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Forum BEHAVIOR wild demon bunny question

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    • Patrick
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        I have a buck rabbit and he’s not neutered, he’s a year old and a very angry critter all the time. 

        That being said, being just over a year old and I’ve decided not to breed him, I want to get him neutered…. the question being is, is it too late? I figured he may mellow out some but I wondered if he will continue to be this demon I loved having before his teenage years or do I need to get another rabbit?


      • Flopsie
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          I don’t think it is too late, I think it is only too late if they are too old to have the procedure, but in terms of being able to do it, it is not late. My bun got spayed when she was a little over a year old so it is fine.

          Now, this part I don’t know, I’ve heard so its heresay, but I believe its better to have them neutered immediately when they can do so rather than wait before the hormones get released (e.g., before the hormones versus hormones already in system), but i’m not sure if there is empirical data supporting this or not.

          short answer, not too late


        • Flopsie
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            Also, when you say you want to “get another rabbit” I’m assuming that you’re wanting to get another rabbit as a companion and not give the current one away correct? The reason i’m asking is that bonding two rabbits should be ideally done when they are both fixed so that you don’t have territorial issues.


          • Megabunny
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              No guarantees on how he will be post-neuter. My Charlie was an idiot when I got him and he was already neutered…charging me if I put my hand in the cage, not wanting to be held. Neutering doesn’t mean you’ll end up with a couch potato. And what is he doing that you seem to like? He won’t likely run around humping your leg, but mine, though neutered, still does some circle eights around my legs and chases after me at times. You also will have a much better litter trained bunny.
              Glad you didn’t breed him. Lots of others doing that who probably shouldn’t be, though yours looks adorable in the avatar. Then, they all are, aren’t they??


            • Patrick
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                Posted By Megabunny on 1/15/2015 12:58 PM

                No guarantees on how he will be post-neuter. My Charlie was an idiot when I got him and he was already neutered…charging me if I put my hand in the cage, not wanting to be held. Neutering doesn’t mean you’ll end up with a couch potato. And what is he doing that you seem to like? He won’t likely run around humping your leg, but mine, though neutered, still does some circle eights around my legs and chases after me at times. You also will have a much better litter trained bunny.
                Glad you didn’t breed him. Lots of others doing that who probably shouldn’t be, though yours looks adorable in the avatar. Then, they all are, aren’t they??

                For an update, I got Patrick fixed before I wrung his neck, he’s only been fixed for a few days and hes done well, but the vicious biting is a daily routine, I have bloody hands and legs as of yesterday, I really hope he grows out of this, he really was a nice bunny.

                The picture is when he was my buddy, now he sits in his run in the corner of the room and has pretty much become a piece of furniture unless I feed him or give him water, I just can’t stand to be bit anymore. 


              • Megabunny
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                  OK  Time to pull out the big guns and bring this posting to the attention of some of the more seasoned rabbit people. I’ll see what I can do

                  In the meantIme know that your rabbit isn’t likely to get better if ignored. I’m finding it hard to believe you are dripping in blood and am hoping you’re trying to be a bit funny. But I’m worried about that little guy.

                  When does he attack? We really haven’t had a lot of detail, so if you have time, maybe you can elaborate. Are you reaching in for him and getting attacked? That’s pretty typical behavior that may improve with some modifications. Does he charge across the room and grab you and bite your legs or does he like to dig when you’re holding him? Please give us some other clues and maybe someone will have an amazing miracle cure for you both. I would hate to think of him just languishing in his cage if there’s a way to help. Either way I hate to think of him languishing in a cage, so let us try and help.

                  Are there any new situations going on that have frightened him? Rabbits are very sensitive to their surroundings. Anything else?

                  Do you “butter him up” by feeding him some goodies from your hand? Just trying to randomly brain storm. Keep up posted and I’ll try on my end to get other input for you


                • Sarita
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                    Yes, when does he “attack” you and bite you? It always has to be the human who has to adjust and modify their behavior – if you can be more specific, we can help you.

                    Also it does take awhile for the body to adjust once an animal has been desexed so you need to be patient and keep that in mind.

