Omg, how terrifying!

I wonder if she might have an abscess somewhere, pressing on her airways?

I seem to remember reading about a rabbit that had an abscess on a tooth root, that was completely internal and hard to detect. Did the vet take x-rays of her head?

It seems really extreme for allergies…. but I suppose it’s possible.

I normally wouldn’t advocate for treating a rabbit with antibiotics because you can’t find a problem, but if the allergy theory gets thrown out, you might ask your vet about treating for an abscess or a hidden infection. It would likely involve giving sub-Q penicillin injections at home.

Did she have access to pellets during all these episodes. Bunnies can choke on pellets. My Bindi did twice and no longer gets hard pellets.

My bunny is also choking on hay so I’m curious about your rabbit. My rabbit also had her teeth trimmed but still chokes. I’m going to get x rays done to see if we find anything but I wonder if your rabbit has an issue in her gums or the roots of her teeth where it would be hard to detect. I hope you figure out whats wrong so she gets better soon!

Hello.
my wife found this forum because we have recently had two choking episodes with our rabbit annabell. she is a ten year old new zeland rabbit with no real ongoing health issues, aside from some occasional bad gas and bouts with stasis.
the first episode happened on monday afternoon of this week. i was in the kitchen and i heard a commotion coming from the area where she lives. i found her in her little hidey house, kind of stumbling around, making an awful gagging/choking sound, with drool and mucus coming out from her nose, all over her face. i tried to pat her on the back and attempted to move her up and down in an effort to dislodge what was maybe preventing her from breathing. we rushed her to our vet (a half hour away) and they did x-rays and an exam and didn’t see anything out of the ordinary. the vet gave her an antibiotic, and we took her home, assuming it was an isolated incident. it took her awhile to come around to eating hay again. with in a day or so, she was mostly back to normal, but sneezing an awful lot.

the next episode happened earlier today, thursday. my wife called me at work to say she just witnessed another choking incident. she did the Centrifugal Swing to try and help her. she seemed to respond better this time and since this happened, has been eating off and on, and was accepting of a treat. our regular vet is not available today (because why would he be) and he said when we talked to him last the next option would be to sedate her and for him to look at her back teeth more closely. we are afraid to have her sedated because of her age, and because her sister passed away while under sedation for a tooth trim.

we are not sure what to do next. we are afraid and stressed. she only eats oxbow timothy hay that i try to inspect very carefully for quality before i buy it and she gets cilantro as a treat. she’s on a bunch of meds for arthritis, liver enzymes being high (though they are better now), and a probiotic.

why is this happening?!?!

That must have been scary! Does she eat any pellets at all?

I think your vet is right that her teeth really need to be looked. I have an almost 11 year old bun so I understand your hesitation to put her under. If you do decide to go that route, I would definitely do pre-anaesthetic bloodwork to check if she would be able to handle it.

she doesn’t eat pellets. just hay and cilantro as a treat. both times we’re pretty sure it was happening while she was eating hay.

we can’t get in to our regular vet at all, so my wife found a place a little farther away that has three rabbit savvy vets on staff. we are taking her there to at least have her looked at to see if she’s healthy enough to stand a sedation. 

Good luck with your vet visit.

hi everyone
just thought i’d give an update. the new vet we went to spent a lot of time with annabell and did some spine work and chiropractic adjustments on her neck. she’s been sneezing less, and slowly getting an appetite back? we’re trying to be optimistic.

my wife found this old thread- https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/125783/Default.aspx
and it sounds kind of similar in places. annabell had another episode today and we are at a loss on what to do next.

Posted By Annabell on 4/05/2018 9:49 AM

Hello.
my wife found this forum because we have recently had two choking episodes with our rabbit annabell. she is a ten year old new zeland rabbit with no real ongoing health issues, aside from some occasional bad gas and bouts with stasis.
the first episode happened on monday afternoon of this week. i was in the kitchen and i heard a commotion coming from the area where she lives. i found her in her little hidey house, kind of stumbling around, making an awful gagging/choking sound, with drool and mucus coming out from her nose, all over her face. i tried to pat her on the back and attempted to move her up and down in an effort to dislodge what was maybe preventing her from breathing. we rushed her to our vet (a half hour away) and they did x-rays and an exam and didn’t see anything out of the ordinary. the vet gave her an antibiotic, and we took her home, assuming it was an isolated incident. it took her awhile to come around to eating hay again. with in a day or so, she was mostly back to normal, but sneezing an awful lot.

