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Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Emrg vet appt later today – what can I expect if blockage?

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    • HippityHopMom
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        My Bonnie Lee stopped eating yesterday.  Just nibble some today.   She has not had bowel movement for last 4 hrs, but I think she did pass her cecum & ate it around 10 am.    It is 1:40 pm here now.    I have vet appt at 4:30 with a vet I have never seen.    My reg. vet is not experienced with rabbits …. the new vet is suppose to be … but she is not listed on HRS list.    The vets on HRS are all 2 hrs away from me.   One was 1 hr away and they could not see Bonnie today.     From what I have heard from my customers, the vet I am seeing today is great …. but my customers have dogs and cats.  (I board pets).      What I have done for Bonnie once I noted she was ill :   I stayed up all night with her holding her for many hours and keeping her warm, gave her small amount of fresh pineapple juice, massaged her, loved on her and praying she gets better.    This morning I put her on a heat pad.  She stayed on the heat pad until it warmed up today and she moved off of it.   She has moved around slightly & went 2 rooms away to her daytime sleeping spot which is under my bed.     Her tummy does not feel swollen.   She is tired and getting weaker.   She becomes alert when I get near her … she is shying away and running from me now because I have been picking her up often to care for her.      I am thinking she may have a blockage from a hair ball.     I wanted to ask what to expect from the vet visit today …. what should I look for to make sure this vet is doing the proper thing ?   I believe I have read some vets make a mistake and can give a wrong medication …. can someone tell me what that medication may be so I make sure it is not given?  


      • Sarita
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          Why do you suspect a blockage?

          For a blockage you should expect the vet to do an x-ray. And what is normally recommended is fluids and getting Bonnie Lee active.

          I went back and read as well the your Bonnie Lee is a Holland Lop and they are notorious for having dental problems like molar spurs so have the vet check her teeth as well.


        • jerseygirl
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            I think your option of seeing the new vet today that has some rabbit experience sounds like the best thing for Bonnie Lee. She’s had a lot of this trouble before hasn’t she? Hopefully this vet can give you some insight as to why.

            When I’ve taken in a rabbit for same concerns, my vet always feels the abdomen, takes the temperature and gives a gut motility drug by injection. Some vets like to give fluids also depending on the rabbits condition. Temperature is pretty important because the drugs do not work effectively if the rabbit has gone into shock.
            Sometimes they will give an antibiotic also along with the gut meds which is fine. If me, I would not be happy if my rabbit were ONLY given an antibiotic and nothing else when they haven’t been eating and toileting. The important thing is getting the gut functioning first. This sort of thing is not always due to a hairball. However, a hairball or impaction of food can occur because the gut has slowed down if that makes sense.

            If you have time, I recommend reading this article if you have not read it before. http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/ileus.html

            I’m not exactly sure what you may have read in regards to wrong medications. Some things to know regardless is about penecillins. They should only be given by injection for rabbits and there is a caution around amoxcillin for rabbits. I do not think that a vet would administer penecillins for gut stasis though. The other med I can think of is Frontline for flea and mite treatment. This should never be given to rabbits. Again, something you shouldn’t have to worry about today.

            I hope the visit goes well and provide Bonnie some comfort! {{{Bonnie Lee}}}


          • jerseygirl
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              I do agree about the teeth. Do have the vet check her molars. It’s important to try find out why they stop eating then have these gut slow downs.


            • HippityHopMom
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                Reply to Sarita, …. yes, she is a Holland Lop.    My reg. vet checked her teeth in January of this year.    She went in sick in Janaury and he took