                    I don’t know what you mean by “becoming a piece of furniture” – do you mean that he is being relaxed? If that is the case, I don’t see what is wrong with that – you want your rabbit to be relaxed around you.


                  • BrunosMama
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                      Wow, angry bunny! But don’t give up! There’s always hope that you and Patrick will be friends again.

                      Glad he has his neuter done. It takes about a month before all the boy hormones work through. Also, you mentioned he “used to be nice” …if you mean when he was a baby, that is pretty common. Our youngest bunny, Backers, we have had since birth. He used to be my little snuggle bun…now he won’t even let me touch him. Darn teenagers!

                      You may have to work on reestablishing your relationship with him and start at the basics. Offer lots of raisins, treats and talk to him a lot and just sit on the floor with him and let him get used to you. With bunnies, patience is key!

                      Also, you mentioned getting another bunny…..if you mean to replace Patrick, if it absolutely comes to that, please do so responsibly. Sometimes a pets behavior is beyond our ability to help. Only do this when all other options are exhausted. Try to find a rabbit rescue, no kill shelter, or trusted bunny savvy friend who could take him.

                      Like most problems, ignoring him will not make it better. Good luck to you and Patrick, and keep us posted.


                    • LongEaredLions
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                        Welcome to BB-this is a great place to come for help.
                        Getting him neutered is a great first step to help solve this issue. The majority of bunnies experience this dreaded teenage stage prior to neutering. After neutering, it can take a month or more for all hormones to subside, and many bunnies experience a hormone rush after neutering which could be the cause of his less than desired behaviour right now. I think the best course of action right now would be to wait a bit to let his internal balances calm down before making any final desisions.
                        When a bunny is younger, it’s personality isn’t completely developed, and it usually isn’t until after the teenage stage. Just because a bunny is nice as a baby, doesn’t mean they will as adult. However, the behaviour he is exibiting now is fairly typical of a hormone-driven bunny. After his hormone balances calm down, he is more than likely to return to a nicer state.
                        One thing you can do to help him is to stay calm and gentle near him. Bunnies can pick up on human emotions, so if you are frightened of him or have strong adverse feelings about approaching him, he will be act accordingly. Try to let him come to you if possible, and offer him a treat whenever possible, to help him associate you with good things. If you do have to approach him, make yourself as small as possible and make sure he is not cornered so he doesn’t feel threatened. You have to remember that rabbits are prey animals. They do not act out of hatred or because they are mean, they are scared and to fight back is the only way they know of defending their life. My best wishes to you and Patrick.


                      • LBJ10
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                          I agree with LEL. Give him some time to calm down and hopefully his hormones will settle sooner rather than later. You absolutely did the right thing neutering him. The hard part is over, now you just have to wait. Then work on rebuilding your relationship. Show him that he can trust you.


                        • Patrick
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                            I laid in his run today till it hurt lol, mostly from laying on the floor, he kept charging at me a few times but I closed my eyes and ignored his threats He calmed down and in no time he was walking on me again, licking my face and then cuddled up to me… I’m sure it might me the lack of attention, but i’m working on that. I layed in the run not to long ago and he was demon bunny again and did his routine all over again, he nipped me about a dozen times and I squeaked each time and he retreated into his box (Never did that before).

                            What I meant by becoming a piece of furniture is I leave him alone because hes so mean, hes hateful anytime I went near his run, I just wanted to give him space, which I now know, more attention is best.

                            Its almost like a new bunny, I want the old one back… soon


                          • LongEaredLions
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                              Glad you got to see a bit of his personality shine through today! That is great progress. Keep it up!


                            • Megabunny
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                                That does sound great. And I’m so glad to hear the “experts” saying nothing sounds so unusual. I do wonder about you being in his run. Has he ever been allowed out? I know he might still charge you even if he’s out, but I’d say it’s VERY normal for him not to want you in his run, so you’re doing just the right thing to let him come to you and not backing away when he tries to show how tough he is ha ha. You’re getting great advice from the others. Thanks, on behalf of your bunny, for trying so hard. Does sound like you’re on the road to better times. Keep us posted. He reminds me of a rabbit I’m working with at the shelter that people said isn’t all that adoptable because he lunges. Well, yes he does if you push the issue, but when bribed with goodies, he is more willing to interact…and I’m only with him about 20 min. every other day. I’m told other volunteers like rabbits, but he sure seems like either he’s getting better since the first day I was with him (he’d been there a month) or I’m getting to understand him better…probably both.
                                We’d love to keep hearing updates.


