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BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum BONDING No longer time limited, but still could use some guidance (see last post)

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    • Adam
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        I don’t have the facilities to give two rabbits hostile to each other a good enough life, in my opinion.  I adopted a younger male for a 2.5 year old female who lost her mate recently.

        But can’t give him back after two weeks.  

        The new male is really sweet, and I won’t keep him if I can’t give him the life he deserves.

        Help me quickly get them to get along.  So far, snuggles, the girl has gotten angry when she saw the male running around our livingroom while she was caged, though she’s more curious when she sees him caged and she’s running around.  That was day 1.  

        I didn’t do any reading up on this beforehand, I spoke to a vet and asked a question in a couple places here and no one mentioned anything about months of pre-bonding.

        Thanks in advance.


      • sarahthegemini
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          I don’t understand why you have such a tight time frame. Pre bonding is a very important step that can’t be skipped. You also need to let new bun settle in before anything else. There’s very little chance that you could create a successful bond between 2 buns if you don’t allow this to happen.


        • Wick & Fable
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            It’s unfortunate that the pre-bonding & bonding process timeline was neglected to be mentioned in your past forum posts. I think many people (including myself) did not explicitly state this because you indicated you’ve had bonded rabbits before. I still feel saddened for your recent loss, but it’s great to hear you’re going to try the bonding itself.

            Would re-arrangement of furniture temporarily help in making your dwelling more suited for the bonding process? It’s very clear you care about your female rabbit, so if such arrangements could be made and tolerated for a few months, it’d be best.

            The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.


          • Adam
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              Posted By Wick on 12/11/2017 12:33 PM

              It’s unfortunate that the pre-bonding & bonding process timeline was neglected to be mentioned in your past forum posts. I think many people (including myself) did not explicitly state this because you indicated you’ve had bonded rabbits before. I still feel saddened for your recent loss, but it’s great to hear you’re going to try the bonding itself.

              Would re-arrangement of furniture temporarily help in making your dwelling more suited for the bonding process? It’s very clear you care about your female rabbit, so if such arrangements could be made and tolerated for a few months, it’d be best.

              I don’t know that I indicated I had bonded any.  I didn’t really do anything, maybe I thought I did when I was fairly new to this.  I just got 2 rabbits at the same time from the same place.  They had a short period of time where they were a little hostile to each other, but otherwise lived together their entire lives.

              I think maybe I just made a mistake getting another rabbit.  I had always been told that it’s sort of unkind to just have a single rabbit.  I work for 10 hours, I sleep for 8 when I can manage.  I have other things to take care of for a lot of the remaining six.  Weekends are nice though.  I just don’t feel like I can give a single rabbit the attention it deserves by myself. 

              I actually just thought snuggles would appreciate the company since she’s never had to be on her own.

              I can try not to be judgemental about how other bunnies live, but I feel like to keep them separate would require even more neglect as my remaining time is split between them, and even more difficulty giving them run around time.  

              In the days following our bunny’s passing, Snuggles went through a GI stasis recovery and then was very friendly, like more than she had ever been.  I’m giving up a lot to try to make sure she isn’t lonely for 18+ hours a day, but making another bunny  (much younger) suffer with limited freedom and forcing it to be alone is just too much.

              So I have to make a decision by the 23rd.  To just keep the second rabbit for months without knowing if it will work out would be very negligent.


            • sarahthegemini
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                Whilst I agree that a bun is almost always happier with a bun-panion, bonding is a very involved process and you need to be completely committed. You need to dedicate months to letting bun settle, pre bonding and then actual sessions as well as the bond cementing phase, regardless. You need to decide if you are prepared to do that, as it does sound like your girl will really benefit from another friend.


              • Deleted User
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                  Another option could be once the prebonding has finished, you can send them to a professional bonder. My boys are alone for a similar amount of time, and my husband and I don’t really have the time to bond them ourselves, so in a few months they are heading to a bonder. They ask for a donation to rabbit rescues as a “payment”. So if you’re low on time and don’t mind letting a new bun settle and prebond for a few months, then a bonder could help.


