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Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Rushing Pip to vet-SEIZURE-need help

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    • MimzMum
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        Pip had a 30 second seizure this afternoon about 3:30.

        Off to vets now. Need to know what to ask the vet for in case she is not my rabbit savvy one.

        Vibes and prayers, please?


      • Monkeybun
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          Oh no! I have no idea what to ask, but i’m sending all the vibes I can to you. Hope it turns out to be nothing bad!


        • peepi&warri
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            Hope Pip is ok. :\
            I’ve been dealing with this too.. Warri’s had 4 seizures in the past two weeks. We started him on Panacur a few days ago in case E Cuniculi is the cause.


          • Sarita
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              Vibes, hope Pip is okay. I’m thinking the same as Peepi – makes me wonder about EC.


            • MimzMum
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                Waiting while they examine her.

                Just so scared. She’s never done this before.
                Very hot here. She may have heatstroke but since Mimzy is probably positive for pasturella I worry about E.C. too
                Third strike is Pip is
                part lionhead. Still shedding winter coat too.
                Thank you for vibes. Maybe some for my daughter as well, she is at home with Jenna and very freaked out about her rabbit. :'(


              • jerseygirl
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                  (((((Vibes))))) for Pip and her Humans! Hope you are closer to knowing the cause.

                  (((((Vibes))))) also for Warri. I’m sorry to hear.


                • MimzMum
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                    Dr. suspects heat caused at the moment since there’s no nystagmus and I haven’t seen any head tilt. Will run bloods, sub q’s and a course of panacur to be safe.
                    Poor Pip. I thought I was taking good care of her.
                    I’m sorry…vibes to Warri also! I’ve been AWOL from bb.com lately.
                    Hey Jerz! Good to see ya’! How’re your bubs?


                  • jerseygirl
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                      You do take good care of them MM! You can’t blame yourself. Pip could well have had mild infection which meant her system was already heated. That plus warm environment meaning harder for her to regulate her temp. Just a “hypothetical”. Hopefully it was the one and only seizure.

                      We’re good thankyou . I really must get on the home pc and update on bb about the buns etc.


                    • Kokaneeandkahlua
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                        Yikes Mimz!!! How scary!!! I’m sorry! *Hugs*

                        {{{Vibes}}} I think seizures luckily have only been observed in european lionheads-thats what I read when I was trying to convince Dave to let me get a second rabbit and he decided lionhead. But who knows. Heats hard on lionheads, even with a/c…Would you vet give her a shave for you? I shave Kahlua now all year and I think that helps.

                        {{{Vibes}}} to Pip

                        {{{Vibes}}} To Warri!!! *hugs* to Peppi & Warri my goodness how scary!!


                      • peppypoo
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                          Vibes to Pip and Warri too!! Best wishes for both of you as well .

                          K&K, my first bunny Tammo (a chocolate dutch) had congenital seizures throughout his life. We never found out what caused it, and several vets failed to diagnose it. There were a few warning signs though, and we could usually tell when it was about to happen. he was always fine afterwards, if not a bit tired, but it was so difficult to watch.


                        • MimzMum
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                            Thanks everyone. Finally home but the power was out when we got here and my mobile died in town so could only update now.

                            Doc does believe heat was the cause but I picked up some Safeguard (fenbendazole for dogs) on her instructions to be sure. She is to receive 0.5 ml once a day for seven days.

                            I also got a one off diazepam injection for her should she fit again and it becomes prolonged. Just to be sure she doesn’t go so long that she breaks her spine or something.
                            I’ve never seen a seizure in an animal before except for my cat who I think either stroked in front of me or went into cardiac arrest and passed away in my arms. I was terrified Pip was going to die right there…I’ve never felt more sick to my stomach.
                            She’s munching away in her pen now. T-storms came through and cooled the outside air considerably but it’s still bad enough in the house that Mimzy looks as if he’ll melt.

                            I couldn’t imagine going through multiple seizures, Peppypoo…what were the signs? Pip just was scratching her ear one minute and completely convulsed the next. I’d like some kind of a heads’ up if you could tell me what to look for.

                            Does anyone else have any advice for me on how to proceed? Is there anything I should know about the Safeguard? What possible reactions could there be?
                            God help me I never want this to happen to any of my beloved furbabies again….but I have to presume it might.

                            Thanks again for all the vibes. Sending hugs to all!


                          • BinkyBunny
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                              I don’t have any helpful information regarding your questions. (hopefully someone will have the answers). I too have never had a bunny seizure (except for what the body does sometimes after a bunny passes, so I too would have been completely freaked out thinking that my bunny had just died) I am so sorry!!! How incredibly frightening.