                Xrays of her mouth and tummy.    He said her teeth looked good.   But the xray of her stomach showed a spot he felt was a large hairball.   It was late at night and no rabbits vets in my area …. and he is an excellent dog vet …. so this is why he saw Bonnie in January.    He had me take her home and he told me to stop at groc. store and buy a FRESH pineapple and use syringe to get the pineapple juice in her …. that is hopefully would break up the hairball.    She was better a few hours after having the Pineapple juice.         Prior to her visit January 2011 …. it seemed Bonnie was having tummy problems about every 4 weeks.   Small spells of not eating … but tummy rubs helped her … and I gave her Mylicon before too that helped her.   …. and after seeing the vet in January …. she has done great … no more problems until yesterday.   I did give her fresh pineapple every so often since Janaury …. just for a preventative …. I brush her more now and she had a bath a couple months ago … just being safe and helping keep her shedding down.    Also, let me advise … she use to shed terrible all the time …. until she began taking Pineapple in January …. since then … she does not shed as bad.    ….. Now the last couple of weeks … she has not had any pineapple …. we were hit with the tornado on April 27 that killed so many in AL.   I live 40 minutes from the AL  in the state of Georgia.   We had extensive damage to our dog kennels and garden shed.   But our home and all pets were not harmed in the tornado …. we were very lucky.     But dealing with the extensive damage to fences and kennels …. I failed to cut up a Pineapple I had on my counter …. and Bonnie was not getting her pineapple on a reg. basis ….. so I am not sure …. I was suspecting it may be another hairball.  

                 


              • Sarita
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                  Goodness…you’ve been through alot! I hope you get back to normal soon.

                  Usually with blockages the best thing to get the gut moving again which is really what a “hairball” is, a gut slowdown, is lots of fluids to break up the mass. And activity as well, get her moving.

                  The best preventative should be hay though – is she not a good hay eater?

                  I would double check the teeth as usual as well – molar spurs can cause a rabbit to stop eating which of course starts the process of stasis. Even though in January her teeth were fine, it’s possible that she has developed molars spurs since then. Always worth a look when these things happen.


                • HippityHopMom
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                    Let me also add … I know the Pineapple prescription is an “old remedy” by vets years ago …. I was told this from the forum after I took her in January.  But she bounced back so well after having the Pineapple juice … and she has gone 5 months now with no problems ….. and she actually has seemed more active and definitely shedding much less ….. so I think the Pineapple prescription was a good advise at that time …. and of course maybe a lucky remedy that time too.    But for some reason … it has helped her shedding problem.   Bonnie use to shed very badly constantly. 

                    I do realize it is time for her to see a vet that knows more about rabbits and I have been on the internet and phone all morning calling. 


                  • Sarita
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                      The most important thing is that it helped your Bonnie. It is old school but that doesn’t mean it can’t have some benefits and perhaps it kept her hydrated.

                      Keep us updated on what the vet says and we’ll be sending vibes your way.


                    • HippityHopMom
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                        Thank you for all the info …. yes, she has had problems often … but this was going on before January 13, 2011.      She has not had any problems since Jan 13th until now.    

                        I do not remember what I read a long time ago about which meds were harmful to rabbits …but,  it was not a flea product.   I do remember not to put dog flea meds on rabbits.     Fortunately, we don’t have a flea problem in our home.   I take all kinds of care to avoid fleas.   I have a pest control come and spray outside only around the house and I all my pet bedding all the time.   I have hardwoods and tile … so this helps.   I have area rugs, but I have been lucky …. no fleas in my rugs and house.     Once, I allowed the pest control co. to spray lightly indoors and Bonnie developed a cough.   This was spring of 2010 …. so I never allow them to spray indoors again.  


                      • jerseygirl
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                          Glad to hear you weren’t too badly effect by those awful tornadoes.

                          That is really interesting about the pineapple! I know some people swear by it and if you have seen 1st hand that it has helped, then it certainly would be something you could continue to give her in small amounts. I’m not sure it would be addressing the real problem though. It’s a bit like mylicon helps treat the gas but why not stop the gas forming in the 1st place. Pineapple may help break down impactions but not treat the cause of them forming.

                          As to it helping stop her shedding – that is interesting too! I’d be willing to try that!


                        • Sarita
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                            You are probably thinking of amoxicillin – any oral pencillins are harmful (not the injectible kind). But I wouldn’t think that for a possible blockage you would be given an antibiotic.


                          • jerseygirl
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                              Didn’t mean to confuse you regarding the flea med. I was “covering the bases” mentioning some med I knew off the top of my head that are known to be harmful to rabbits.


