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BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum BONDING Lets give this bonding stuff a bash!

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    • RetroSquid
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        Well, we’ve finally started the ball rolling with bonding our girls with the troublesome cyclopse, Link.

        Since his separation from Navi after she had to have a lump removed, Link just hasn’t tolerated bun company at all. 
        He clearly has preferred the company of cats and people.

        But, with a baby on the way, we just cannot consider having two rooms of our home sectioned off to allow him to be an antisocial grump any longer.

        We’ve recently started bonding Link, Navi and Daisy.

        We started off just sitting by the front door, holding all three of the buns (Close, but not close enough for Link to bite) and it was going okay.
        I have recently had another knee surgery (I’ll not post pictures. I have to remember not everyone is as fascinated by these things as myself) so haven’t been able to get onto the floor for the bonding session for a few days (And probably a few days more), so, we bought two medium sized pens that I could pop them into and force them into the same space, but safely, during the day while I’m sitting about, recovering.

        The pens are small, but big enough for the buns to lie down should they wish.
        I don’t feel too guilty, as they only spend a couple of hours in here at the most, the rest of the times, they have an entire large room each to reside in.

        It’s actually been going really well. I’ve noticed all of the buns have favoured a particular corner for sitting and relaxing in (be that due to being relaxed or bored, I’m not quite sure, yet…)
        But, they all almost snuggle.

        Link has chosen the corner nearest to the girls as his favoured seat, the girls, too, lie against the bars closest to him.

        Link even frequently flops, quite happy to leave his bum and feet poking through the bars for the girls to investigate.

        Navi also has taken to pressing herself against the bars, right at Link, too! She couldn’t physically get any closer to him!   

        As for Daisy, Daisy had a bit of a sniff at Link through the bars, but has otherwise been disinterested. Opting to just lie wherever Navi does, seeing as Navi is the boss.

        All in all, them being in the same space is completely easy and stress free. No bun is attempting to nip through the bars, no bun is grunting or being moody.

        I’ve actually noticed a big change in both Link and Daisy after these sessions, too. They both seem happier, friendlier and generally in a better mood.
        Link grunts less, and happily comes looking for strokes, which he usually isn’t interested in, and Daisy seems more confident all around. Not completely relying on Navi to tell her things are okay, she has started wandering around and will come to see us on her own initiative, instead.

        So, as soon as me knee is well enough for me to be getting on and off the floor again, we shall be cracking on with more personal, involved bonding sessions. But looking at their body language from these penned evenings, I’m very optimistic that we’ll have a heard of three in the not-so-distant future! 


      • RetroSquid
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          So, my knee is well enough to allow me to sit on the floor again, now.
          So, we’ve just concluded the third day of face-to-face time with the buns (As well as them being in the pens for a couple of hours beforehand)

          The first day, we just held them all, offered them no freedom, just let them see each other without the bars.

          The second day, Daisy slipped out of hand and had a little explore. Clearly bored after being in the pen for a couple of hours. Link responded how he always did, with a lunch in an attempt to nip her nose when she was close enough. But we just put out hand between them, let Daisy wander, then wrangled her under control. Was relatively uneventful.

          Today, though, after being in the pens for a couple of hours, we setup the area by the front door as usual, then had all the buns and a pile of hay in there.
          Link wasn’t as confident, but Navi and Daisy were frantically looking for the best pieces of hay (As they do).
          Link took a few minutes, but ended up joining in with the forage.

          He still goes to nip if anyone gets too close, even lunging at my hand a couple of times.
          We also noticed a very odd behaviour from Link…

          He was seemingly stalking Navi. He lowered his body and stood in the hay about a foot away from her, but slowly creeped forwards, keeping his eye on her (He normally turns his blind side to other rabbits), getting closer and closer… I think he’s been learning a little too well from his kitty companions.

