And more photos!

So yesterday went not as good but still good..

I did about 2 hours of bonding with them earlier in the day.  I always feel like that has an effect as thats when mine tend to be more rambunctious but that’s okay.  Simba and Tanger seem to be the instigators with Nora but Tanger has always had the same problem.  He’s a follower.  He never does something until he sees one of the others do it.  And then he does it worse.  LOL. 

Simba will come up and groom her and she doesn’t groom him back… so I think that’s the cause of his agitation.  But no matter what I stick on his head, she doesn’t get it.  So I will have to continue working on that it seems.  

Sidney SOMETIMES lunges at her but that’s all.   No nipping just lunging.  And Fleury adores her as one of their own.  Hahah!  He’s always grooming her like he grooms the others.  No lunges from him!

Everything seems to be going similarly to how it was when I bonded the four together.  In the beginning there’s a lot of scuffling and then after I squirt them with the water bottle a few times and run the vacuum everyone calms down and is relatively okay.  Noras a little more on edge than she was the first time but the poor girl is being ganged up on with all 4 of them at once, so I can’t blame her!

These photos are all from yesterday.  So today I switched it up and made the x-pen smaller so they’d have to interact more. 

And I’ve just started to bond them today… so this picture is from right now!  I’ll let everyone know if anything changes but so far it’s the same as yesterday.   I’m trying to think of a good way of stress bonding them – Nora is what they call a flying rabbit.  I think I mentioned that before in the previous post?  Not sure.  Anyway, the laundry basket didn’t work because I thought she was going to hurt herself trying to get out with her flying  techniques, lol.  Anyone got any safe ideas for a bun that jumps crazy high?  She literally rockets right out of things.  It’s nerve-wracking.

Now for responding to you guys! —

Thank you so much everyone for all the well wishes, if you’ve ever bonded you definitely know how stressful it can get! So far I’m doing good but I’m sure in a day or two I’m totally going to be over the beginners joy and just want this to end, haha!

Hazel, don’t worry! When you finally find that bun, it’s going to be the perfect bun! It has to be with all this waiting you’ve done.

Collen, my quartet is located in x-pens combined together. Nora will be joining the group there with a little extra x-pen expansion.

It’s 9am here and I’m doing this bonding session. Crazy. I would much rather be in bed but it’s the only time today I’ll have to bond. BRB. Going to get some coffee! I’m dying without it!

So today… I started them out with a four-sided square with the x-pen.  It wasn’t working well and they kept picking on each other… So I reverted back to the big Oxbow box I used when I was introducing Simba.  So far it’s been working perfectly! 

We had some bad scuffles for the first 15 minutes (AGAIN!) and then everyone quieted down.  I’d say about once an hour someone starts something again but then everyone goes back to normal once I turn the vacuum on.  So not a whole lot of action but they have to interact and notice Nora as there’s not much room for them to go without acknowledging her.   

Here’s some photos from today – they’ve been together about 5 hours now.

LMAO, MD. I highly doubt you’re going to want to try your hand at bonding TEN bunnies. Although maybe since there would be so many – you could just toss them all together and no one would even notice what was happening. Or so I’ve heard it can work that way! I’m just wondering how many bunnies you have to get up to for this to happen

There also isn’t anyone really specifically fighting. It’s kind of gone down to a little bit of scuffling and moving around. I try not to interfere unless the box really starts shaking as I will hear a few scuttles and then it quiets down. It tends to be someone is in the way so the other one will nip that one in the butt and away they all go – twirling around the box like maniacs. I’m really happy with where we are so far though.

She actually HASNT tried to jump out of the box! Which really surprised me but I’ve always kept two of the small sides slightly down so they can’t see me looking in. And then I look in through the handles they have on the side. LOL. Sneaky bunny momma. The pictures only came out so good because I would put the flash on when I put the camera in the box. I shook it for a good minute today as they started scuffling when I was just setting them in it and I didn’t have my vacuum handy. They all cut it out.

I was going to bond more tonight but then decided to give myself a break. So they went about 6 hours today! Nothing too dramatic.

MD – she actually just very recently developed that! I noticed it a few weeks ago!

So tonight we are doing an all-nighter together!! I put them all in an x pen in the kitchen together. I’m sleeping on an air mattress next to them (if I can get any sleep!). I have two litter boxes (both from what will become their shared habitat). So far there has been no aggression with the litter boxes. I vinegared them, put new litter in, and then put a bit of dirty litter from the quartets litter box and then Noras. They have a water bottle AND the water dish from the quartets area and then the food dish from the quartets area.

