Forum

OUR FORUM IS UP BUT WE ARE STILL IN THE MIDDLE OF UPDATING AND FIXING THINGS.  SOME THINGS WILL LOOK WEIRD AND/OR NOT BE CORRECT. YOUR PATIENCE IS APPRECIATED.  We are not fully ready to answer questions in a timely manner as we are not officially open, but we will do our best. 

You may have received a 2-factor authentication (2FA) email from us on 4/21/2020. That was from us, but was premature as the login was not working at that time. 

BUNNY 911 – If your rabbit hasn’t eaten or pooped in 12-24 hours, call a vet immediately! Don’t have a vet? Check out VET RESOURCES

The subject of intentional breeding or meat rabbits is prohibited. The answers provided on this board are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. It is your responsibility to assess the information being given and seek professional advice/second opinion from your veterinarian and/or qualified behaviorist.

What are we about?  Please read about our Forum Culture and check out the Rules

BUNNY 911 – If your rabbit hasn’t eaten or pooped in 12-24 hours, call a vet immediately!  Don’t have a vet? Check out VET RESOURCES 

The subject of intentional breeding or meat rabbits is prohibited. The answers provided on this board are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet.  It is your responsibility to assess the information being given and seek professional advice/second opinion from your veterinarian and/or qualified behaviorist.

BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum DIET & CARE persistant urine around tail

Viewing 12 reply threads
  • Author
    Messages

    • MissPotterPhD
      Participant
      5 posts Send Private Message

         Hi there! I’m a long-time lurker, and you all helped my beloved Derby get through several bouts of GI Stasis and one of E. cuniculi. However, a new problem has me stumped, and I didn’t find quite the answer I needed just from lurking. Three weeks ago I started a new job where I’m gone for a regular 8 hour day (I used to be a graduate student), and Derby almost immediately started getting a bit smelly and wet on his behind. At first I thought it might be behavioral, due to the timing and the fact that his litterbox habits were (and are) still intact. Now I’m not so sure, but I’m having trouble working with a vet.

        Since his spring checkup, Derby and I moved to an area that has two rabbit vets, but neither are members of AEMV. I’m not sure they’re truly savvy, unlike the fantastic one we left behind. I went ahead and took Derby to one last week, thinking the vet would express a sample of urine, run bloodwork, and do an x-ray. Instead he just looked in Derby’s eyes and ears, palpated him, gave me a syringe to try to collect pee myself (how, when Derby goes in his litter?!) and sent me on my way. He also made a comment abou how his own rabbit is mean, and kept referring to cages. It did not inspire confidence.

        I’ve let a week go by, nervously, and added every kind of naturally antibiotic herb I could think of to Derby’s diet — thyme especially. I ground up cranberry tablets in case this is a UTI, and am avoiding all greens high in calcium. Derby seemed moderately better, but I noticed one thing: he is MUCH more inclined to pee when I’m home. Over the weekend, he used his litterbox regularly and without any signs of strain or irregular volume. However, today I was gone from 8:30am to 4pm, and he didn’t pee at all while I was away. He was all wet wen I got home, though — much more than usual. It was horrible. I’d been doing corn starch baths, but I gave him a water bath. He’s been working on getting the water off, and smells better than he has in weeks. Thus, I know this isn’t a spinal issue because he can reach all the usual places to groom them, and because he still jumps in and out of his litter box, onto furniture, etc. His appetite and water consumption is, and always has been, fine.

        So my question is this. Should I go back to that iffy vet and demand x-rays, bloodwork, and for him to get a urine sample? If he finds a stone, should I trust him to remove it? Should I try the other vet, with no clear sense that he/she will be any better? Should I wait longer to see if this is a behavioral response to my absence? I’m at my wit’s end, and any feeback would be wonderful.


      • Beka27
        Participant
        16016 posts Send Private Message

          It does sound kind of… Behavioral… Based on the timing and that it doesn’t always happen. You sound very well versed in rabbit care and health, so I am assuming he is neutered and this isn’t due to a hormonal surge.

          How far are you outside of the area you lived before? Is it possible to return to your rabbit savvy vet for diagnostics?


        • Deleted User
          Participant
          22064 posts Send Private Message

            In case you haven’t come across it there is a list of suggested questions on rabbit.org for you to use before booking an appointment with a vet, it should help you decide if the vet really is vet savvy. Personally I’d try a phone call to the other vet in your area, take things from there. Not only does your report on the vet you last visited not inspire confidence, the real point is you didn’t find it reassuring or helpful, you have something substantial to compare to (your last good vet) and it doesn’t sound as though you are likely to be comfortable or build a solid relationship with this vet. I feel very strongly that having a vet you can deal with and feel you trust is a significant part of having your animals well cared for, … and that goes double in the case of rabbits.

            I’m really not experienced enough to comment on the actual symptoms, though with his being better when you were home on the weekend that does make it sound more behavioural. Any chance someone you are both close to could come in and visit him middle of the day, … just to help him transition to you being away all day? Maybe a mid day visit would be a comfort, and (in his mind) provide a pee break, ease him over into spending longer stretches on his own.