                              I know your vet believed it might be heat, and if you feel it may have possibly been the issue too, then the only thing I thought of is some “cooling tips”– What about offering a 16oz or 32 ounce frozen water bottle? We don’t have air-conditioning in our place and if things get a little toasty, Vivian loves to cuddle right on next to the big 32oz frozen bottle. I have three different ones that I can rotate if necessary.

                              Sending you hugs and sending pip healing vibes.


                            • MimzMum
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                                Thanks BB. I actually already had a frozen water bottle in the pen with her and the windows open and fan going …that’s another reason it was such a shock. She’s never had trouble with heat before…it’s always Mimzy who looks the worst.

                                I think too our oppressive humidity and pressure changes here are becoming too much for the buns. As they age their resistance to these things diminishes. Will have to be more vigilant and perhaps rearrange living conditions.

                                I didn’t know bunnies would seize after death. :'( That sounds terrible. I’ve got certain plans set up for end of life procedures with my vet and I’ll tell you the thought that I might have to use them today was sickening.

                                She seems well enough at the moment but I doubt I’ll sleep much tonight.

                                Thanks again.


                              • BinkyBunny
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                                  Posted By MimzMum on 06/08/2012 11:22 PM

                                  I didn’t know bunnies would seize after death. :'( That sounds terrible. I’ve got certain plans set up for end of life procedures with my vet and I’ll tell you the thought that I might have to use them today was sickening.

                                  I’m so sorry to have said that. That must have been disturbing. Please accept my apologies. I just know that sometimes people think that their bunny convulsed and passed when sometimes it can be the other way around, and they just didn’t know it.  I am not even sure why that was relevant and I so I’m sorry to have just blurted/posted that. However, that doesn’t happen when end of life is assisted at the vets. Jack went very peacefully, as did Bailey.  It was just when Rucy and my first bunny passed in my arms before I could get them to the vet, that the difference was apparent and I had asked my vet about it.   Again, I am sorry if what I said disturbed anyone.  

                                  Try not to let my morbid tactlessness prevent you from sleep. Pip is in good hands, well-loved and you are doing a good job covering all of your bases as far as what might be the cause. Just try your best to rest.  HUGS!


                                • MimzMum
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                                    Oh Jen, no, I didn’t mean what you said would make me lose sleep. I’m actually thankful to know that because I can prepare myself in the event. We live a long way from the vets so I should have an idea what’s coming in case we don’t get there in time.
                                    I’m sorry …I didn’t realize what had happened with Rucy and your other bun. ((((((((Hugs))))))))

                                    No, you know me…sick bunny = up all nite. It’s the fate of all devoted bunny slaves.

                                    She still seems a bit unsteady going to and from the litterbox tonight but I haven’t given her meds yet. Do you know if she should have something yo eat first? Should I also give metacam? She’ll be pretty sore in her back and sides from all the twisting I’m guessing.


                                  • BinkyBunny
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                                      Thanks for making me feel like less of a big numbskull 

                                      As far as the meds and eating. I know that with with Rucy, antibiotics seemed to make her tummy upset (she wouldn’t want to eat), and so I always made sure she ate first. However, if it was pain related, I would give her metacam first so that pain would be relieved so she could eat. It never upset her stomach for me to give that first.


                                    • jerseygirl
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                                        It’s good that you saw her right when it happened as it might provide you a clue. Though not good on your nerves!

                                        Did they check in her ears? Wondering if an antibiotic would be worthwhile at all.

                                        So the Safeguard is for possible e.c? All I know is panacur is normally given in a course of 28 days. Maybe check again with the vet?


                                      • MimzMum
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                                          Double post from my stupidphone…ignore


                                        • MimzMum
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                                            Vet only wanted me to give 7 days of fenbendazole…it’s dog strength. Maybe that’s significant.
                                            No antibiotics. No idea what her temp was or is. Her ears feel hot. She’s breathing quickly and seems agitated. I thought she might have had another small seizure about 2a.m. but I hadn’t given her meds yet. She’d had a lettuce leaf so administered the fenbendazole and 0.1 ml of metacam. Taking a guess on the dose, will repeat it at 2 in the afternoon if I can’t reach the vet tomorrow. But now I’m thinking I should’ve gotten some baytril or something.

                                            Will metacam help if she has a fever? I’m afraid to sleep…what if she gets worse…or …dies? :'(

                                            I’m really scared. She’s always been such a healthy bun. Stroppy to the last she fights me on all her meds. I just can’t imagine her not making it.

                                            BB…if you ever think of yourself in such uncomplimentary terms as ‘numbskull’ again I’ll come down there and give you a right proper kick up the butt! (Wags finger). If it weren’t for you and this website/community Pip would never have had the life of a grand lady bun as she has. So no more of that talk.