the next episode happened earlier today, thursday. my wife called me at work to say she just witnessed another choking incident. she did the Centrifugal Swing to try and help her. she seemed to respond better this time and since this happened, has been eating off and on, and was accepting of a treat. our regular vet is not available today (because why would he be) and he said when we talked to him last the next option would be to sedate her and for him to look at her back teeth more closely. we are afraid to have her sedated because of her age, and because her sister passed away while under sedation for a tooth trim.

we are not sure what to do next. we are afraid and stressed. she only eats oxbow timothy hay that i try to inspect very carefully for quality before i buy it and she gets cilantro as a treat. she’s on a bunch of meds for arthritis, liver enzymes being high (though they are better now), and a probiotic.

why is this happening?!?!

If I may ask, what medications is she on for the arthritis? I am looking after a rabbit currently that has had 2 choking episodes while here. He is on prednisolone which I discovered can cause some swallowing difficulties. That said, he is still on this and there haven’t been any further choking *touch wood!*. I also suspected he might have something going on in his chest because of the way he sits at times. 

All speculation on my part.. 

I do agree a check of her teeth and mouth under sedation would be next step. I absolutely understand your fear at doing so. I have an 11yr old rabbit and feel the same way. If he needed to be sedated at any time, but then passed away, I try tell myself that would at least be a gentle way for him to go. But we want to hold on to them forever, of course.

Maybe some light gas sedation would be enough? The vet would need access enough to not only check molars but the oral tissues, all around the tongue and upper palate also. 

Have you tried getting different hay and seeing if that makes a difference?  Does she manage fresh grass okay, if that is available? 

it turns out she had a piece of hay lodged in the very back teeth, and that was causing a problem, as well as some minor points to her far back teeth. we worked with a different vet who mildly sedated her and did the procedure in less than 20 mins. she’s still very groggy and out of it, but i think she’s better now.

I hope this fixes the problem. Must have been uncomfortable for her.

Yes, Im glad you discovered what was causing this. Hopefully that area is not a food trap but if it recurs, you’ll know where to look first!

@lifeasweknowit, any update on your rabbit. Is she continuing to do better on the Orchard hay now?

Just kidding everyone. She started choking again last night and it lasted for over an hour.
We are now in the car going to see specialist in another state

Oh no. Sending good health {{{vibes}}} for Annabell. Keep us updated on what the vet discovers.

Oh No!!!! I’m so sorry to hear that! Drive safe and keep us posted!

Oh my, how scary I hope you can get to the bottom of this.

This is really random, but my husband has strictures in his esophagus, and sometimes he has trouble swallowing as his esophagus will kind of seize up. he’s never had the treatment done, but it involves stretching out that section of the esophagus with a balloon. It’s genetic, so his dad has had the procedure once or twice.

If you rule out other causes it might be worth asking about!

How scary. So many vibes for (((((Annabell))))) Keep is posted.

Dana, that’s interesting. Could absolutely be worth asking about.

So sorry…. (ANNABELL))))

OH no!   I am so sorry to hear this.  I hope another vet can figure it out. 

It’s hard to really know what is going on and different problems, (infection, allergies, something lodged in mouth nasal area, tooth issues, certain type of meds that JG mentioned), may result in similar symptoms.   

Recently I had some issues with Aria — Not choking but behavior that seemed like something was bothering her nose or throat, as one time she opened her mouth slightly and kept pushing her paw against her nose.  Another time she just opened her mouth (not to yawn), but just opened — but not choking or in distress.   Just weird behavior I hadn’t seen before.  This did accompany sneezing…lots of sneezing, especially when she was “sniffing” for a treat on the ground that I put down, and also while she was eating….but no discharge. Other than that, she was normal.   I took her to the vet and Aria, as usual, was VERY good about letting her look at her teeth.   She is the only rabbit I have ever had that doesn’t seem to get annoyed at the scope deep in her mouth.  The vet was able to check all around and back in her throat.   She also took a look in her nose, but obviously could only see so much.   Looked normal, but she decided to do a flush of her nose just in case.   Nothing crazy came out.   

So we had blood work drawn.  Vet emailed me the results and suggested plan of action – copy of email in blue: 

 Since then (3/23), Aria’s sneezing gradually got better and now no more sneezing,  and do not see any of those weird behaviors now that seem like something is stuck in her throat or mouth.   

