Our trip to vet today. (Ears)

[Avantika]

Moshu’s vet returned after two weeks and the first thing I did was pack her in her carrier and zoom off to the vet. We did not do an ear culture but the vet made a symptomatic diagnosis that it could be an ear infection. She did see the white-ish colored wax but said it could be a minor infection. She prescribed Baytril tablets (12.5 mg – once daily) for 5 days. Along with that she has asked me to use probiotics. 

She first prescribed me some ear drops (I at least should have asked the name) but I refused her right away because long time back my dad and I tried olive oil therapy on her for ear mites. (It actually worked). But was very hard to do. In comparison, tablets were easier. Oral suspensions are the easiest but we dont have baytril suspension here.

Apart from that, she gave an ivermectin shot just in case the itching and scratching is due to mites and not bacterial infection. She has called us once again after 2 weeks for another shot of ivermectin.

My questions are :-

1) Should I elongate the dosage to 7 to 10 days instead of 5 ? (because i have read ear infections coming back.) Moshu has been on 25 mg per day for 12-15 days last year for her UTI when I was not even aware that probiotics should be used along with abs. She seemed to be doing well on the medicine. Hopefully it will be the same this time.)

2) Should I go back to the vet and ask her to give me the ear drops ? I was foolish to not have at least ask the name…Now I am thinking that both systemic and external treatment would heal faster.

3) Is a second shot of ivermectin after two weeks really necessary ? I really hate having to travel along with Moshu. We dont have a car so I take her by auto. Its stressful for both her and I. However, if its necessary I can take the rest for sure.

4) I will be giving her Anima Strath (Saccharomyces cerevisiae Meyen) along with some herbal tonics for digestive health and liver.

Liv 52

Digyton

Is there anything else I can do for Moshu ?

[Avantika]

One more thing. Since we did not do an ear culture (let me tell you, vet testing is still not a common practice here). What if there is no bacterial infection at all ? Will giving her antibiotics harm her ?

*stressed*

[LittlePuffyTail]

I will try to answer your Qs as best I can with Bindis experience.

Normally, when Bindi has an ear infection the vet prescribes ear drops (usually Baytril Otic). This is usually for 7 to 10 days. If it hasn’t gone away after 1 or 2 rounds of drops, we then go to the drops/oral meds (.again usually Baytril) Ear infections can be stubborn and it’s likely that 5 days would not be enough however I’ve never given just oral and not drops so hard to say. However, I would NOT prolong the meds without talking to the vet.

Just curious why there was no culture done. If it persists past the antibiotics, I would ask the vet to do one.

It wouldn’t hurt to ask for the ear drops. I probably would.

I don’t think one round of unnecessary antibiotics would hurt her but just make sure to watch her eating and poops closely. Baytril can upset some sensitive tummies.

I don’t know much about ivermectin in buns, hopefully someone else can help you there.

(((((Ear vibes for Moshu)))))

[Avantika]

I am from Asia. Here treatment is mainly symptomatic in nature. The doctors are not very likely to prescribe a diagnostic test until and unless its very much needed. The vet I am seeing now is quite reliable as compared to other vets I have previously taken Moshu to. I have got her x-rays and stool test done in the past. But ear culture for rabbits is still quite rare. I am worried they will hurt her while taking the sample. In another thread I posted some weeks back, I was told that in order to collect sample, we have to puncture her ear drum…

If despite the drops and oral abs, her scratching/shaking head persists and there is head tilt, I will go for ear culture too. But not now. I will wait for a month or two.

Can you help me with one more thing ? I will go and ask the vet to give me the ear drops that she was prescribing. I just want to equip myself with the knowledge of bunny safe ear drops (just in case she gives me an incorrect medicine, I can spare myself from wasting money but not buying it). These are the veterinary ear drops we get here. Let me know which are safe :

1) Enrofloxacin + Silver Sulfadiazine
2) Ofloxacin + Clotrimazole + Betamethasone Dipropionate + lignocaine hydrochloride
3) Salicylic Acid IP + Phenoxyethanol BP

The first one seems safest. I think what they had in their clinic was the 2nd one. I can arrange the first one from some pet shop.

I will start with both the oral ab and ear drops from Saturday. I will start with anima strath today itself.

[Avantika]

Thank you Stephanie. You dont know how much I am dependent on BB.

[LittlePuffyTail]

Happy to help

Enrofloxacine is Baytril.

As for the others, none of them are familiar to me but I have a bad memory.

Here is a helpful antibiotic chart from the House Rabbit Society

http://www.rabbit.org/health/antibiotics.html

As for the culture, a culture of an outer ear infection is a very simple swabbing of the ear discharge with a cotton swab. No pain at all, although Bindi does not like it. We’ve had many cultures done.