          • MissPotterPhD
            Participant
            5 posts Send Private Message

              Thanks so much for your comments, Beka27 and Grey Dove. Derby is neutered, so yes, this isn’t hormones. Unfortunately our old rabbit savvy vet is now 8 hours away.

              I came home at noon today — I’m a college professor so I have a somewhat flexible schedule — and gave him his veggies then instead of in the morning. Until I started my new job, he’d been accustomed to having them at noon rather than morning. I wondered if this was metabolic or if he was falling asleep so soundly with me being gone that he didn’t wake up to pee. (The snoring has definitely increased as he ages!) He was dry, and he ate his veggies and promptly peed in his box tidily. I thought “CASE CLOSED!”

              Nope. I came home again at 4 and he was wet. He always wets himself sometime in the afternoon, in fact — never seen it any other time. I’ve wondered if we’ve got some sort of aging situation going on here, since he’s 6-7. He doesn’t show any arthritis symptoms, and still rears up when he pees. I did notice, however, that his leg was a bit splayed out in the litter box this time. I’m wondering if his hips aren’t working so well anymore. Yet it was so sudden, and he still does jump up onto the couch with me. I suppose this could also be e. Cuniculi paralysis. I’m thinking I’ll call the other vet. Fingers crossed that this one is okay, or we’ll have to drive 1.5 hours to Knoxville, TN, where there is a veterinary school.


            • Sarita
              Participant
              18851 posts Send Private Message

                I have not had rabbits with EC but I have had some elderly rabbits and many with arthritis so they have had mobility problems much like what it sounds like you are saying.

                They did and do have the persistent urine around the tail problem – I think it is because they cannot position themselves as well as when they were younger to urinate. I have an 11.5 year old male right now that I am constantly cleaning his rear end and pulling out fur in that area because of mobility problems.

                It could certainly be some arthritic problems as well – I’ve had a rabbit as young as 4 that was diagnosed with arthritis – it showed up in his x-rays and many others with arthritis – it seems to be prevalent in many rabbits.


              • Deleted User
                Participant
                22064 posts Send Private Message

                  Maybe you are dealing with a combination, some joint discomfort/problem that was present but minor enough not to have caught your attention, and now the stress of moving and a changed home and routine have added a behavioural issue to the original problem.

                  Since you’ve definitely established he is a happy peer when you are home why not give him his salad in the evening? It is a major in take of liquid and maybe he could do the bulk of his peeing over night while you are there. (Which might also help give you a clearer picture of the root of the problem you are dealing with.)

                  Also, I know it isn’t a long term answer to the vet problem but in your place I’d phone my old vet and ask if they have any thoughts or suggestions, something to try while you are getting another appointment etc. I presume you asked that vet if they could recommend one near where you now live? If you didn’t that might also be worth trying. But obviously you need to find someone reliable to see regularly.

                  He’s lucky to be in such good caring hands, … I’m sure you’ll work it out together. Do let us know what is happening.


                • MissPotterPhD
                  Participant
                  5 posts Send Private Message

                    Thanks Sarita and Grey Dove. I just flipped him over to do a corn starch “bath” and clumps of fur were starting to fall out. He also stunk up the whole bathroom, once I closed the door. I decided I just can’t handle seeing him like this anymore; my instinct says something is wrong even though his spirits are good and he still uses his litter. I made an appointment for him in Knoxville. It will be a 1.5 hour drive, which is fine for now but worries me in cases of emergency. I still think it is probably worth it. My old vet couldn’t find AEMV listings closer, but this Knoxville one’s practice is 25% rabbits and he is listed on the HRS page. Derby is insured, so I’m going to ask for blood work and x-rays even if he doesn’t suggest them himself.

                    I know trancing them is a last-ditch option, but I have to do it to get to his bum for the dry bath. I tranced him twice today, since he jumped out of the first one. Both times I noticed significant stiffness in one leg, so I’m wondering if this is arthritis or an injury. He’s been sitting crooked sometimes too, but I thought that might have been due to all the yucky wet fur. We have all hardwood flooring here, and I’m waiting to get paid before I can buy a rug. Thus, he’s not getting as much exercise. I haven’t seen a binky since we got here, though he binkied all over a carpeted house he and I visited after the move.

                    I’m still worried, but am hoping and praying that this Knoxville vet is great.

                    P.S. He actually does get half his salad in the evening — I stagger his feedings to four times a day since he is a huge pig. I wish he was more of a pig about his unlimited hay. *rolls eyes* He’s such a little individual.


                  • Deleted User
                    Participant
                    22064 posts Send Private Message

                      From all you’ve said sounds as though you made the right call.

                      I sympathize with your desire to have someone closer but better a longer drive to someone reliable. Like it or not my closest rabbit savvy vet is a good hour and a half drive away too so I know how you feel.