                            • HippityHopMom
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                                yes, she eats hay well.   She has hay placed out all day and night.    Timothy and Alalfa both.   

                                I came to realize a few months ago she does not do well when she has too many pellets.    I  had to cut down giving her pellets.   She only gets approx. 1 tablespoon of the Oxbow Basic Bunny T just before we all go to bed.    When I was giving her a 1/4 cup  …. she would have tummy problems then too. 

                                My little Bonnie is a sensitive little girl.   I have really had to watch what I feed her.   She is also deaf.     I have another large bun and she never gets sick.   I don’t have to be as careful with her foods.    She lives downstairs … her name is Panda.   Bonnie has never taken to Panda … so Panda lives in my “bed and breakfast rooms ” ….. these are rooms for my boarding pets.   Panda loves dogs and cats !   I just have to cage her when I have a pet here that will harm her …. otherwise, she too is a full time free range bun.    The pets I board …. all have been coming for 4 + years …. so I know them well … and I know which will not harm Panda. 


                              • Sarita
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                                  I agree with you about the pellets – they can do more harm than good especially with rabbits who seem to have continuous stasis problems – many rabbit experienced vets will take them totally off pellets.


                                • KatnipCrzy
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                                    If pellets do not agree with her- I would recommend maybe reducing and then eliminating her alfalfa hay- as alfalfa hay is a legume hay and not a grass hay and is much “richer”. Her tummy may not be handling it well.

                                    Please keep us updated about the vet visit.


                                  • HippityHopMom
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                                      KatnipCrzy …. Thx for letting me know about the alfalfa hay …. I did not know this.   The last few days, I have given her more alfalfa hay than Timothy … so this may be something I need to note …. it may be upsetting her tummy.   I will definitely cut back.

                                       


                                    • HippityHopMom
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                                        We had the vet visit at 4:30 pm  (Georgia time).   This new vet  examined Bonnie and advised she was not dehydrated.   She felt her tummy and said she did not feel anything abnormal.   She felt kidneys, etc. and the vet advised she did not feel any tumors.   She did NOT do any Xray of any kind. She did look at her teeth and she said they looked very good and her teeth were wore down just right.  (I did tell this vet that Bonnie had her head X-rayed in January by my dog vet and he saw nothing then wrong with her teeth).  The vet then advised her weight was good also …. even though she did not weigh her on scales … … she just felt of her. The vet said she did feel some stool pellets in her too.   I feel they should have weighed her for their records        This vet then  told me I was doing everything right and I needed to give her more time on the Fresh cut  squeezed pineapple juice.   

                                          I am feeling somewhat disappointed with the vet.    Maybe I should not feel this way …. if she felt nothing wrong with her tummy and she is not dehydrated … and Bonnie was more alert at the vet …. but of course Bonnie was afraid of the new environment and using all her energy while at the vet.   I explained to the vet when Bonnie was at home,  I could not get her to more around  hardly at all.   I asked her if she would not move around for me .. would it be a good idea to ride her in the car or on my golf cart  (in her pet carrier of course) … to give her tummy that “motion” it needed and the vet said yes .. the car ride and vibration would be very good for her …. and the golf cart ride too.      

                                        I left the vet and drove 10 miles further to a grocery store to buy Bonnie some Cilantra (we live in rural area) .    In the parking lot of the groc. store,  I opened her pet carrier & offered her the Cilantra and she ate a few pieces of it  !            I put some in her carrier for her to eat  during our drive home and she did eat that too!       We have been home almost 4 hrs now and she has not ate anything else, nor has she been to her litter pan.    I had to take a 2 hr nap since I had very little sleep last night …. Bonnie seemed to have stayed in the same place the entire time I napped and tended to my other pets this evening.     I am on my laptop now for over an hour near her and  I have not heard any teeth grinding since we got home.    We gave her 1.5 ml of fresh pineapple juice at 8pm.    Looks like another long night for me and my baby girl. 


                                      • Tate
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                                          Is it possible for you to find another vet? This does not seem right to me.. :\
                                          I’m not sure just how much a vet can feel in a rabbit belly, BUT I thought that checking molars was difficult. They usually can’t just be “seen”. There is a special instrument used to check them out.
                                          Such a stressful ordeal.. I hope Bonnie gets better soon!


