exists in your area. It can be really awesome to have a fresh set of eyes, a fresh location, and an experienced person to help you.

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

I have looked for bonding help and had no luck unfortunately. Due to covid it makes thing even more harder. I am in the US, California. I was offered a few numbers for people who do have a lot of experience and no one has gotten back to me. She use to have a stuffy and loved it! She would groom it and everything.  I’ll have to try leaving it with the other buns for a longer period and see how it goes. But I had it put with patches and ziggy and then put it back with her and she would still groom the stuffy. Which is another reason her behavior during actual bonding confuses the heck out of me.

[DanaNM]

If only we could read those little bunny minds!

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Right! And maybe we could even reason with them a little haha.

[Babyfacecupcake]

So. What im just started trying. Because I really don’t want to go through a spell of stasis again. Im really afraid of it happening again. Is i have velvet under a lundry basket where she can see the buns through (and possible nip, but i move the basket before she is able to) and constantly giving her treat for ignoring or even to distract her while to other bun goes up to smell her. Which also is helping progress with just the 3. Im doing that for 10 min and then i swap where the 3 are under the basket and she is put wondering around a bit and still giving her treats for going up to the basket with no bad behavior of lunging or when she is just ignoring the other buns. Cause as you said ignoring eachother is on purpose. Im sure doing it this way might take longer. So we will se how everything  goes.

[Babyfacecupcake]

I just finished the 1st session. It didnt go horrible. While velvet is under the basket she is still trying to nip if the others come close. But when velvet is out and the others are in the basket she only attempted to nip 1 time. I also did an additional 10 min with me just sitting with velvet while the others ran around. And I was very proud of patches! She would come and smell her and run off. She didn’t attempt to nip her at any time! And velvet didn’t try to pull put of her submissive petting pose i had her in (i was not pinning her at all just constantly petting her) So it seems velvet is the biggest issue. I think for some reason she is very afraid of other buns. Im not totally sure how to help her get out of that stage. One thought was to continue to do the petting sessions woth the other running around so then over time she sees that the other buns are not trying to hurt her? Or I could possibly stress patches, buttons, and velvet and then add ziggy in after the basket ride is over? But as i said its just velvet going after the others.

[Babyfacecupcake]

I’ve been wanting to swap pens as well to see if that may also help with getting use to eachothers smells but patches would probably try to hop out of velvets pen. Right now I have a sheet over her pen and she doesnt attempt to jump out. I bought some thinner pieces of wood to put between patches pen and one of the boys pen (remember i swap buttons and ziggy every night so one can be with patches). I would be able to put one of the boys at a time in velvets original pen but patches wouldn’t be able to be in there since its in an awkward place to cover with a sheet.

[Babyfacecupcake]

I tried to continue my old method at 1st but ziggy was still extremely stressed out. He gets so stressed that his nose starts watering. And he is literally shaking the whole time. Or i would have preferred to stick with that method. And that was with no walking around just putting him in the basket and sitting petting them.

[DanaNM]

Can you try the old method but without Ziggy?

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

[Babyfacecupcake]

Yes and then how would I add him in later?

[DanaNM]

Sorry was away on a trip so just seeing this. The idea is that adding Ziggy could be in a less stressful situation because hopefully Velvet would be more calm if she was getting along well with the other two.

How is everything going now?

. . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.  

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