                      They are very good at hiding problems so best to follow your inner guide on this, … least that’s the way I always feel. I was terribly ignorant of rabbits and their needs while I had my last one but I knew when he wasn’t well. I’d be argued with, that he was eating and looked fine but I’d know.Sadly didn’t help him much, didn’t know much about what to do, … you do and he’s lucky.

                      Please let us know what happens after your appointment!!!


                    • Beka27
                      Participant
                      16016 posts Send Private Message

                        I appreciate the thorough replies to our thoughts and questions. The extra info really helps. At his age, it is very, very likely that this is an arthritic/mobility issue. I think you’re on the right track with getting xrays done at the vet school. I would also call the second local vet and ‘feel them out’. If it is arthritis, he will need to be on meds longterm, so you want someone local to work with. I would ask the vet hospital and the local vet what their experience is regarding collaboration. Will the hospital send copies of the diagnostics to the local vet? Will the doctors there consult with the local vet as needed? Be upfront with the local vet regarding your knowledge and that you require a very hands-on approach, not just palliative care.

                        You know your bunny. He is a senior, but by no means ancient, and should have quite a few good years left. Keep us posted on his story and how everything goes!


                      • MissPotterPhD
                        Participant
                        5 posts Send Private Message

                          Grey Dove and Beka27, thanks for your response. I do think it will be worth it to drive to this vet, even though it ended up taking more like an 1 hour 40 minutes. He has a regular practice, rather than working at the vet school, and 25% of his patients are rabbits. He has good reviews from bunny people online. I left the other vet feeling worried, and I left this one feeling like he knew bunnies and was respectful to me. He spoke fondly of his own rabbits, and treated me like I knew what I was talking about. What is more, Derby was incredibly relaxed there — not even a sign of slight nerves. He actually just laid down and chilled out on the scale! Derby was on edge with the one I tried last week, but he let this one carry him around without so much as a squirm.

                          The vet tested Derby’s urine, and it had no blood, crystals, or bacteria to speak of (there was a little, but probably because I’d taken the sample from an empty litter box). The vet said that there is something that happens to the cell walls (?) of bacteria that has lived internally, and this didn’t look like that. He then did an ultrasound and saw no stones. Whew! He thinks this is either an injury or arthritis, and suggested we treat him with meloxicam for a bit before x-raying. I would have been fine with x-rays now, and told him so, but he thought if we took any imaging that we should start with ultrasound because it reveals more in the bladder. (Derby did so well on the trip that I don’t mind the possibility that I might have to drive him to Knoxville again for x-rays, and since the vet knew I wanted imaging and recommended the ultrasound, I figured I’d defer to his expertise there.) The vet gave me the 30ml bottle of metacam, which I’m pleased about because I like to have it on hand and vets in the past have been stingy. He prescribed 1ml for my 6.5lb rabbit twice a day for five days, tapering off to the same dosage once a day for another five days. I know that’s a bit on the high side, but it’s in range, right? Any thoughts, before I drug my guy up tonight?

                          Beka27, I asked Derby what he thought about the fact that someone from the internet called him a senior, and he winked. Make of that what you will.


                        • Deleted User
                          Participant
                          22064 posts Send Private Message

                            I’m so glad you had such a positive experience and that Derby is getting the treatment/care he needs. Also delighted that there is nothing seriously wrong and that has now been confirmed! I’m sure he’ll be more himself in no time!

                            I feel very strongly that a vet who doesn’t respect what you have to say about your animal is one that should be replaced. You live with him, you know him, you are the only person who can help a vet understand and fill in the blanks! So I’m really happy you left that other one.

                            I think Beka’s suggestions about asking if your new vet would work with the other local vet (or better yet if they have in the past) is one worth discussing with him. If he has arthritis then I suspect you’ll be giving him meds fairly regularly, if that’s the case having a local sergery would be convenient, … least for the routine appointments and meds. Just a thought.

                            Please let us know how it goes. Afraid I am completely ignorant of dosage amounts etc. so I really can’t help you there. However, sounds as though the vet should know what he is doing, if its on the high side perhaps he just wants to insure that the bugs are truly knocked out.

                            Please do give a progress report in a few days. Hugs and pets to Derby!


                          • pablosmommy
                            Participant
                            2 posts Send Private Message

                              What was the result with Derby?? My rabbit has a persistent urine dribbling problem I can’t seem to figure out. We have gone through blood tests, urinalysis, and xrays with no answers. I have noticed him sitting a little lopsided at times but no motility problems at all.


                            • Sarita
                              Participant
                              18851 posts Send Private Message

                                Pablosmommy, this post is over 9 months old – we ask that members do not reply to old posts and I don’t believe this member has posted since then. I am going to lock this and hopefully you’ll get some answers from your other post.

                            Viewing 12 reply threads
                            • The topic ‘persistant urine around tail’ is closed to new replies.

                            Forum DIET & CARE persistant urine around tail