Bonding Bonded Mother and Son with Brother...

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BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

This topic has 15sd replies, 3 voices, and was last updated 6 years, 7 months ago by Sirius&Luna.

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- 02/10/2018 at 8:33 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  Sorry if the subject sounds confusing.
  
  I have a 3 year old fixed female bonded to her 2 year old neutered son. The other neutered son lives in a pen attracted to theirs and has for 2 years now.
  
  I planned on rehoming the other one which is why he has his own pen but it never worked out and I really need to bond the three together – Gus is lonely!!!
  
  Gus and the mom get along very well. Gus and brother Tank do NOT get along despite efforts, and even living in attached pens will still try to bite each other through the squares once in awhile.
  
  With that info – is it impossible that they will ever be able to live in one pen? I have built a brand new large enclosure in a brand new house that I want to introduce to all 3. I have no idea what to do to ensure the best safety, or possible techniques to maybe make the boys behave together.
  
  All input helps!!!!
- 02/10/2018 at 9:05 PM
  DanaNM
  Moderator
  9054 posts
  hmmmm, when you say “despite efforts”, what have you tried?
  
  I think the first step would be to have Gus and Tank go on a quick “speed date” in VERY neutral space to see how they react. If they don’t immediately attack, then you would want to do cage or litter box swaps. The concern is always that the third bunny can disrupt the bonded pair… so it’s something you have to be prepared for. You might end up with three singles while you try to bond all three.
  
  Since they are still aggressive towards each other after two years of living side by side, I would be a little concerned. It might be possible to have a trio, but it might be tough!
  
  Have you considered adopting a 4th to bond with Gus and keeping two pairs?
  
  . . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.
- 02/11/2018 at 6:52 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  So I have had a house with my boyfriend for the past year and a half so they live at my parents in my old bedroom. We are just finishing up on building a room for them.
  
  None of them have been to our house. The few times I put Tank and Gus together I did so in a pen in my mom’s living room. Maybe because it’s still the same house they had issues.
  
  Most of the time I can barely handle 3 lol and I really don’t have bunny-proof spot for a second pen for a 4th.
- 02/11/2018 at 6:55 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  When I bring them to our house should I set up a small pen or a large pen, with or without obstacles of sorts?
  Or what are your suggestions?
  I have also heard that taking them for a nice fast ride in a car together could work.
- 02/12/2018 at 3:47 PM
  DanaNM
  Moderator
  9054 posts
  So, keep in mind I’m not recommending you start sessions yet, just a quick speed date to make sure that Tank and Gus don’t hate each other outright.
  
  I recommend a large pen, with no obstacles or hiding spots. Small spaces can tend to make buns feel threatened and resort to fighting (rather than fleeing).
  
  Place both bunnies in at the same time. Do NOT allow any fighting. If they come nose to nose, you can pet both to swap scents. Mounting is OK as long as the other one is OK with it. Do not allow chasing, biting, circling.
  
  I like to have oven mitts on my hands for first introductions just in case things get feisty.
  
  Car rides can work well, but I don’t recommend them for first dates. Rather I like them as a tactic once things are underway with bonding sessions.
  
  I really recommend reading through some trio bonding journals and posts on this site. If you google “binky bunny trio bonding” you will find lots of results. Some people work with all three rabbits at the same time, others focus on pairings first. Here are a couple informative posts and journals:
  
  https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/127885/Default.aspx
  https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/111909/Default.aspx
  https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/110302/Default.aspx
  https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/146284/afpg/7/Default.aspx
  https://binkybunny.com/FORUM/tabid/54/aft/145198/Default.aspx
  
  . . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.
- 03/10/2018 at 1:40 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  I just got back from vacation and going to start today.
  
  Thanks for the tips. They will be in a large open pen in a house they’ve never been in before with a dog who has met them but they don’t like him yet like my dog.
  
  Should I leave Delilah at home for a few times, or include her? Should she be in a kennel near the pen maybe or will that make Tank her mate territorial?
- 03/10/2018 at 7:32 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  Well, I don’t think it went well.
  They were stressed at first then they both got comfortable in the pen. They groomed themselves and ate snacks a few feet away from each other. But there were 3 occasions they walked nose to nose then squeaked and started fighting – which I ended immediately. There was no mounting or circling prior. Just met noses and went at it.
  