                                        • LoveChaCha
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                                            I agree with Tate.

                                            If you have not happy with this vet, I would find a new one ASAP. A vet that knows the history of your rabbit would do more tests, x-rays to make sure everything is ruled out.


                                          • HippityHopMom
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                                              Yes … I can go to another vet.   I have found I here in the state of Georgia that I need to locate a vet that treats Exotic pets …. as a rabbit is considered an exotic pet.    There is one that has good references.  This vet is 1.5 hrs away from me … and  if I need to take Bonnie here, I will.

                                              But, Bonnie began eating last night !      And today, Wednesday, May 11th, she is still eating.  She is not eating her normal amount, but she is eating some and this amount is progessing as the day goes on.   She is beginning to pass small pellets in her litter pan.   She is a little more active today.    I am still giving her  Pineapple juice.    She is improving slowly …. but seems to be improving well.          Her eyes look good. 

                                              I do not hear any teeth grinding today and she seems to be comfortable and content today. 

                                               

                                               


                                            • Dee
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                                                That’s awesome that Bonnie is eating again It’s the best feeling when a bunny has been ill and then they start getting back to normal- such a relief. I agree that pellets can be hard on buns with sensitive tummies. My BunBun can only have 1 tsp of pellets a day, and a tiny bit of parsley & Swiss Chard along with a couple little bits of apple/banana. Anything else (or any more) and he gets poopy butt- of course he gets unlimited grass hay though. My lop, Nelli, can eat anything, just like your bunny Panda. It’s strange how different they can be. Also, I agree that limiting the alfalfa hay might be a good idea. I started giving my bunnies oat hay (which I know is a grass hay and therefore not the same as alfalfa) and BunBun loved the top of the hay, the oat part, in fact he ate that to the exclusion of all other hay, and he went through 2 GI episodes in one week- one bout of gas and one of GI stasis where we nearly lost him. I think that anything a little richer than usual, or anything that causes them to eat less of the long, fibrous strands of grass hay can cause problems with sensitive bunnies.
                                                It does sound like you need a new vet. I drive about an hour to my vet and it’s worth it. I also had an experience when Bun was sick with a UTI and I took him to a vet that did very little- he wouldn’t take Xrays because he said BunBun might break his back struggling! He pretty much just looked at Bun and said he was fine, which he wasn’t . I think vets that aren’t very experienced with rabbits often err on the side of caution and do nothing rather than making a mistake (which is better than screwing up and really hurting the bunny but still not ideal). When a rabbit isn’t eating, I would think Xrays would be the 1st course of action. Also, vets are supposed to take a sick rabbit’s temperature, and it didn’t sound like your vet did that either. I think it would be well worth it to kind of “interview” this new vet over the phone if possible, then maybe take Bonnie in for a checkup to confirm if he/she is “the one”. That way you have a vet you can trust- it makes all the difference not only for the safety of your rabbit, but your peace of mind too. It’s always scary when our bunnies get sick, but even worse when we take them for medical care and leave feeling like we didn’t get much help at all. Good luck on your vet search and I’m so happy your Bonnie is doing better


                                              • BinkyBunny
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                                                  Oye.. you have been through alot! I know that the pineapple can be debated but if it works for you then that’s all that matters. I do have to wonder though if it’s just not the extra hydration that is helping. But since the sugar in the pineapple doesn’t seem to be causing problems, again, go with what works.

                                                  I’m sorry that your this second vet (??) couldn’t get to the bottom of what is really going on. I hope your next vet will be more helpful.

                                                  The House Rabbit Society does have some screening questions that may help you find a vet you feel confident in. Here is the link http://www.rabbit.org/faq/sections/vet.html within that link you’ll find what you’ve already seen — the HRS’s list, but there is also a list of vets that attended their recent conference which may be helpful too. Then if you scroll down, you’ll see the suggested screening questions for you to ask during your search.

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                                              Forum HOUSE RABBIT Q & A Emrg vet appt later today – what can I expect if blockage?