Bleeding from anus, straining, second time it’s happened

[Ham Sangwich]

Hi everyone, I am an experienced bunny person with a very strange bunny issue and wondering if anyone has run into it before. I am a volunteer with a rabbit shelter for the past 4 years and am fortunate to have 2 very good exotic Vets local to me, but between all these resources no one has much of an idea what is going on.

About 1.5 months ago I came in to my bedroom to find my small little dwarf bun Jack flipping himself over backwards. Very strange behavior for a 9 year old bunny. I immediately went over and found blood on him, on the floor and scooped him up. I put him in the carrier and examined the area, there was considerable blood and what looked like a stone or piece of flesh. I picked up the fleshy stone, and Jack and went immediately to the Vet. They examined him, by the time i got to the Vet he was fine, perfectly normal and not in pain (typical right?). They ran blood tests (all really healthy, especially for a 9 year old bunny), vitals all normal. They took a look at the tissue and said it looked like perhaps intestinal tissue, which would be very odd. They sent it out to the lab to check what it was. It came back as normal tissue from GI tract. The vet had no idea how that can be with the rabbit being perfectly normal vitals 20 mins after passing the flesh. We decide it’s an odd occurence, use carafate for a week and monitor for further issues. All has been fine since, no issues whatsoever.

Until tonight. I got home to find the cage a mess with his little castle turned over and his life-partner staring at him. Blood is everywhere. He is straining noticeably and then relaxing, his anus spasmed while i was examing him and he had a small bit of blood coming out. I can’t find any material he has passed besides blood. The blood is fresh red so it is not dried, but fresh. I hate seeing him in pain and can’t figure out what is going on. I would love to give him some pain meds, but Doc told me not a great idea if it’s a GI issue with bleeding, so i’m just waiting it out to see what happens.

Has anyone experienced anything like this before? I can only find references to bladder stones and uteran cancer, neither which apply to a male bunny that is bleeding from the anus. I’d love to hear any thoughts you may have. Thank you!

 

….and as i finish typing he has finished and is now eating lettuce that i put in the cage.

[BinkyBunny]

My first reaction would have been stones as Jack had a stone—not that he passed but the stone tore up the bladder causing him to urinate blood.
However it sounds like from what you are describing this is definitely coming from his anus. Have you noticed some hard misshapen poops from him? I don’t know about gi issues/gi cancer that may have caused blood from anus, but obviously something is going on and it’s not comfortable for you bunny, I would call your vet again and let him/her know of what happened tonight, as when a bunny is uncomfortable or in pain, it can lead to even more immediate serious reactions.

Did your vet take xrays?

I’m sorry that I am not much help, you can also try Dana Krempels, who is pretty good at answering health questions. Here is the direct link to the answer page– http://www.allexperts.com/user.cgi?…;catID=703

Keep us updated!

UPDATED  TO ASK:   I just thought of something…. Does  your bunny spray?  Jack  sprays and of course the urine coming out that way would still be showing the result of bladder stone and sludge issues. 

[Ham Sangwich]

Wow, thanks for the quick response! 

No, Jack doesn’t spray, he’s been fixed for a number of years now, and while he is occasionally lazy with the litterbox he isn’t a sprayer. We did not do xrays as the vet felt we should wait and see if the material he passed was a stone, tumor or regular tissue first. When it was determined it was gi tissue no abnormality it ruled out an xray as the xray won’t pick up the tissue material. We could try ultrasound or mri but very expensive, money that i don’t have. I’ll post over at your link and see what happens, thanks for the tip. It’s a very strange occurence.

This poor little guy can’t get a break the past few months. On his annual check-up we discovered he is almost totally blind now (I knew something was going on but couldn’t pinpoint it), then he got mites somehow (I think i somehow carried them home from the rabbit shelter i volunteer at, or something), then he continually scratches his eyes on hay and things because he can’t see but keeps his eye open, now this issue. Boy oh boy getting old doesn’t look like fun. He’s had 5 very safe and happy years with me after being rescued from being a classroom bunny that went home to a new child’s house every weekend (talk about trauma) so I guess i can’t feel too bad about it, but I’d like to keep him out of pain. i will keep you posted with any information i find out.

Thanks again!