  The “play date” was about an hour.
  
  I think I need to rehome Tank and Delilah then find Gus a girlfriend he gets along with. Although I believe Gus is an aggressor because he is very adventurous.
  
  He has only had one date with a female and he walked right into her kennel to say hi! And she didn’t like that!
  
  I just can’t tell if Gus wants to be a single bunny or what to do. Should I bring Gus into our new home with a new pen and then try to find him a girlfriend or keep him at my mom’s until he finds a friend and then move them in together at the same time?
- 03/11/2018 at 5:01 AM
  Sirius&Luna
  Participant
  2320 posts
  You went far far too long for the first date. It should’ve been 5 minutes maximum, and it sounds like they did well at first (grooming themselves and ignoring each other). Once they’ve fought once, you should pet them and end the date. Ideally you should end it before they fight. Did you pet them wen they went nose to nose?
  
  Why would you rehome the bonded pair?
- 03/11/2018 at 1:02 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  Ahh, $*&!. I didn’t realize *that* quick of a speed date.
  When they started scuffling I broke them up using a empty paper towel roll. Just poked them, and said HEY, lol…
  
  It was never my intention to keep Gus and I only ever found one person intersted in him. He us unique! I think Tank and Delilah would be easier to rehome although it makes me uncomfortable and sad to see them go. Some back story – I rescued Delilah from living outside in Washington weather in a medium sized dog kennel at 6 months old. They had been feeding her bread and just a horrific diet. I was told she was male but then 2 weeks later she gave birth. All babies got adopted except poor Gus. He was always timid but has seriously improved and is a silly, wonderful boy. He is our favorite. I don’t have space for two pens now and I also feel sad that Gus doesn’t have a mate. I think he’d like one… he cuddles a fleece blanket but I also don’t know if that correlates to being lonely.
- 03/11/2018 at 1:06 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  I guess we just both have decided we know we are the best home for Gus and his personality. Delilah and Tank are easy, relaxed bunnies wheras Gus is total opposite.
- 03/12/2018 at 5:33 AM
  Sirius&Luna
  Participant
  2320 posts
  From the sound of that date, I wouldn’t say it was hopeless, as they didn’t immediately go to attack. I think had you ended it earlier, there wouldn’t have been aggression.
  
  So, if you can commit to short dates and slowly increasing the time they spend together, I think there is a chance of it working. But it will be a month+ of effort.
  
  If you wanted to get a mate for Gus later, it would still be the same process and still might not work, so I would give the trio another go first before you rehome the pair.
  
  If you wanted to try and bond again, I would do literal 5 minutes sessions a few times a day, and gradually increase the time they spend together. You need to teach them that they can be together without it being aggressive, and short short dates are a good way to force positive behaviour. Don’t be afraid to intervene and pet them for the early dates, so that again, they associate each other with positive things.
- 03/12/2018 at 7:21 PM
  DanaNM
  Moderator
  9054 posts
  I agree that it doesn’t sound hopeless at all, just like you pushed too hard on the first session.
  
  When they go nose to nose you need to be right there with them, and pet pet pet pet so they stay calm.
  
  You also didn’t really mention where the bonding pen was, but it should be in a completely neutral space, and not within sight of any of the buns’ areas.
  
  . . . The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.
- 03/13/2018 at 7:35 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  Ok got it.
  
  I took them to my house where they will all hopefully be living. I did not put them in their bedroom though as to keep that neutral, I just set up a pen in the living room. Neither had been to the house before.
- 04/07/2018 at 9:06 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  Weird behavior. One recent meet they met noses (I was petting both at the same time) but they squeeked at each other then Gus grabbed a tuft of Tanks fur AND ATE IT. Completely ate it. I couldn’t even grab it out of his mouth wtf!
  The most recent meet they had they sat about 4 feet away from each other and just ignored each other and didn’t get close.
- 04/07/2018 at 9:07 PM
  pnwk
  Participant
  22 posts
  I am 90% given up on this.
- 04/09/2018 at 4:54 AM
  Sirius&Luna
  Participant
  2320 posts
  Ignoring each other is a good sign, it’s much better than attacking. But bonding is a long and tiring process, and if you can’t commit to at least a month of this, then it’s probably not going to work.
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