[Avantika]

Thanks a lot Besides the link you shared with you, I looked up two more. (Medirabbit and Irish Wildlife Matters). The combination Ofloxacin + Clotrimazole + Betamethasone Dipropionate + lignocaine hydrochloride does not come under the safe medications list. Not one of them. So I think I will go with Baytril + Silver Sulfadiazine. I also put up a question with Dana Kremples. I am trying to know the most I can because I have a feeling the vet was about to give me the Ofloxacin solution. (I remember seeing that in the clinic shop).

Also, what visual symptoms help us in differentiating whether its an inner/middle/outer ear infection ?
Moshu shows no head tilt. The white wax is slightly visible. And sometimes I notice her slipping. Not a lot but after she gets up from bunny loaf-ing or sleeping position.

[Bam]

It rather sounds more like an outer ear infection to me, middle ear infections are more severe and will often affect balance/ cause head-tilt. And drops wouldn’t do any good. Enrofloxacine is Baytril as LPT says, the Ofloxacine I tried looking into when Bahar’s Happy got it, but I found nothing conclusive. Betamethasone is a steroid and should always be used with caution in bunnies. The third one is more of a pH-changer and disinfectant. It may be effective though, in humans acetic acid is often prescribed for Swimmer’s ear, an out ear infection that doesn’t just affect swimmers. It makes the PH of the outer ear canal unsuitable for fughi and bacteria.

You should of course not have a culture done by puncturing the ear-drum, that must be avoided. Sometimes you do puncture a person’s eye-drum if there’s lots of pus and the ear-drum is threatening to rupture, so to prevent excessive scarring and loss of hearing, you do a puncture and then you can culture the goo that was in there. This is NOT sth that’s suitable for Moshu!!!! There is an exudate (the wax you mention) and that should be used for a culture. If you opt for a culture. Oral antibiotics are bad for the GI tract whether there are bacteria in her ears or not, because it kills bacteria without discrimination between good and bad bacteria. So the probiotic is a good thing.

[Avantika]

So you suggest me I should not go for ear drops ? ( I am not going with the Ofloxacine one.
I know oral antibiotics are bad too but something has to be done. Either oral abs or the ear drops (Enrofloxacin one.

The reason I am willing to go for ear drops ALONG with tablets is because I have read in many posts that enrofloxacin isnt helping and that the infection is recurring. To be honest, dosing her ear drops everyday would be a big hassle because we have done this before as I mentioned, and she gets all aggressive and scared. If ear drops are going to help, I will take any amount of scratching from her. Ear infections sound scary from what all I have head.

I too think its an outer ear infection. But I want to work on it asap so that it doesnt reach her inner ears.

[Bam]

Yes, I think you should go for eardrops, but my only personal experience is with humans. For an outer ear infection in a human, you get both ear-drops and systemic antibiotics. Sometimes you make do with only ear-drops.

I too think you should treat this asap, better to nip stuff like this in the bud. But I do realize she will scratch you =( Not fun =(

[Avantika]

Great news ! The enrofloxacin + silver sulfadiazine ear drops is out of stock EVERYWHERE. Wow, could it get easier than this ?

I have put up a question at AllExperts.com with Dana Krempels regarding the three different ear drops. I really really hope she responds. More than that I hope the other two ones are safe too but I have a feeling they aren’t.

I have decided not to start Moshu’s antibiotic treatment for the next two weeks. I think her digestive health isnt at its best. And thats simply because she doesnt like to have her hay anymore. (Till year 2014, she would have 3-5 bowls of hay per day. Now she has only one. I dont blame her. The timothy hay we get here isnt tasty at all. Because its old. I am unable to get hold of any hay suppliers in delhi ; smallest of things are so difficult for us )

I am going to give her probiotics for two weeks so that her gut flora is in a better state before I give her anything thats going to make it worse. I dont think the infection is going to get worse in the coming two weeks. Oh well.

[LittlePuffyTail]

Can your vet order the ear drops for you?

[Avantika]

I called up at different pet shops and they said that the medicine is off the market since sometime. I have found a website of wholesale dealers. Baytril ear drops is on their ‘In Stock’ list. I really hope they wont refuse me since they are wholesale dealers and sell only to vets, pet shops and breeders.

I will update you all tomorrow. Thanks for all the help so far

[Bam]

Re-reading this thread now I suddenly realize why you thought I didn’t recommend eardrops: When I said it was no good I meant no good for a middle-ear-infection! Because drops will only act locally in the outer ear-canal and not reach the middle ear since the tympanic membrane is in the way.

I’m keeping my fingers crossed for your being able to get the drops!

PS: Is there any way you could get hold of chloramphenicol ear-drops? Sometimes sold as Chloromycetin, but there is of course a range of brand-names varying from country to country. Chloramphenicol is bunny safe and widely used for outer ear-infections. 

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