                • Vienna Blue in France
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                    I agree with Asriel as that is the road I went down : a bunny bonder.
                    Not because I didn’t have the time, but didn’t have the knowledge to make it work – and so someone did it and it’s greeeat !!!

                    First question – is the male neutered?

                    If you can’t give him back after 2 weeks now, how will 4 weeks feel … lol (I know cos I’ve just done this with a rescue dog! A sucker for difficult cases!!)


                  • Boston's Mama
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                      If we had bunny binders here I would so do it!
                      We don’t have that option unfortunately …
                      I really hope you can come up with the best option for you and them , bonding is tough but so is guilt of knowing your time is limited
                      My bunny always has someone at home between us all but we still go back and forth about whether to get another bunny to bond with him…
                      Bonding is long , and it isn’t easy – and in some cases it doesn’t work – but one thing is for sure and that is that pre bonding is important and should never be skipped. I’ve had a failed bond attempt and that was after 4 months of prebonding , they fought badly instantly at first session – I can’t imagine how it would have been if I hadn’t got them use to each other with so much prebonding.
                      If I was to go into attempting with another bunny I would absolutely allow a few months prebonding


                    • Sirius&Luna
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                        I assume it’s the rescue that’s giving you the time limitation? It’s a shame that a lot of rescues don’t seem willing to allow people the time needed for bonding, often resulting in people rushing bonding and fights happening.

                        Have you tried talking to them about the fact that you need more time? Perhaps you could agree that if it didn’t work with this bunny you could return him and try a different male bunny instead, so they would still have the same number of bunnies.

                        In my experience, time really is key to bonding. My female was SO aggressive when I first brought home my male, but over time, and lots of pre bonding, i was able to bond them. It took me 4 months from bring him home to them being bonded though.


                      • Deleted User
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                          I really wanted to have a friend for my female because I work 8 hours a day. I didn’t really have the space to keep two free range buns separately, but I made it work with baby gates (although it was a huge pain) for a temporary fix. I did prebonding for almost 3 months, and then tried bonding for at least 3 hours each day for another month. I ended up having to give up because it was just too much effort to put in while I work full time and attend college full time. Also, the process is extremely stressful. It just wasn’t feasible for me to keep them as separate singles in my 1 bedroom apartment, and have to hurdle over a baby gate just to get into my bedroom, so I rehomed the little male bunny that I got as her friend. It was a really tough decision because I had bonded with him and I really liked him. I thought that three months of prebonding would make it a sure success… but unfortunately, there are no guarantees that two buns will get along. If you know that it’s not possible to keep them separate long term and that you don’t really have that much time to devote to it, I advise you not to. That is my opinion from a standpoint that trying this in two weeks is almost sure to fail, and the fact that it is a very intense process without any guarantee that the pair will like each other. I had a lot of positive signs with my two at first, but the last week the boy just kept starting fights with my female… the final straw was when I picked her up and he started attacking my feet. If you aren’t prepared for it, I say wait until you are, because it can be a real nightmare.


                        • Adam
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                            Thank you all for the advice. I still feel lost, like bonding is sort of a crapshoot.

                            After talking with the SO, we’ve decided not to worry about the two week limit. We will try for a few months.

                            However, I have a question that I hope someone with experience (and not just based on internet info) can answer:

                            The new bun is not neutered. And my boy Ajay who passed, was neutered. I read about how it would make him better potty trained, behave better, more friendly, etc. But none of that was true. And over time he became less and less trusting of me and my SO.

                            But snuggles, the female, despite being spayed, constantly longed for sexual attention from him, trying to shove her face under his stomach and crotch, of which he would get annoyed and move away.

                            I have to wonder for their relationship, if it wouldn’t work better for him to still have sexual drive. Plus, right now he’s a very sweet boy who actually wants to be petted. Snuggles likes it, but doesn’t seek it out, and Ajay only liked or put up with it when in a carrier or being fed.