                                          • jerseygirl
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                                              Metacam does have fever reducing properties though I dont know what dosage would have this effect.
                                              (((Pip)))


                                            • LittlePuffyTail
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                                                Poor Pippy! I’m so glad that she is okay now and it was only the one episode! How scary!

                                                Is it real hot where you are? I keep a small thermometer in my rabbit room so I can very carefully monitor the temp. Everyone thinks I’m way to anal but I like to be careful in summer.

                                                ((((((((Feel better Pip!!)))))))))


                                              • MimzMum
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                                                  It’s not awful heat but combined with fluctuating humidity and crazy air pressure…yeah it can get uncomfortable for me and it must be hellish for the bunnies.

                                                  Pip seems peaceful at the moment so I’m going to try to rest. Doubt I’ll get much sleep but anything helps.
                                                  Thanks again everyone. Will keep you posted as long as my phone holds out!


                                                • RabbitPam
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                                                    Gosh, MM, I’m just seeing this now.
                                                    First, most importantly {{{{{{{{{{{{{Healing vibes for Pip}}}}}}}}}}}

                                                    My first thought was dehydration due to the heat, but she must have been hydrated during the treatment. Like the frozen snuggle water bottle, I sometimes would take a very small ice cube and sink it in the water dish (or float in the middle) so that my bunny wouldn’t be drinking ice, but it would cool it just above room temp. Ice water is bad as you know, but slightly cool water and plenty to drink can help dehydration, which causes lots of weird symptoms in pets and humans.
                                                    If the vet said Metacam is OK, I think she’d be more comfortable having some.
                                                    Would a little fur trimming cool her also?
                                                    How is she doing now?


                                                  • MimzMum
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                                                      Hi Pam! It’s good to hear from you again.
                                                      Well about 2a.m. I gave Pip the Safeguard and metacam and she settled pretty well so by the time I’d wound down from stress at four I was able to drift off but everytime I thought she moved I was up like a shot. Not sure in my addled state who was moving about. All three are in the room with me, so…
                                                      Anyway, by ten this morning I was awake enough to really look at her. She’s been scratching her ears still (that right one particularly and it does sit a bit askew) and her fur shows signs of chewing and plucking where she’s shedding. I just keep trying to use the hairbuster on her but we’ve apparently got layers of undercoat I had no idea were there before. Our summers seem wetter lately but they must be steaming all three bunnies up because they’re all perpetually shedding…so I may not have attributed dehydration to Pip’s symptoms as she’s pretty regularly draining her crock and then goes for her bottle. Hay consumption is relatively normal and only meadow grass, even though she’s peeing on it and sometimes will do so when I reach into her pen for her. I’ve been trying to ascertain if the grass hays are too calcium rich for her because she is occasionally wetting outside her box depending on which one I feed her. Even her beloved oat hay doesn’t escape a soaking. I mentioned this to the vet also…she didn’t seem to think much of it. (not our usual bunny vet as you can tell)
                                                      I can’t feed her many soaked veggies if any because her cecals are now very mushy. Dysbiosis could be the problem or just another symptom.

                                                      It’s been suggested that perhaps a middle ear infection might have caused the seizure and that would have to be tested for since you can’t see the area in question with the otoscope. I don’t even know if Pip had a fever yesterday because the vet didn’t mention it, but I felt her ears and they seemed terribly warm to me last night. Had the window open and the fan going which doesn’t help my insomnia but couldn’t bear the thought of her getting overheated any further.
                                                      Today it’s overcast and we’re supposed to be in the 70’s again. She seems okay for now but needless to say the shock and worry is not leaving me anytime soon.
                                                      Sigh…better ring the vet and get a definitive dose for metacam for her. It certainly can’t hurt…except for the administration which means a jolly chase around her habitat. 0_o
                                                      Any idea if she could run a course of antibiotics during the fenbendazole treatment? Just in case we’re looking at an inner ear problem? Or do we finish this first then look at other problems later so we know what we’re treating properly? Since they couldn’t get blood from her tiny ear veins we’re kind of shooting in the dark here as it is.

                                                      By the way…still no sign of head tilt. Wouldn’t it be showing up by now? And I don’t see her wobbling around drunkenly as if she had no balance, so do you suppose her ears are really just itchy or could there be something else going on with them we’re not seeing?
                                                      She did had a tiny bit of discharge from her left eye yesterday after the fit. Though the vet said her eyes were tracking fine and all. I have to check her bum today too, I don’t know if she’s still having messy stuff there or not.
                                                      Sorry for the long update. Figured I’d better get all the eggs in one basket.
                                                      Hugs to all!