A pic of Jack (right side) with his life-partner Chester.

[BinkyBunny]

Regarding the spray— I wish my bunny, also named Jack, didn’t spray! He’s been neutered for 6 years now and still loves to spray! Naughty boy.

Regarding your Jack’s eyes– are you noticing that they are swollen? As you said that he keeps scratching them on hay.  IF his eyes or the area around his eyes are swollen—Did you notice this swelliing about the same time that the anal bleeding issues were happening?

[Ham Sangwich]

one eye gets scratched and swollen, I believe he is blind in that eye completely. The other it seems he can see shapes at least. The eye problem began a few weeks after the first bout of bleeding. He has been to the Vet since the eye thing and he had a slighly scratched cornea at the time. I treat him with antibiotic eye drops as needed when it gets bad.

I’m surprised your Jack sprays still. I’ve come across probably hundreds of male bunnies at the shelter, living in close proximity to other males and females and as a rule once they are neutered the spraying stops. Lucky you that your Jack is so ‘unique’! 

[BinkyBunny]

Oh,yeah lucky me.  Jack is a very dominant bunny, and he uses spraying as his way to tell the cat, that the house and his gal Viv are his.  He also likes to remind Vivian how much he loves her and how she belongs to him.  Luckily, I love Jack so much!  He’s a wonderful bunny and he keeps his spray pretty much confined to the bunny room. Making it easier to clean up.  I clean up their area everyday anyway, so no biggie (he sprays now about two times a week)

  He is a rescue bunny,  but in his pre-rescue, he had already fathered kits, then he was turned into a shelter where he was neutered.   So I’m thinking he was neutered after some spraying habits got ingrained.

I just emailed the other leaders about this post and so hopefully tomorrow you will have some more opinions and advice about your Jack’s issue.

[jerseygirl]

Goodness! That would be an awful shock to discover your bunny this way. I’m glad to hear he seems to go back to being pain free in between.

I’m wondering if a fecal test and possibly blood panel might be a place to start. A fecal test would be able to identify any worms/bacteria/other infectious agents that might be responsible…. What they might be I have no clue. It’s sort of like ulcerative colitis but I don’t know if rabbits can have such a thing. I do know they can get intestinal ulcers. So the GI tissue he passed was healthy?  Was it like a polyp?

I was just reading about ulcerative colitis in humans and it’s thought it is an autoimmune disorder. So this then can lead to symptoms elsewhere in the body that is actually connected to this disorder: mouth ulcers, inflammation of eye, arthritis, skin lesions…to name a few.
This also make me wonder if the mites is connected to his current health issues. I have read that mite may be on healthy rabbits in low numbers and the immune system keeps them under control. When a rabbit is immuno compromised, this is when the mite numbers can rise.

Also with Binky Bunny’s suggestion to contact Dana Krempels, you or your vet might be able to consult with Dr Frances Harcourt-Brown (rabbit specialist in the UK in case your not familiar with her. ) http://www.any-uk-vet.co.uk/harcourt-brown/

[jerseygirl]

Posting again *roll eyes* Forgot to mention what a cute pair they are! Are they both a smaller breed?

This is a mystery so I keep thinking on it. Hope you don’t mind some brain storming.

Sorry if my question seems random. Has Jack been on antibiotics other then the common baytril? More the penicillin types? Also, could you give a bit more detail on his health history? Have you had him a long time. 9yr old is a great age so I do hope he can see out his senior years in good health!

[Ham Sangwich]

 Thanks again for the replies. Finally went to bed last night, he seemed to have settled down and this morning everything is normal, no new blood, he was eating his breakfast, drinking water and hopping around. He is very, very small weighing just over 2 lbs. His partner Chester weighs about 3 lbs. 

 

History, as far as I know, on Jack:

Classroom bunny lived on pine shavings first 4-5 years of life. Came to our rabbit shelter and I couldn’t resist him. 

Has had stasis a few times within the first year or so of him living with me. Has not had it since. Treated with baytril, reglan and metacam plus force feeding the critical care. 

Has had a growth under his belly since i adopted him. It was biopsied and was determined not to be cancerous, has not changed in size since I’ve had him. Vet found one more small one during his last check-up in July, but wasn’t too concerned. 