                              • kirstyol
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                                  I don’t have advice for you but I thought by telling you a bit about my experience with Bramble you might feel reassured.

                                  We got Bramble at six weeks and he was the most adorable bunny ever – didn’t mind being picked up or held and would run right up to us for pets – all in all a very happy, well natured bunny. So much so that when we took him for his first vet check at around 15 weeks old even the vet said he was one of the best behaved bunnies he had ever seen.

                                  A few weeks later his behaviour started changing, he bit me and I mean proper almost drew blood proper bit me not just nipped me which is quite normal for young buns. I was a little concerned since none of my pervious buns had ever truly bitten me but didn’t worry too much, then it happened again and then he started biting my partner too and just became really aggressive at times – he was still as sweet as anything other times though. We decided to get him neutered at this point and went to the vet but he couldn’t be done because his testicles still weren’t descended yet so we had to wait a few more weeks which was terrible. I had become a little scared of him just because he kept biting me all the time and it wasn’t good for us or him.

                                  After his neuter things didn’t improve right away (I don’t think they ever do) but within maybe six weeks he was so much better, he has not bitten either of us since recovering from his neuter and the only time he shows the slightest bit of aggression, actually its more frustration is when he is stuck in his cage for example if I am brushing the floors or something and need him confined he shakes the bars wanting out but that’s it. he is such a nice bun again although he did not turn back into a lap bunny unfortunately that would have been nice, but he is still affectionate and loves pets.

                                  It did take time for him to recover from his neuter and I think in a way he had to learn to trust us again, but its honestly been the best thing we have done. he is so much happier and so are we.


                                • Flopsie
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                                    animal behavior should essentially follow the same rules of human behavior. after all a lot of studies and tests were done on animals in the lab first and then applied to humans. a couple of things that we have to understand and embrace if we are to change behavior.

                                    first is the idea of learned and unlearned behaviors. unlearned behaviors are instinctive and reflexive. these are coded already and do not need to be overtly taught. for example breathing, blinking the eye when danger is near. learned behavior on the other hand is a result of history with the environment. this is important because if a behavior is learned then technically it can be changed.

                                    the second concept we have to embrace that there are typically 4 functions of every behavior. it either falls under the function of attention seeking, access to tangibles or activities, escape, or automatically reinforced behaviors. it’s possible that behaviors serve more than one function or can start as one and move to another.

                                    if we can understand the function of the behavior. then we can change it by teaching a more functional replacement or not reinforcing the current behavior (extinction).

                                    so based on what your bunny does? what is your hypothesis of the function? is the bunny trying to get your attention? trying to get something from you? or escape from danger?


                                  • BrunosMama
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                                      Our experience with young buns is that they are extremely passive as babies. But boy when teenagehood hits, run for the hills! All of ours except one (he was older when we adopted him) have gone through this change. The first couple were rough – why is our sweet bunny ripping our faces off – but then we started sorting it out. Now, out of 10 bunnies, I can say none of them remained true biters or aggressive bunnies. A couple give nips occasionally, but nothing bad. Its usually when we’re making them snuggle lol.

                                      That’s awesome that your getting back to him and hanging out. Don’t get discouraged. It sounds like you’re on the right track.


                                    • JackRabbit
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                                        We have one who lunges, growls, grunts, and nips. She lunges when anything unexpected happens (something has been moved) and when she needs to show that she’s a big bad scary bunny (all three pounds of her). She growls and grunts when something doesn’t go her way (salad isn’t served fast enough). She nips when she’s playing and when she wants something. When we’re sitting on the floor with her, she’ll sneak behind us, nip, and then binky away. She’ll also nip if someone is petting her and stops before she’s ready. She is also the sweetest lap bunny and will snuggle up against you for pets as soon as she burns off energy.


                                      • Patrick
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                                          Anyone elses rabbit tug and pull when they bite? Patrick seems to, then when I pull out a carrot, he pours on the charm… I’m starting to think hes bipolar. 