They all shared dinner – Tanger lunged at her a bit and put his ears back when she first came over so I squirted him with the water bottle and he hasn’t done it since. They had a little bit of lunging when she first went in. For the first 10 minutes maybe. I just kept squirting and I think they’ve all gotten over it now. Nora has been exploring the area and the other bunnies so I’m proud of her for not being as nervous as Simba was when he was first being introduced to them.

I have all weekend off including Monday so I’m pretty much just going with this and seeing where it takes me. If it’s a step back, then so be it and I will just continue more bonding in the future.

Dwarf – I always put the bonded quartet in there first and then Nora last. Mainly because I don’t want them fighting when I’m in the process of getting another bunny.

I’m glad you all think I make it look easy! Hahaha! Because sometimes I feel like my buns are making me lose my mind. I really think the only reason I have so much success with them is that I constantly try things (even if people say you shouldn’t) until it works for my group. And I don’t let it devastate me when they take a step backwards. I try my hardest to understand that bunnies work things out and establish a pecking order different than humans. I try and understand their way of doing things so I’m not intervening to the point where they can’t establish a pecking order but enough so no one gets injured or agitated and aggressive. I really think if you’re bonding you have to take the time to understand and accept that bunnies need to be bunnies. You can’t expect them to “talk things through” like a human. And you can’t be upset when they fight or go backwards in the bonding processs. You have to just keep shoving through until the end! Let’s hope this philosophy works as well as it has in the past! Haha!

Anddddddd….. Nora just humped the heck out of everyone. She especially went to town on poor Simba. But the Tans nipped back and ran away. LOL.

My little 2 pounder may become the top bunny! =O

Have you ever tried just throwing them all in together? Haha!

Although I don’t know how helpful that would be. I’ve totally heard it works. But then of course, I’ve always done one at a time.

You should totally try again. I am TOTALLY rooting for you to! I will be your personal cheerleader and root you along and help as much as I can!

Sigh – so tireddddd! 

I worked all night and coming home to bond – sooooo exhausting.  Anyways, it’s been going good.  After Nora humped (especially Simba), Simba got a little agitated and humped Tanger.  And then Simba and Nora seemed to be at odds a bit.  But nothing serious.  Just demanding grooms from each other or thumping at each other when one came close.  
 

Then something startled Simba – he freaked and jumped in the litter box Nora was in and just huddled into her.  LOL.  It was hysterical.  He kept thumping and huddling closer to her.  She groomed his head and they’ve been perfect together ever since.  They’ve even cuddled together (by choice!) as you can see in the picture below.  They look so adorable together!  

Sidney lunged at Nora twice but also for no reason it seemed.  They are in a pretty small space so Sidney passes her a million times with no problem, they’ve eaten together no problem, Sidney is just my….  bratty little girl.  She did this with Tanger and Simba also until bonded completely so I’m not really surprised. 

Everyone sharing their dinner of pellets together !  Nora wouldn’t go in at first but then I set her in the middle and she went to town on the pellets.  Tanger lunged at her once and I squirted him and we haven’t had any more food problems since! 

All the Tans were sitting in the litter box watching Nora and Simba have their dominance battle!  LOL.  Until Nora decided she wanted to find a way to fit herself in the smallest litter box too! 

Simba when he came up and huddled next to Nora girl.   And then they cuddled for a bit.

And right now I hate my boyfrriend!  Nora just went up to Sidney and Tanger meatloafing and flopped next to them!  I was going for a picture and my boyfriend yelled something from the other room and she jumped up!  GRRRRRRR. 

Sooo… we have hit 4am which strikes the buns as being together for about 6 hours!  

They are doing well, I’m very proud.  Although we are still having some dominance battles between Nora and Simba.  It always begins as Nora humping Simba and then the rest of them coming to Simbas aid.  Which is exactly how it was when Simba was challenging Fleury so I’m really not shocked.  What’s happening now seems to be consistent – Nora humps Simba and then Simba ends up humping Tanger.  And then that’s about it because I stop them.  Then everyone goes back to eating and being cool together..

Weirdos.  Here’s some more pictures! 

Nora getting her grooms…

And more grooms……

That position looks mighty uncomfortable but I suppose she is happy with it.

Everybun relaxing…

It’s like every time I post they decide to switch it up on me!

So now Tanger has begun humping Sidney… LOL.

Looks like there’s some major pecking order changes going down tonight. But still absolutely no fighting between anyone! So I’m optimistic.

Hey all –

We are now at 15 1/2 hours!   Whoo – hoo!   I was literally dying of exhaustion when my boyfriend got up this morning!  I kept trying to fall asleep (I’ve never seen a point to staying up and watching them all night – I sleep next to them because I know I’ll wake up if I hear something) but could never get fully asleep because someone would always do something just as I did.  However, at around noon I was able to sleep 2 1/2 hours with not a peep from any of them.  