He is blind, probably happened in the last year. Behavior change started last 6 months so i think full blindness somewhere in that area. 

Late June he had the bleeding and passed the tissue.

Mites came on in early July. They were evident a week after I had helped apply meds to a shelter bunny that had mites. I suspect i brought them home with me somehow. Jack and his partner Chester both got mites at the same time. 

 

 

One other clue, when the spasms get most difficult and i assume painful he tries to push his butt all the way to the ground by pushing hard with his front legs so his bag legs compress (while hunching over) this causes him to sometimes flip over backwards completely. He’s quite a fragile, small bunny so it’s a bit upsetting. Even if I can figure out some pain meds i can at least administer during this issue i’d feel a little better. Rabbits are going to hide any sign of sickness as they are a prey animal so if he is making it this obvious it must be painful. 

I did ask the experts page so i’ll let you guys know what they say. Going to check out harcourt-brown now. Thank you!

 

Here’s another pic of him. It appears like he has a tail here, but that’s just my rabbit poking stick (when they hide under the bed out of reach!). 

[jerseygirl]

Wow! Cool markings! He is soo little!

So the straining is just when he has these spasms? I initially thought you meant he is straining to do normal toileting.

I’ve come across just one case where a rabbit had a polyp type tumor that caused some bleeding and straining. It was removed but it did recur.  Sorry, the poster did not give a medical name that you could look into further.

Edit: Here is what Dr Harcourt-Brown wrote on papillomas (benign tumors). http://books.google.com.au/books?ei…mp;f=false

[bunnyluvr]

I have no advice because I have no idea what is going on and it sounds like you are doing everything you can for him. Just wanted to send some healing vibes to your beautiful boy (((((((((((((((((Jack)))))))))))))))!! Hope you figure out what is going on with him soon. Poor little guy.

[RabbitPam]

I also don’t dare speculate, but want to wish you healing vibes to you sweet little guy.
I can’t help wondering if the growth under his belly, and the new one, are related to the piece he passed. Possibly he’s growing and passing more? Like gall stones or cysts?

Basically, it needs to be studied further by a vet, and at a minimum you should be able to get some painkillers to keep him from suffering when it occurs. I would be very scared to come across a lot of blood several times. Hopefully your vet will see him again soon and make a plan of action with you that will keep him comfortable if curing or detailed diagnosis isn’t possible.

He is beautiful looking, too.

[Ham Sangwich]

Posted By jerseygirl on 08/07/2010 06:30 AM

Wow! Cool markings! He is soo little!

So the straining is just when he has these spasms? I initially thought you meant he is straining to do normal toileting.

I’ve come across just one case where a rabbit had a polyp type tumor that caused some bleeding and straining. It was removed but it did recur.  Sorry, the poster did not give a medical name that you could look into further.

Edit: Here is what Dr Harcourt-Brown wrote on papillomas (benign tumors). http://books.google.com.au/books?ei…mp;f=false

 

Wow, great link. This could be a strong candidate. The only issue is it sounds like it should be visible, definitely not. I would imagine though, that it would not test as GI tissue, but i could be wrong. I’m putting this down on the list of candidates. Description from another source: 

Rectal Papilloma

? The mucosal rectoanal papilloma has been described primarily in older male rabbits and

demonstrated to be non-viral in origin. These are usually red, well-differentiated growths that are

benign.

? Histologically there are papillary proliferations of hyperplastic stratified squamous epithelium

supported on inflammatory fibrous connective tissue stroma.

 

Also listed on your source was the common tendency to bleed. That being said, doesn’t answer about what the spasm/straining is. 

 

Thanks bunnyluvr. Rabbitpam, it’s a thought, but the cyst/growths are subcutaneous, but not attached to any organs, etc. They can be moved around if you wanted to (I don’t do that, but the Vets have to examine what they are). Being that they are not attached they couldn’t get into his digestive system. Thanks though. 

Fortunately he’s been fine today. He passed some small poops that were quite wet today, no blood, just a bit wet. Not diarrhea, almost secal like. Seems normal. So odd. I have questions in to some experts and if it happens again i realized i have a video camera so i can shoot a video and post it up for more accuracy. If it happens again soon we’re definitely making an emergency vet visit. Unfortunately I’m unemployed and have spent $750 in the last 2 months between some regular health check-ups, the one emergency visit/lab work and the mite medication. Ugh. 