While there may be many different causes for a similar behavior, it might be helpful to see if there are any similarities too – maybe there could be a common denominator.  Also important to note: Being that we have rabbits — we may be feeding the same or similar things and so we can’t jump to conclusions about that either, but I still think it’s good to compare.  So hence the long post.  Sorry. 

ARIA  

SYMPTOMS:  Sneezing while sniffing for treat and while eating. Open mouth behavior, like something stuck in nose, once when sniffing and once when eating. 

AGE: Senior – Minimum 9 years old.  Exact age unknown as she was adopted with limited info on past. 

PERSONALITY TYPE:  Explorer. Active. Bunny Destructo.  She likes to be busy chewing when she’s not lounging.   She’s an active senior…when she’s not actively lounging.  

DIET:  

Pellet:Oxbow Essentials Adult – Timothy (I recently switched to Oxbow Garden Select) 

Hay:Oxbow Blend:  Timothy/Orchard Blend

Greens: Mint, Dill, and Organic Cilantro, Parsley, Dandelion Greens, Romaine Lettuce

Water:  NOT a big water drinker.  She eats a lot of greens, but doesn’t drink much water. 

MEDS/RX: NONE

LITTER: 

Oxbow Eco-Straw (She has no access to eating it as I use a screen over her litter topped with hay. 

How often changed:  Every few days.  But in all honesty, during the time she was sneezing I may have gone longer –  like 5 days as both my spouse and I were working a ton of insane hours for a few weeks.    As soon as the sneezing started, I worried that was the issue and got some help to make sure her litter was changed more often. It is important to clean change litter boxes regularly to prevent UR irritation – more so, due to the urine.  

TREATS:  (I have a list, but they are not all given at same time. One type per day usually) 

• Dried Papaya:  Was sneezing a lot during this time — I believe just coincidental as I give her Papaya now too and no reaction) 
• Oxbow Joint Support:  Ditto above comments
• Organic Fresh Banana (size of a U.S. quarter)
• Organic Baby Carrot

HOUSING/FLOORING

Aria has a full bunny room 15 x 11 feet.  

Carpeting and wood floor. 

Cardboard playhouses, Willow Tent, Wood Boxes and wood ramps.

TOYS: 

Toys that consist of Yucca, Poplar, Willow and Apple sticks, Sea Grass Mats 

hi everyone
we made it back late last night, and the specialist did a CT scan on her and found one of her nostrils was inflamed/irritated, and then there was a spot of something on one of her lungs. we have to wait for a nose culture to come back next week to know what is really going on but the vet seemed to think this was all some kind of respiratory infection. she’s on ANOTHER antibiotic along with the first one we were given on monday. we also are supposed to nebulize her once a day.

she made a bunch of weird poops during the nigh but this morning she’s mad/grouchy and not really eating, which is a super great thing to wake up to

Oh Annabell
That is interesting about her one nostril being inflamed – Rabbits are nose breathers (which I did not know until a vet told me) so maybe that’s related if she isn’t breathing fully while eating?
And oh no – maybe the weird poops and grumpy/ not really eating it that she’s still annoyed from the vet visit and long car drive yesterday?
Hopefully she comes around quickly to eating again.

And thank you for keeping us all posted! I think we are all very invested in your journey! And LOTS of healing vibes to your girl!!

we force fed her critical care twice today, once this morning, and she pooped a little more, and then once again before we left for the day to try to give her some peace and quiet. i did buy a nebulizer so i have to get that set up tonight and try to put her in a box and run it. we think that she will hopefully come around and get her appetite back. her appetite wasn’t great on wednesday before the super severe choking incident, and then since she was in the car all day yesterday, we think she just needs time. but we are still worried about our little doodle bug.

Poor girl, and poor you! It does sound like you are getting close to a diagnosis though, so that’s great! It all must be so stressful though.

Giving her some bene-bac in her CC might be helpful with all the meds she’s on. My bunnies really like the taste of it, and i often give it when they have weird poops after a stressful event.

Posted By DanaNM on 4/13/2018 2:01 PM

Giving her some bene-bac in her CC might be helpful with all the meds she’s on.

DanaNM – What bene-bac do you give? I tried googling it and find so many different versions. 

And big hugs to you Anna!! This all must be so hard and so scary!!!