          There were a couple of nip attempts and a little frantic humping going on between Navi and Daisy, but, all in all, I’m quite confident we’re making progress with them. Although the wife (Ouisie) doesn’t think so…


        • LBJ10
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            Maybe it would help if you split up the girls and did one-on-one sessions with Link.


          • RetroSquid
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              Yeah, we’ve considered that, but, have noticed that Daisy can be a little problematic if Navi isn’t there to put her in her place.

              She seems a very instinctive bun. Navi will hump her, then give her licks and she’ll sit about, quite happy while Link is in the same area. BUT if Navi isn’t there, she goes into attack mode almost instantly. Ears back, tail up.

              She seems to be taking her social cues straight from Navi.

              it’s actually been going relatively well, Link is already investigating them without nipping, although he still has his moments. Especially when Daisy tries to be submissive. He doesn’t like people/buns/cats putting anything right under his nose…


            • JackRabbit
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                What if the head put under his nose had a little banana on it?


              • RetroSquid
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                  Ha, we’ve tried banana-head before, although he obviously loves banana, he sees through the ruse and just nips anyway… He’s a horrible little turd.

                  But, in light of everything he’s been through, losing everyone he was close too, getting very ill and in and out of major surgery and suchlike, we kind of see him as sort of having PTSD and he just isn’t in full control of his emotions.

                  I definitely feel like we’re getting somewhere, though.

                  Today was a bond with hay. Everyone was distracted, everyone munched hay.

                  It went really well to begin with, but it wasn’t long before Link started getting a bit stressed, so today’s wasn’t anywhere near as long as yesterdays bonding.

                  Ouisie can’t help but gasp when/if Link goes to nip, and I think the noise stressed him out and put him on edge, making him more prone to nipping.

                  But we had a good ten minutes of all munching, him not turning his blind side to the girls and even accepting them rummaging for hay around him.

                  I can definitely see progress and, in reality, I think it’s going much quicker than I initially anticipated.


                • JackRabbit
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                    I think it sounds great!

                    I’m still surprised that he was turning his blind side to them. I would have thought he would always want to know exactly where they were and what they were doing. He must not see them as any kind of threat. Maybe with his blind side to them, he thought that if he couldn’t see them that they couldn’t see him either and they’d just go away. Now that he’s looking at them maybe he’s considering accepting them.


                  • RetroSquid
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                      It’s something he’s always done with us… Since the surgery, when he’s had enough of us, he just turns away so he can’t see us. It’s exactly how you say, if he can’t see us, we’re not there!

                      Such a grumpy little so-and-so!


                    • JackRabbit
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                        Grumpy but so cute!


                      • RetroSquid
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                          UPDATE:

                          So, we’ve been keeping up with regular sessions of the bonding, but have moved their little pens into the girls room so that when they’re all in them, side by side, they’re in the environment Link will be living in.

                          All the bonding sessions have been just simple sessions, nothing to report, bad or good, which, in itself is only good news.
                          But tonight, Link and Daisy surprised us both.

                          Daisy has always seemed very territorial where Link is concerned and has fought him on a number of occasions, but she’s been doing really well with this new phase of bonding. We’ve been watching her and she’s clearly been taking her behaviour cues from Navi. Intentionally sitting calm and still when Navi does, and if Link goes to nip her, instead of fighting him, she puts her head under Navi, almost as though she’s asking Navi for permission to move away… If that makes sense?!

                          But tonight, twice, Daisy, instead of running away from or towards Link, she stopped next to him and submissively put her head right under him. It seems that she has completely accepted Link, now!

                          And Link, instead of biting, as he always has done if ANY bun has put their nose under him, he acted as though he wasn’t happy about it, but just didn’t move that extra inch to nip, and instead just sat there, with Daisy’s head poking under his chin.

                          He’s a grumpy little so-and-so, but he’s seeming less and less grumpy after each bond!


                        • LBJ10
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                            Sounds like some real progress is being made!