I took this picture during the night when I woke up once and noticed them all huddled together.  It was dark so I had to use my flash.   Except for one of the black Tans, not sure who.  They were munching on hay in a litter box. 

When I woke up from my small nap Simba and Nora were next to my head like this.  I love love love their coloring together! 

Kcom – Simba is the creme-ish/tan one and Nora is the gray one!  The Tans are impossible to tell apart but the brown Tan is Tanger and Sidney and Fleury are the black Tans.  Those two are completely identical and when they were babies sometimes the only way we could tell them apart was from the breeders tattoos in their ears!  LOL. 

So I’ve made the decision in a few hours to put all the buns in what will be their shared habitat.  Which is what the quartet was in.  The two x pens.  I’m kind of at a loss of how to change it up though.    I’ll have to keep wracking my brain to see if I can come up with something new – if not she’s just going to go in like it is and we’ll see what happens.  If it gets aggressive they will go back into the x pen in the kitchen that they were in all night.  I’m going to have to vacuum the floor and vinegar around a bit along with change all the litter boxes, maybe add one of hers in?  I’m not really sure yet… Hmmm.  Maybe I can change the position of the food dishes?  LOL.  They have a pretty simple layout.  And some things I can’t move – like their “hidey spot” because they can jump on top and if it’s not directly against the wall in the corner of the walls Sidney will use it to jump the x pen I’m sure.  We know it would be a possibility for her in any case.  

I TOOK THE PLUNGE. 

The buns are in their rabbitat together!!!  Here’s some pictures since we have put them together.  It started off with a few humps and everybun slightly being ornery towards Nora.  Then it kind of lightened up.  She’s been binkying ALL over the place since we put her in there.  And the other bunnies haven’t seemed to mind her much since they got over the initial first 15 minutes of her being in there.  

Noras binkying just caused a slight scuffle.  Sidney went after Nora while she was binkying around and started chasing her.  So then Fleury stood up for Nora for the first time and went after Sidney.  This is pretty much how it went with Simba though.  So I think we are getting somehwere.  

I don’t plan on separating at all.  I have three days off and will continue to keep them under constant supervision until I’m sure all the dominance battles and lunging has stopped

Lots of coffee will be in my future!

It did happen very quickly. We’ve only been bonding since Sunday! =D

Mocha – I believe it has gotten easier but not because I’m adding bunnies. I think it’s easier because with Simba I worked out a lot of details in my bunnies bonding style and it took a month so this time instead of having to work through it – I just went with what worked when I bonded Simba in. Making it a million times easier. I really don’t think a whole lot changed other than having more personalities and dynamics. The basis of the bonding process seemed to almost completely mimic Simbas bonding process once I figured out what was working best for the group.

So we have passed the 24 hour mark – I introduced their dinnertime pellets in the new area when we hit 24 hours (around 11pm here).  Things went great with pellets – there’s been absolutely NO problem with them sharing food.  Which is AWESOME!   I always worry about that!  

They have had a few squabbles – mainly the Tans.  (As usual).  But no continuous fighting or arguing.  They will lay together, eat together, and then out of nowhere someone will lunge or chase.  They did this alot with Simba when we introduced him into the shared habitat (last time it was a condo) with them, so I’m not too worried or stressed by this behavior.  I think it’s just last minute working things out as that was what it seemed to be with Simba.  

Here’s a few more pictures! 

I’m continuing to sleep out with them tonight so it’s another sleepover for me!  **CRIES**   I’m completely exhausted.  But I refuse to stop now and Nora has just been having a ball in there with them.  I couldn’t take that away from her.  Especially since for the most part everyone is content.  Momma will just have to keep pushing through until everything between them is settled!  

It’s one of those cat dishes – we found it at a pet store when we were looking for a big dish they couldn’t drag around or tip over. They’ve always had their food latched on to the side because they’ll knock all their food all over if it isn’t. This worked out great!

Ugh, they are killing me. Same thing as last night. Around this time is when they are at their most hyper. And they’ve been chasing (good or bad I’m not sure because no one is pulling hair or nipping but they are still chasing). Sometimes they’ve stopped on their own and other times I’ve just sprayed them with my water bottle to make them stop. But gosh, no sleeping on my end right now as they are making such a commotion. Between them playing together and then chasing they are going to keep me up all night again!

I really can’t tell if they are playing or chasing to be mean…Nora kind of is taunting them where she’ll run at them and then binky away and then they chase her. Sometimes they stop quickly and other times I think everyone gets worked up so I squirt them but I really can’t tell if they are just rough-housing or if they are chasing in aggression. Oy veyyyyyy.