I like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/PetAg-Bene-Bac-Pet-Gram-Syringe/dp/B0002ASS0W/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1523650911&sr=8-5&keywords=bene-bac

or this one (same product, just more syringes):
https://www.amazon.com/Bene-Bac-Probiotic-Pet-Syringe-Safety/dp/B00F0W2DNU/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1523650911&sr=8-8&keywords=bene-bac

The measured syringe makes dosing easing, and the buns like the taste of the gel. (My cat likes it too!)

hey i should mention she gets ben-e-bac regularly since she had some bad gas/motility issues at times. however, by the time we got home late last night, we were really exhausting her goodwill after a 4hr car ride back, plus invasive exam, to give her all her meds. the ben-e-bac she usually loves, but she was just futzing around with the tip and i squirted it on her chin. i should have tried harder to get her to try again but i was so tired.

we will try again tonight. she did eat hay for maybe two minutes? just now and made some less mangled but still small poops.

Oh wow – I’m glad you found that the swinging motions helps, but OMG that is just so scary. I would be scared to go to sleep or leave the house.
I just wonder what this can all be.
Big hugs your way!!

I’m wondering if maybe she’s just having seizures. I read the post you made in the habitat section, and that’s what it sounded like to me. It doesn’t seem like choking at all but seizures.

I think A&B could be onto something. If physically, all exams and assessments come out clean, it could be a neurological issue which, just like in humans, is really not something that can be confirmed unless we create a rabbit MRI-machine and stick your bun bun in there. Seizures are the result of mishap neurons firing, and that’s something that is probably impossible to treat in a rabbit, unless the root cause is an infection that can be treated.

Just like there are variations in when humans can have seizures, it may be worth considering factors surrounding each episode. For some humans, it is literally quite random when it occurs. For others, it occurs at times of high emotion, whether it’s stress, happiness, frustration, etc.. It’s also good to keep an eye out for whether the intensity/duration of the episodes are changing.

— All of the above just to consider if seizures seem to fit the bill better for what’s happening.

Thank you Wick for embellishing! It just seems like there’s no other explanation for it, and you can rule out the usual causes for choking. The way you describe is what seizures are sorta like in humans. My best friend has seizures, which is why I was like ohhhh this sounds familiar. If it is seizures, the best thing to do would be just to make your bun as comfortable as possible before and after it happens. Also try noting anything she may be doing prior to an episode occurring. Think of it almost like an aura that migraine patients get. When you’re near her when it happens, look for anything unusual about her up to 60 minutes before it happens. It might be able to help you know if she’s going to start seizing.

Seizures can present themselves in numerous forms in humans, so you it would be safe to assume the same is true for bunnies. Not every human gets grand-mal seizures which involve violent shaking. Some have petite-mal which is more just blanking out. There’s a lot of in between too. They aren’t a one size fits all kinda of thing. It’s possible that she could have a mixture of symptoms from different types of seizures. The swing could be helping her to snap out of the seizure.

hey so it’s been a minute since i’ve updated this, and i’ve seen a lot of other responses come through about the other folks who have seen and experienced choking or seizures or whatever. things have been PRETTY terrible since we got back from the vet in madison, and that was two weeks ago. for a while we thought it was the antibiotics that were causing annabell not to want to eat, but she’s been off them since sunday afternoon, and her appetite is still awful. she’ll only nibble on hay occasionally, but wants to eat other things like cilantro, or these hay cookie things i bought from the binky bunny store, or pellets, which we are dolling out in very small amounts since she has never had them, and chew toys. but not hay. and it’s terrible. we are force feeding her critical care four times a day and we don’t know what is going on with her or why this is happening.

she hasn’t had a choking episode in over two weeks, which is good, and she still sneezes on occasion, which is not good. but we just want to know what is going on with her or if she’ll ever go back to ‘normal.’

Stepping outside the situations context, her appetite sounds somewhat normal. Wanting veggies and pellets over hay, and being force feed critical care would also dissuade hay appetite.

What is her feeding schedule? I wonder if with all of what’s going on and the diet changes, she actually has just become very disengaged with hay. It may be worth trying to slightly stretch non-hay eating food feeding. Not for a full 12hrs like I usually suggest (considering your rabbit’s condition), but maybe 6 hrs?

we usually feed her the critical care every four to five hours. the longest she goes is overnight, which is from a 9pm feeding until a 5:30 or 5 a.m. feeding. lately she has been producing a lot of poop by the time i get up in the morning, but i can’t tell if she’s had that much to eat, or if she’s just gone into the pan and nibbled a little and then moved along.

we were forcing the critical care because we were hoping she’d come back to the hay on her own. it’s weird because she still gets excited about the sound of the hay bag, and stands up like she wants it when i’m putting it in her litter pan. then she’s like, nah that’s okay.