                                                    • Sarita
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                                                        Yes, you can do antibiotics and fenbendazole at the same time – it’s pretty common to use both treatments.

                                                        You won’t necessarily get head tilt from an ear infection or EC – it’s just a symptom, but it’s not the only one.


                                                      • MimzMum
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                                                          Ah..okay. I thought if they had E.C. it got worse before getting better.
                                                          She’s still doing well but it’s a lot cooler today too. I’m really hoping it was just a heat thing.

                                                          Haven’t heard back from the vet though so….Grrr.


                                                        • LittlePuffyTail
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                                                            Im sorry if you mentioned this in the posts I read yesterday, but did the vet do a culture of her ears?


                                                          • MimzMum
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                                                              Yes I usually have them do ear slides. She found no mites or other parasites…since I was in such a state having rushed in there and being so stunned by it all I can’t remember if she tested for infection. Going to give another call today and see if we can’t connect.
                                                              Pip is doing well, though every time she begins scratching at night I flip out thinking she’s seizing again. She shakes, rattles and rolls pretty loud just tackling an itch. She weighs 5 lbs. 10 oz.!
                                                              It goes without saying that her dislike for the taste of fenbendazole is registered in strongest possible terms. A few raisins reward are summarily demanded.
                                                              Now if I can just figure out what’s gone wrong with Mimzy. (Off to make secondary post.)


                                                            • MimzMum
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                                                                Oops…that should’ve been Craisins …not raisins! Stoopid spellcgeck…..


                                                              • BinkyBunny
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                                                                  I’m glad Pip is doing better. Now if the vet can just figure out what is going on with Mimz! (just read your other post). E.C. can be tricky — as well as inner ear infections. Rucy had an inner ear infection that caused her lose her balance and spin. Within 48 hours of the antibiotics, she was doing much better. I know for other bunnies it can take much longer. Though I have had a e.c. symptomatic bunny, Bailey– the symptom was not head-tilt, just hind-leg weakness. And with E.C. it’s good to give the meds just in case it’s e.c. because it can help prevent further damage. So it’s great you have that covered. Some bunnies can react rather quickly to it, while others will take time. It basically helps their own immune system keep the parasite at bay, which should help prevent it from worsening before it gets better. Should just help prevent worsening. But again, how severe and how long really varies bunny to bunny.


                                                                • MimzMum
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                                                                    Thanks BB. And again thanks to everyone sending vibes.
                                                                    I suppose Pip’s seizure and Mimzy’s sudden onset head tilt could be unrelated. It’s entirely possible they’ve both been ailing and keeping it hidden and the heat just flipped that last switch …but I can’t be sure.
                                                                    I just wish their regular doc was seeing them. She knows them best and doesn’t make me feel foolish when I ask questions. Plus I know I’ll forget something and then it’s all telephone tag from there. I hate that we live so far out, it would be less stress on the buns if we lived in town.

                                                                    At vets with Mimz now. Pip was doing well when I left home but it’s another scorcher today.


                                                                  • RabbitPam
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                                                                      You probably do this already, MM, but I would keep a medium-sized spiral notebook for their care and take it with me each time. Just make notes in the vets’ offices of what they say and write it all down with the date and which bunny it’s for. Then, later on, if you need to, you can refer back to it right there as new visits come up. You can even add notes in the margin about efficacy with each treatment attempt. (ie. 3 days on this med, no sign of improvement.) Just do not write any speculation or ideas in it – do that here. This would just be for vet statements and actual treatments used.


                                                                    • Kokaneeandkahlua
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                                                                        {{Vibes}} It sounds like your doing everything you can! If it was the heat, what a blessing because there would be nothing to get over!

                                                                        Do you wet the bunnies when it’s really hot? I wonder what your vet would think about you doing that? I know bunnies don’t bathe well but neither do cats, but to cool them off in really hot conditions its a-ok to soak them a bit. Maybe see what your vet thinks, it may help during the heat -just a thought.


                                                                      • MimzMum
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                                                                          Thanks Pam & Lesley. Yes I took a small towel and wet it with cool water and stroked Pip with it right after the seizure. It seemed to do her some good. But I stop before she gets too wet so she doesn’t go into shock.
                                                                          God has blessed us with a few cooler and rainy days. It’s probably not doing anything for Mimzy’s arthritis but it’s one factor I don’t have to concern myself with.
                                                                          Pip continues to do well…God willing I won’t ever see that happen again. Once is quite enough.

                                                                          I do need to get myself more notebooks Pam. I can’t keep their meds straight between the three of them And usually Hubby goes in with me but of late stays in the car. He is tiring of having bunnies, methinks.

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                                                                      Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Rushing Pip to vet-SEIZURE-need help