                                        • Megabunny
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                                            Um….noooo. He really means business!


                                          • Patrick
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                                              The only thing that turns him to putty in my paw is Arizona green tea, oranges and carrots… he’s been neutered for a week now, i’m really hoping he settles in a few weeks.


                                            • LongEaredLions
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                                                Me too. ((((Calming vibes))))


                                              • BrunosMama
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                                                  I think it can take up to a month for the full hormonal effect to wear off. Maybe you need some chain mail gloves or butchers gloves.


                                                • Peony
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                                                    I thought it could go past a month in some but here:
                                                    http://www.ehow.com/info_12274686_long-until-hormones-settle-after-neutering-spaying-rabbits.html
                                                    So according to that it is 2-4 weeks, though I thought it could be up to 6 weeks in some? But ya just needs time

                                                    When I am trying to pick mine up to put this cream on her feet, sometimes I have to reach in her hutch and try coax her out. She will grunt, run on the second floor, thump at times just because I am “reaching in” at her in her home. Only time she does that outside her hutch is knowing I am trying to pick her up or if I grab her pet carrier.  (She learned me touching and picking up the pet carrier means car ride so now all I have to do is touch it for her to go in crazy mad mode) What I am trying to explain is mine does not bite, (mostly, she sometimes bites me by mistake if I am holding a food she likes a lot, ends up charging at me with mouth open at times) but does get greatly unhappy when “invading her house” so this run you speak of what is that? it might not be a good place to try to get him to “know you”


                                                  • kirstyol
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                                                      It definitely took Bramble longer than 4 weeks to fully recover from his neuter, every bun is different I guess.


                                                    • Megabunny
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                                                        Peony, that’s what I was trying to get at, but you said it better. Still wondering if the bun is out of his pen and if he would be better if he were hopping around elsewhere….could this just be territorial?


                                                      • Patrick
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                                                          I let Patrick out often when i’m home, sometimes he lets himself out and thats when he gets adventurous, I let him out until he attacks me then he goes back in the run… He has been getting a bit better, when he gets angry, a few slices of apple or orange will soothe the beast.

                                                          And yes, chainmail may be needed for a while lol


                                                        • Megabunny
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                                                            Ever hear of the kid’s book Bunnicula?? Maybe Patrick likes being tough bunny ha ha. That’s just such a puzzle! I do hope he is ultimately a success story. Then YOU can get on and soothe nerves of future BBers with ferocious beasts. We’ll tell them to PM you ha ha ha ha


                                                          • Patrick
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                                                              Posted By Megabunny on 2/07/2015 8:17 AM

                                                              Ever hear of the kid’s book Bunnicula?? Maybe Patrick likes being tough bunny ha ha. That’s just such a puzzle! I do hope he is ultimately a success story. Then YOU can get on and soothe nerves of future BBers with ferocious beasts. We’ll tell them to PM you ha ha ha ha

                                                              No I hadn’t thanks, i’ll have to look into that, it looks good. I’ve had 2 rabbits now and they have all taken the tough guy approach, I do get a kick out of it. 

                                                              I took patrick outside today and let him dig in the grass, he loves it, the feral cat that lives around here absolutely ignored him, which I was surprised, the last cats he interacted with didn’t like the fact he was chasing them, so Patrick has been a bully when it comes to cats and now me lol. 

                                                              I went to get him to bring him in from outside and he attacked me lol, I couldn’t leave him for the bears, mtn lions, wolves, coons, owls and the other animals that run around here, I tossed the sheet over him and picked him up… Wild Buck kills me lol


                                                            • Megabunny
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                                                                Bears and mt. lions and wolves???? Where the heck to you live? The wild frontier? Wow! Fun to hear about but in my old age, I have no desire to live in places like that anymore! Eek!! Sounds like Patrick had a great time yesterday!! I’m a big fan of letting rabbits outside to run and play when it’s a safe haven, which I used to have before we moved. Now I don’t know what dangers would lie in the wilds of my South Carolina subdivision, full of chemicals, fire ants and Heaven knows what bugs. Worse than wolves, perhaps!!
                                                                Well, glad to hear Patrick had fun. I had an idiot rabbit that got loose from the fenced in area, but lucky me…he stayed close and eventually surfaced and returned. I’m so bad, I wasn’t sure if I was happy or not.
                                                                Oh, and did you see that right near your posting yesterday was another person with what must be Patrick’s brother??? Same ferocious beast. I told her  you two should PM


                                                              • BrunosMama
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                                                                  Just wondering how things are coming with Patrick bunny?