                            I was petting the new bun and noticed him getting aroused and it made me wonder, if he can no longer get aroused, will he no longer want pets as much?

                            Anyone try a spayed-yet-seemingly-still-horny female with intact male buns bonding before, or give advice on other reasons he should be neutered that haven’t been mentioned (these are indoor only buns).


                          • Sirius&Luna
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                              The problem with an unneutered male bun is that he’ll try and hump her, she’ll end up having false pregnancies, and likely she’ll get annoyed with him.

                              It is not wise to keep him unneutered.

                              Your females behaviour doesn’t sound sexual to me – it sounds like she was demanding grooms, and therefore dominance.She is also probably angry with him because she can smell his hormones and its making her hormonal.

                              I also don’t think Ajay would have become less friendly because he was neutered. Young rabbits are often super friendly and cuddly, and as they grow up they become more self sufficient. If you put sufficient time into your relationship though, most bunnies will still enjoy your attention and seek you out. My bunnies hop onto the sofa to see me, because they know that there’s normally head rubs and treats when they do.

                              I really would strongly advise against trying to bond an unneutered male with a spayed female.


                            • sarahthegemini
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                                I agree with Sirius&Luna, it’s so risky trying to bond when one is still intact. Hormones cause unpredictableness. On top of that, false pregnancy can be very traumatising for the doe and that can also lead to aggression.

                                I also have to say I am struggling to believe that being neutered is what caused Ajay to become untrusting of you and your partner. Also your female shoving her head under his tummy is not sexual. It’s dominance.

                                I think it’s quite selfish to want him to remain intact so that he still wants human attention (which isn’t even true btw) It won’t be safe to bond him so he’d have to live without a bun-panion just so you can have some one on one human time (which doesn’t compare to bun-on-bun time)


                              • Deleted User
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                                  Every bunny has a different personality, and it’s entirely possible that your last male either didn’t have much interest in human attention or he experienced something that made him wary of humans. My female was spayed and she still likes to have lots of human attention, although she is a single bunny. Some bunnies are just more “antisocial” I think.

                                  If you want a successful bond, it is important to get him neutered. When a male is a single rabbit, you can get away with not neutering (although I don’t advise it). But in bonding you definitely want to eliminate those hormones that cause them to act a little crazy. Your male will have a much more fulfilling life when those hormones are removed and he will be able to get along better with the female.

                                  As far as bonding goes, I can’t stress enough that it is a lengthy process and there is no guarantee that they will get along. If you rush things, it will be even worse. And since he is not neutered, you’ll have to get him neutered and then wait at least 1 month (to be safe) that his hormones have dissipated. Neutering is not an instant fix, and residual hormones will cause him to still act as though he is unneutered for at least several weeks, up to a month. So you won’t even be able to start your bonding until you’ve neutered and waited a month. (During that waiting period you can prebond). So it’s really going to be a long process and I just want to make sure you are ready for that.


                                • sarahthegemini
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                                    Definitely agree that some buns are more social than others. Neither my girl nor my boy changed personalities after spaying and neutering. Buttercup has always been more interested in human interaction whereas Peanut wasn’t quite as comfortable with it. But as he grew to trust me more and more, well he’s a little love bug! With him, time and patience was key. I also suspect that being bonded with Buttercup has helped bring out his confidence.


                                  • Adam
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                                      Despite the fact that I think neutering is the better option, I don’t appreciate some of the things you guys have said. If I want the bunny to be more friendly to me, it’s not my benefit but both of ours. Ajay was very stressed whenever it was time to go upstairs to run around in the livingroom. I spent a lot of time with him, gave him all my love, and I don’t appreciate suggestions that I didn’t do enough or had something to do with his lack of trust.

                                      Further, snuggles definitely wanted to be humped. A couple times Ajay started to then stopped, and once actually did it, at what was clearly her urging.

                                      Sometimes I don’t know what to think about this place, but at least you guys gave me some advice, and probably mean well for the rabbits, so thanks.