[jerseygirl]

I wonder why the those papillomas are more common in Bucks?

Please be clear I am hypothesizing ! Actually, reading more on rectal papillomas (as you do on a Sunday afternoon lol) it’s said they can be common and self resolve. I’m sort of wondering if this is what Jack has and one ruptured, whether it is could have been because of bladder issues as Binky Bunny suggested? Something like bladder sludge might account for spasms and straining while peeing. I imagine that could impact on the rectum also. Do you notice any strange postures when he goes to pee? OR if its more to do with a GI issue. Is his poop normal or more hardened?

An xray or ultrasound would be able to give more of a clue. Is there somewhere you could go that offers this service cheaper – perhaps a veterinary school? If possible you could get it done elsewhere then take the images back to your vet.

[RabbitPam]

Jerseygirl just beat me to my next suggestion. An unusual condition that requires a lot of investigation is good for student vets to see. If you can find a vet school located not far from you, that could really cut down your costs, plus they may want to try new procedures or use new equipment in order to learn. It would be mutually beneficial since they would probably pursue it at length.

Shooting a video is an excellent idea.

[bunnytowne]

my first thought was that he had a piece of glass inside.     Pretty far fetched after reading all these other responses

[Lintini]

I’d like to offer healing vibes as well and hope for a quick recovery {{{vibes}}} Hope you find out what’s going on soon!!!

[Ham Sangwich]

Thanks everyone. Well he’s back to being fine again. This has happened twice now, with about 1.5 months in between. Here is some information I received from Dana Krempels:

Dear Jim,

Poor little guy! But the vet is quite right about the metacam: not a good idea to give this when bleeding is a problem. If bun really seems distressed, ask about giving him some tramadol. But NSAIDs (and certainly corticosteroids) should be avoided until you know what’s going on.

If this were a human, the medical doctor would very likely order an endoscopic exam of the lower GI tract. This would be a very delicate operation in a rabbit, since the rectal tissues (and GI tissues in general) can be friable and easy to tear. You might want to ask if there is an avian vet in the vicinity who has a very *small* endoscope that could be used to safely see if your little guy has polyps in his rectum that are coming off and bleeding. It’s also not impossible that he has hemorrhoids, I suppose, though I’ve never heard of this in a rabbit.

At his age, he could have cancer, though I hope that’s not it. If the histopath of the tissue was normal, that might not be it, either.

As far as treatment is concerned…what do you do when you don’t know what this is? And short of endoscopic exam, I’m not really sure how you could safely ascertain what the problem is. Again, at his age I don’t think exploratory surgery would be a good idea at all.

Radiographs might show whether there are calcified lesions in the GI tract, and ultrasound might be a less invasive way to see if there are growths in the lower GI (if the blood is fresh, then this is likely a lower GI problem, not upper GI). In fact, ultrasound would probably be the safest first option to see what is going on.

I hope you can find a vet who will be able to help with some more detailed diagnostics.

Wish I could be of more help, but this is pretty unusual, all right!

Dana
Dana Krempels, Ph.D.
University of Miami Biology Department
H.A.R.E., Inc. of Miami, FL
dana@miami.edu
House Rabbit Society: http://www.rabbit.org
Rabbit health: http://hare.bio.miami.edu
*Your feedback is appreciated!*

[Sarita]

Sounds complicated! I know that an ultrasound is fairly expensive at my vet but I’ve had them done before. Are you considering doing an ultrasound?

[Ham Sangwich]

I am not sure. Right now i’m unemployed so expensive procedures are unfortunately not really on the table. We have a vet locally that has an ultrasound, but the staff aren’t properly trained on it so it’s kind of a crap-shoot. I could travel about 50 miles away where a clinic is well versed in using the ultrasound.

When this originally happened and I had the lab work done and diagnoses was with my secondary vet (primary vet was closed). I have had the paperwork faxed to my primary so my first plan of action is to see what he thinks I should do. The polyp possibility is probably very high, the only thing I wonder about is why there is so much straining going on. Straining, then relaxing, then straining, then relaxing.

[Author]

Messages