Bonding, help!!!

[TeddyandLily]

I am currently bonding 9 months French lop and 5 months Dutch bunny. The bonding time has been going on for two/three months , we have went through all the stages eg. first couple of weeks in neutral area , semi-neutral and then back into Teddy’s territory (the older one). First week or so was really tough he would let her play , he was chasing and nibbling at her non-stop. (Teddy was castrated) 

Although  its been a while now since they both learnt to share the room Teddy is still very territorial which I understand , he wants to be the dominant one. They both tend to have little moments of laying together and sometimes even grooming each other. However , where my confusion comes from is the little one is really submissive to him and she doesn’t mind Teddy jumping into her cage and using it and they seem to do fine , I mean Teddy isn’t bothered that she is next to him be doesn’t nibble or chase her , but when it comes to Lilly jumping into his cage when he is out playing he will jump straight in and start chasing and pulling her fur along with making sounds.

He will be really crossed with her and chase her around the room for a while , and this repeats few times a day ( we try to let them out as much as possible together) . I would like to know how will I be able to tell when Teddy actually accepts her and possibly put them into one cage . Is it his signs of dominancy or he just doesn’t like her? Or should they have break from each other?

I would love to hear some of yours bonding techniques/struggles and hopefully I will gain some knowledge about my bunnies.

 

[Azerane]

How long ago was Teddy neutered? Is Lilly spayed? One thought is that if Teddy’s neuter was recent, and Lilly isn’t spayed, the chasing may be partly hormonal since things are still settling down for Teddy, and even then, having an intact doe could still make him a bit more fiesty than he would be otherwise. However, given that he’s only chasing in certain situations this doesn’t seem as likely.

The other option is that Teddy doesn’t want to share his space because he is dominant. Which makes sense that he wouldn’t chase Lilly in her space, but chases her in his own. I see either two options. One is potentially a little risky and while I don’t know what your cage set up is, because they get along well in the free roaming space and in Lilly’s cage, you could remove Teddy’s cage completely and have them live together in Lilly’s cage (if it’s big enough). The other option is to stop letting them free roam at the same time for now, and when they are caged, do cage swaps with them. Keep Lilly in Teddy’s cage for a few days and visa versa. When they are in their own cage, swap some of the objects, toys and bowls, between cages. Keep swapping which cage they’re in every few days, and keep swapping items from the cages. This should help them to learn that the cages are shared spaces that are going to have both of their scents on them. And hopefully when you let them out to play together again, Teddy won’t be as territorial to his space because it will be Lilly’s space now too.

[Love4Bunny]

I kinda went through the same thing. If Lilly is spayed, it doesn’t hurt to go back a step. Sometimes they can be territorial about items, not just space, so you can always go back to solidifying the bond in neutral territory, removing items the dominant bun could claim. Some of the issues might resolve with time, but this sounds like they’re not at the point where you can trust them to be in the one space without a serious scuffle. They’re living separately anyways, so it probably is not a good idea to let them loose in “Teddy’s space” (ie. All of it!) till he learns to accept Lilly. I wish the swapping scent technique worked for me, but it just fired Thor up. It could be hormones getting in the way, but if Lilly is spayed, I would only put them together in neutral territory, because they probably need more bonding time. I let mine live together in semi-neutral territory for about 3 weeks after an integration fail, and despite the slightly bumpy road back to common territory, Thor chased less when they went back to “His” room.

[TeddyandLily]

Teddy was neutered about 3/4 months about and we’ve waited few weeks before getting Lilly to let him settle down. We haven’t’ considered spraying her yet as she’s only 5 months old.

The cage is suitable for both of them as we bought it ,when we got Lilly , it was the best option since we didn’t have to get one later for them  both . The main idea was for them to settle down together and get use to eachother and then introduce Teddy into Lilly’s territory since I thought it would show him that he needs to share and not everything is his.

The only thing I am worried about cage swap is that if Teddy gets too used to her cage and will think that its his as well and try and ‘kick her out’ .

However,they seem to be okay while feed time when I supervise them while they get to eat outside together that’s the time when Teddy isn’t bothered when Lilly try to eat from his bowl or when she steals a fruit which they share. They also seem to be okay when they get put next to eachother to be stroked and fall asleep. I think we are past the hard stage of bonding , its the fact that I cannot tell when he will accept her. Would it be a good idea to for example put then in Lilly’s cage for few hours and watch them how they behave together ?

[TeddyandLily]

Lilly is really sneaky and fast, sometimes Teddy cannot catch up with her. Sometimes it makes me think as she always is so active and binky maybe he wants to groom her and she just runs away and that’s what gets him annoyed, perhaps. Toys swap would not work for me as Teddy is only bothered when she jumps into his cage (although yesterday, she was onto of his house for few minutes until he kicked her out&nbsp  We stopped bothering with giving Teddy toys as every new toy(s) we bought he would get annoyed that its in his space and each of the toy ends up in his litter box.(tries it when his bowl is empty too)

They are mostly free to use the whole house to run around , well Lilly does as Teddy doesn’t cross the line of the room which I find funny as we have the same floor all over the house and he will not move in another room unless theres a carpet ( I have none in ‘his room’ and he’s uses it fine.

[LittlePuffyTail]

I recommend you wait until Lily is spayed and her hormones given several weeks to calm down. Bonding with an unspayed female is not recommended.

[TeddyandLily]

Although it isn’t impossible to bond female as I have had a research  before and also been told by the vet that its no harm to bond them as long as lillys hormones don’t kick it , which they don’t nor teddys as he doesn’t have any urges.  Plus we are not planning to spray her sooner as shes still really young,

The point I was trying to make is when will I be able to tell that they can be trusted in a cage. I might try to try a cage swap , no harm giving them a chance

[Love4Bunny]

The shelter I adopted Crysta from had her spayed at 6 months, which as I understand it, is an okay age to spay a doe.

My opinion is that there is a process to bonding. If you do the steps out of order, you’ll get a result, but as LPT touched on, the hormones will play a role (you’ve probably read this on the forum), and it may upset the bond, as well as not being the best for Lilly’s health, overall. They might be fine for a little bit, but one of them could seriously get hurt if you leave them in a cage together.

“Cementing the bond” is the last stage of bonding, but most of what I’ve read suggest that things can go crazy if the hormones get in the way, which is a ticking time bomb. That’s the risk you take if you decide to put them in the same cage before Lilly has been spayed: an injured rabbit and a damaged bond. To give a direct answer to your question, I wouldn’t trust them together if they were my rabbits.

[TeddyandLily]

Although i havent said they will be put in one cage. It was a matter of a question when its the best time , theres no intetion to harm neither of them nor the bond, the bonding process is going slowly and steady. Lilly being sprayed is consider in mind as we are aware of the health risks in my opionion 5 months is bit too early Teddy wasnt netured until he was 7 months old, i also know my bunnies and i k ow what they are like therefore going slowly is the best thing, theres still a chance they wont get along after spraying which wont change the fact that they will be in seprate cages! I appreciate all the responses and i think ive gained enough information now.

[Author]

Messages