                          • LittlePuffyTail
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                              Sounds like things are progressing well.

                              I love the pic of them all eating hay.


                            • RetroSquid
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                                Another Update:

                                Well, that was interesting. We were preparing for a bonding session, having them in their little pens, side-by-side, only this time, the pens are set up in the girls room, where they’re all going to be living.

                                We heard a bit of a ruckus, popped in to check and Daisy had managed to hop the wall from her and Navi’s pen, INTO Links. Initiating an early, and somewhat impromptu bond.

                                So, cleared the stuff out and decided to have the bond actually in the girls room now.

                                Noticed some strange behaviours from Daisy. She kept running at Link at lightning speed, then touching him, not nipping or anything, just running where he could see her, then running away, again at lightning speed.

                                This behaviour escalated to her actually nipping him a little, and sometimes he would give chase.
                                It feels to me, like they’re now, (now they’re no longer in neutral territory) they are testing each other while trying to figure out a pecking order.

                                Unfortunately, this escalated further into a couple of proper fights between Link and Daisy, but they weren’t difficult to separate and other than a little fur flying, nobody is harmed.

                                So, although things were stressful and there was a lot of fur, there has been no bloodshed and such.

                                It still feels like they’re making progress.


                              • SunnieDaze
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                                  Is it ok to let them give chase and even pull fur?


                                • RetroSquid
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                                    It’s been a while… Sorry if this is considered rehashing an old post, but it didn’t seem worth opening another for a continuation. 

                                    Right, as you all know by now, Link had a few health problems a year or so ago, likely brought on and exacerbated by stress, so, this bond has been so slow because I’ve been doing it completely at Link’s pace. Daily (Or at least almost when life has allowed) bonds, sometimes more… 

                                    Progress is/has been made, most definitely!

                                    Link is, for the first time in a long time, acting genuinely happy. He binkies all the time now, and seems to look forward to his time with the girls.

                                    We never thought we would see him like this.

                                    Unfortunately, he still nips. It isn’t even aggressive anymore, it almost just seems like habit and like a warning more than anything, he  just doesn’t like other buns right under his nose. And that is exactly it, he now ONLY nips when Navi or Daisy put their head under his chin, and even then, he’s probably only nipping maybe half the time. We’re seeing a definite change in his entire attitude, a lot of the time, he just moves away if they’re too close.

                                    Now, though… Daisy is a problem.
                                    She’s showing very similar behaviour to how she was when bonding her with Navi. She is clearly anxious and unsure about this other rabbit.
                                    When we were bonding her with Navi, they suddenly slipped into Navi being the boss and Daisy accepted that.
                                    Sometimes, we see Daisy trying to hump Navi, but Navi just put Daisy right back in her place. Navi is firm, but so gentle, she’s a fantastic den-mother.

                                    The problem is, Link will NEVER dominate Daisy, that’s just not who he is. He will never show her he’s the boss, and because of that, I just don’t see a change in this agitated behaviour of Daisy’s, when Link is facing her, she is quite quiet, and stays away, if Navi is there, she’ll happily sit next to him, but if he turns his back and Navi isn’t about, she charges him, always when his back is turned… 
                                    Normally, because he’s blind on one side, he doesn’t even notice, but she isn’t happy, not at all. And it doesn’t matter if it’s in totally neutral space, their room, his room, a small space, a wide, open space, Daisy is the same.

                                    Link has improved so much that normally the buns are in separate rooms, separated by a hallway so they never get contact unless we’re there, but lately, we’ve opened up the entire apartment to Link, (except the girls room) so that there is only one gate between them, with space between the bars for any of the buns to stick their noses through (And in Navi’s case, her slender head, too! &nbsp
                                    And Link is just fantastic, he doesn’t nip, he doesn’t get grumpy, he does, however, just sit by their gate, watching them, looking like he wants in with them. 

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                                Forum BONDING Lets give this bonding stuff a bash!