                                                                • Patrick
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                                                                    Patrick is still Patrick, he’s slowed down a tiny bit, but the attacking and fighting with me is still a daily thing, he will sit at my feet and I try to rub his head and when I stop, the attacks on my hand start. He’s like reading a book, but I don’t read braille.

                                                                    I’m hoping in a few weeks he’ll calm down, it will be week 5 by then. I try taming the wee beast with gifts of apple and carrots to ward off the anger.


                                                                  • Megabunny
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                                                                      He is one tough nut to crack!! Straighten up, Patrick! You don’t know how good you’ve got it!


                                                                    • Patrick
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                                                                        Posted By Megabunny on 2/18/2015 6:16 AM

                                                                        He is one tough nut to crack!! Straighten up, Patrick! You don’t know how good you’ve got it!

                                                                        i’m sure the “Nut” word is what he’s sensitive about, he has a stuffed bunny he liked, he won’t give it the time of day now. He does ok, i’m wondering if its something i’m doing wrong and if it is, he’s too picky. 


                                                                      • Megabunny
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                                                                          Agreed!!


                                                                        • Michelle V
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                                                                            I, too, just wanted to share that we had a demon bunny too.  It took almost 2-1/2 to 3 months after neutering to see a decline in the nasty behavior.  He wound spin and pee on my husband every time he got close, thump all the time, rip his whole pen to shreds, nip and just very unhappy in general.  He was a year old when we got him and had him neutered.  It’s been 8 months now, and he is a completely different bunny.  I hope the same happens for you. I never thought it would! When we got to 6-8 weeks out from surgery, I thought, oh well, this is who he is and hormones or not, he’s just a nasty bunny.  Now, he has impeccable litter habits, no longer has any territorial peeing, is very relaxed, sleeps deeper than my dogs sometimes after flopping and binkies all over!  Fingers crossed, especially since Patrick WAS a nice fella  


                                                                          • Patrick
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                                                                              2 1/2-3 months…. wow, Patrick will attack my feet anytime I walk, I hate walking slow across the floor, then if you bump him, he gets mad… I’m so happy the peeing thing is over, he’d get on my bed and let if fly, I could have killed him one night, he pee’d on the sheets, pillow and my phone, it was 11:30 and I was tired and had no clean sheets, I ended up using him to wipe it up and put on a old set of sheets and went to bed. The one thing I did do was get a tarp and put it over the sheets, with bungies holding it down, he’d get on the bed with the tarp and i’d taunt him, you could tell he’d been beat at that game lol. 

                                                                              He’s a good kid, even though he’s a $*&! head. 


                                                                            • LBJ10
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                                                                                I think Michelle’s story shows that there may be light at the end of the tunnel. I really hope Patrick continues to calm down. Don’t give up hope yet!


                                                                              • Patrick
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                                                                                  Today was great, the wee beast was pretty friendly today, he did get a bit upset when I tried to move him out of the storage room. It could be the light at the end of the tunnel or its the on coming train lol


                                                                                • Patrick
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                                                                                    Ok, second day, Patrick has been mellow all day, got slightly ticked off today, but he was conned pretty easy with a piece of carrot. I see the light at the end of the tunnel.


                                                                                  • LBJ10
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                                                                                      Yay! Glad to hear that he has turned the corner.


                                                                                    • Megabunny
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                                                                                        Hooray!! And that video was really good. I kept that site so I can maybe put it out there for the next person, as this seems to be a popular issue lately. I’ll give Patrick the credit ☺


                                                                                      • Patrick
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                                                                                          Disregard, he went back to being his old self, it was good while it lasted.


                                                                                        • Megabunny
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                                                                                            Sorry to hear that he’s being such a brat! Snap out of it Patrick!!

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                                                                                        Forum BEHAVIOR wild demon bunny question