They settled down from about 5-11. No fighting I believe at all. I didn’t wake up even once. And I usually wake up immediately even when I’m dead tired to any scuffling because they are obnoxiously loud about it.

When I woke up Nora was cuddling with three of the others. The other one was eating hay. I tried to get a photo but they all moved and looked at me when they heard me trying to position myself right. Then they of course had to chase her like 10 minutes later.

It can be so frustrating watching them. They can go so long without arguing. Hours. But the arguing is never fighting. Just chasing and lunging. They used to do this with Simba but it wore off quickly when they moved in. This time it doesn’t seem to wearing off so quickly. Or maybe I’m just not remembering right. I’m probably not because they were together Friday-Monday before I finally could declare them bonded on that Monday because they had stopped picking on Simba it seemed officially. So maybe this bickering did take longer with him…. Sigh! I just want them to be bonded officially already! LOL.

I’m trying not to jinx myself but during the day today the scuffles and bickerments have seemed to decrease greatly! =D

Keeeeep your fingers crossed that the good vibes keep up!

They’ve been together for just shy of 48 hours – 46 hours right now!!

Thank you, Kcom!!

It seems as time goes on it lessens. I left them alone for two hours to go watch some True Blood and Food Network Star with the boyfriend and everyone did fine. I came back and everyone was in one piece, thankfully! Hahaha. We left the door open so I could hear if there was any scuffling. Last night they seemed to be more feisty and scuffle-ish (is that a word?) with each other from 12-4ish but everyone seems to be fine.

I’m still sleeping out with them tonight – I’ll see how tonight goes and see about sleeping with them tomorrow. I plan on cleaning the house tomorrow (we only have a 1 bedroom condo) to see how they do when I’m not constantly focusing on my attention on them. I think it will make leaving them alone overnight easier for me. Since during the day tomorrow I can easily hear if they scuffle. At night, we always close the bedroom door so it won’t be so noticeable if they do. I want to make sure I feel completely comfortable leaving them together before I do officially!

Hahahah! Most likely true..

Mine have been very good today! Except for one issue, which is specifically with my boy Fleury. It has nothing to do with the bonding really I don’t believe. This problem has been continuing to develop slowly since we got Simba. But today he was out of control about it.

I can’t figure out if he gets jealous of us touching the other bunnies or if he’s mad we are messing with his “herd” or what… but he’s been so agitated when we pet the other buns. He will literally come up and nip until we pay all the attention to him again. It’s obnoxious. but I have no idea how to go about solving the problem. Today he got so upset about it that he started nipping and chasing everyone. As soon as I left, he calmed down and was fine again.

I’m at a loss… he can’t keep nipping though! It hurts! And I don’t want him to be upset. But idk how to figure it out!

I think it may be the same concept though, Mocha. Mocha just doesn’t seem to be as aggressive about it.

Fleury really is a great bunny. All my Tans really do have behavorial issues though. And I don’t really know how to stop them. From what I’ve read up on – it’s the breed that makes them so high strung and well… hard to handle. LOL! I love them all the same though and wouldn’t trade them for anyone.

Hmmm, I’m going to start another thread on this.

Hannaroo, I can see the point in your idea. But I honestly think with the Tans it will have a very negative effect on them. When they are stressed, they get angry. And mean. LOL. They bite, nip, and dig into everything and tear apart anything they can get their little paws on. And when they are separated from the others, this makes them VERY stressed. Especially Tanger. He literally goes crazy. So idk if it would really accomplish much with these little ones…

Skippers – we’ve tried continuing the usual things to do for this kind of behavior. Pushing the head down, yelping when they bite, the stern “NO”, ignoring them…. we’ve tried them all and we continue to try them all. But it doesn’t affect them in the least. If you ignore them, they’ll dig or nip you in the back. LOL. The yelping or loud shriek they don’t care about at all, the only thing they DO react to is the pushing of the head down but it’s always a negative reaction. They try being the dominant bunny back. It’s literally like a continual dominance battle with them!

We’ve tried finding solutions to their behavioral issues for quite some time now. And have basically failed every time. When I tried clicker training for Fleurys horrible litter habits it helped. It seems to get their attention. And the Tans really do well on positive re-enforcement. But I’m not sure how you could begin to go about incorporating clicker training into this type of behavior.

I actually read this same post and tried it! It did not work. Every time I tried touching him to do it, he would reach back and nip my hand. Although the other two Tans were kind of like “whats this…” when I did it to them. LOL. They sat still for like a whole minute while I did it! If you know my Tans, you KNOW that’s quite the accomplishment!