                                    • Sirius&Luna
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                                        Adam, I’m sorry that you feel like we were attacking you. I didn’t mean to imply it was your fault that he wasn’t friendly, only that some rabbits take a lot more time to build trust, and that it’s common for baby rabbits to get less friendly as they get older.

                                        Was Snuggles definitely spayed? (As in did you get her spayed, or did you adopt her and were told she was spayed?)


                                      • Deleted User
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                                          I am sorry if you feel attacked. Often, we reply in a hurry and don’t take the time to think about how our message may be perceived. I didn’t mean that it was your fault or that you had done something to make the one rabbit afraid of you. I simply was trying to convey that it may have been a situational thing, and that rabbits all have different personalities so it’s not as though neutering will definitely yield the same result. I do apologize if I’ve offended you in any remarks that I have made.

                                          Everyone on this forum just wants to look out for the bunnies. We can only go off of the information that you provide, and sometimes a person can misinterpret what you’ve said or make incorrect assumptions. We all make mistakes and i don’t think it was anyone’s intention to chastise you.

                                          I do hope you’ll continue to seek advice on this forum, because I have looked around on the internet trying to gather information and this site is clearly very sound in the advice it offers. Some members can get a bit emotional at times (myself included) but we really do have a genuine interest in keeping the rabbits safe. Sometimes I think that it is such a high priority to defend the rabbits, that we forget that their owner is here BECAUSE they want to help their rabbit.

                                          Again, I’m very sorry if I was abrasive and off-putting. I just know how it is to try for months and fail, and then be so attached to both bunnies and have to make the difficult decision of which to get rid of. It’s heartbreaking! I simply wanted to advise you to err on the side of caution, and not jump into this if you already knew that you don’t have the means to provide them good lives as separates, not a pair.


                                        • sarahthegemini
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                                            In addition to what has already been said, Adam, you are the one that said your bunny became less trusting. We didn’t say it was anything you personally did, we never suggested it was your fault at all actually. You are the one that said he became less trusting of you.

                                            I appreciate that my remark about selfishness was not the kindest but that’s how your post read to me, that you wanted to keep him intact so he’ll still want your attention. Which seems silly due to all the great benefits of actually neutering. Apologies if I misunderstood. 

                                            I don’t know what to make of your female wanting to be humped. Shoving her head under his tummy is a sign of dominance. Perhaps she did want to be humped too (lol) but we can only judge by what you’ve described and that behaviour traditionally means “I want grooming, groom me now”

                                            Edit: Sorry, i’m laughing at the whole ‘she wants to be humped’ concept because my Buttercup will absolutely not tolerate it at all. I can just picture her face when Peanut gets a bit rambunctious. She’s so unimpressed 


                                          • Sleepy
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                                              I second statements that head shove at stomach is “GROOM ME” and asserting dominance rather than looking for sexual attention. My male and female are both fixed and have been bonded for over a year and Guinness will still shove her head at Bleu (even ending up right under him) to demand attention until Bleu gives in. The one time he tried taking that as an invitation to hump her, she threw him off and he ended up in the water bowl 


                                            • Vienna Blue in France
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                                                LOL Sleepy. Yes def head under is Groom me. NOW!! LOL.

                                                If they are well bonded, it will go well. If a pair is not yet fully bonded, this action will sort the men from boys and will preceed nipping, chasing or defiance by just walking away, leaving the groom demander looking a bit silly…. lol.


                                              • Hazel
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                                                  Posted By Adam on 12/13/2017 5:18 PM

                                                  If I want the bunny to be more friendly to me, it’s not my benefit but both of ours.

                                                  Generally yes, but not in this situation. A rabbit that gets riled up easily and then has “nowhere to go”, will understandably become angry, frustrated and stressed. So, in that situation, him getting more pets from you really wouldn’t benefit him, it would rather make things worse, because he’ll get excited and can’t do anything about it. If you imagine yourself in that situation, you probably wouldn’t like it.

                                                  I’m sorry you felt like people were attacking you, I’m certain nobody meant any harm by what they said.

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                                              Forum BONDING No longer time limited, but still could use some guidance (see last post)