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BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum THE LOUNGE Exploitation – in my opinion!

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    • jerseygirl
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      • Sani
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          what about it? i think its pretty awesome.
          i’ve seen people on youtube do that with their buns


        • Elrohwen
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            I actually think it’s pretty cool. I think it’s nice that there’s somebody who understands how to calmly hold bunnies and is willing to help others with it.


          • RabbitPam
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              Hi, JG,
              I can see why it would strike different people differently. If he were doing it for show or entertainment, I would find it objectionable, but we’ve had discussions of trancing here before, and it says he does it for pre-surgery relaxation. (I love the cartoon with the article, btw.) In this case, it’s just describing trancing bunnies as something extraordinary, while some of our members here are very expert at it as we know.

              Trancing is not relaxing the bunny – it’s plugging into their natural instinct to play dead to fool predators, so that would be a reason to think it’s exploitive, not relaxing. But using it this way is probably ultimately helpful to a vet about to do procedures, so it doesn’t bother me.

              Interesting article and info. Thanks for posting it.


            • jerseygirl
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                Arghhh! I think it just rubs me up the wrong way. For one, this guy (or the reporter?) claiming to have a special skill.  The trancing part of it aint that special and yes, lots of us can do that. I can trance my rabbits – but I only do it for nail trims, gland cleans & checking their underside.  I would like to read more on what he apparently does.  Also, because I recently discovered that in the past, rabbits were tranced to do neuters. No anaesthetics.  So seeing this just reminded me and struck a cord.

                I also think this article would have had many people showing other “look, that’s nothing, I can do the Rabbit Whisperer…see” Then others not so experienced having a go too.   Rabbits can come out of trance rapidly and move fast. If they’re not held securely there is a risk of injury. Until I learn otherwise – I think trancing is not relaxing to a rabbit and I try to avoid using it.

                Here’s a response to the newpaper story.

                http://www.rabbitawarenessweek.co.uk/behav…-whisperer

                 


              • babybunsmum
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                  yeah i cringed a little reading the article too. not because i think its harmful but because of the lack of knowledge about what is actually happening. i think its a bit irresponsible to write an article like this without researching a little further. if they had, they could’ve added in an informative sentence or 2 about why rabbits trance and to use caution because they snap out of it in a flash.


                • Sage Cat
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                    I get 2 reactions to this:
                    On the one hand – it seems the guy has good intentions. Although no excuse for potentially harming an animal.

                    On the other hand – the “trance” before surgery: is it so they don’t have to give the rabbit anaesthetics or is it to make it easier to prepare the rabbit for the anaesthetics? really not the same thing!!!!


                  • Sani
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                      EDIT: nevermind. i am an idiot xD


                    • Elrohwen
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                        Posted By RabbitPam on 04/25/2010 06:19 AM
                        Hi, JG,
                        I can see why it would strike different people differently. If he were doing it for show or entertainment, I would find it objectionable, but we’ve had discussions of trancing here before, and it says he does it for pre-surgery relaxation. (I love the cartoon with the article, btw.) In this case, it’s just describing trancing bunnies as something extraordinary, while some of our members here are very expert at it as we know.

                        Trancing is not relaxing the bunny – it’s plugging into their natural instinct to play dead to fool predators, so that would be a reason to think it’s exploitive, not relaxing. But using it this way is probably ultimately helpful to a vet about to do procedures, so it doesn’t bother me.

                        Interesting article and info. Thanks for posting it.

                         

                        Pam, I used to think trancing had the same instinctual roots as you, but someone explained it differently in a way that made sense. Basically, any of the animals that “play dead” only do so under an adrenalin rush – not just from being turned over. However, there are other animals that become limp when turned over because of an inner ear thing. Just like how we can get vertigo, they may become a little dizzy or something when turned upside down like that. That would also explain why trancing doesn’t work on some bunnies because they may be able to easily overcome that feeling and fight being on their back.

                        Still not sure if that’s the correct explanation, but it made a lot of sense. And it also makes me feel like trancing isn’t stressing them out as much as if it actually was a playing dead response.


                      • Spidey
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                          Posted By jerseygirl on 04/25/2010 06:40 AM

                           

                          Arghhh! I think it just rubs me up the wrong way. For one, this guy (or the reporter?) claiming to have a special skill. 

                           

                           

                           

                          It is a skill, do you think one of your non-bunny friends could pick up your rabbit and lay it on it’s back? Let alone trance it or even pick up the rabbit properly?

                          There is a joke at the shelter I volunteer at that I am the Bunny Whisperer cause I can grab up, pet and trance the trouble and aggressive buns that no one else can.

                           


                        • Minty
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                            Good to know, Elrohwen! I had only ever heard the ‘playing dead’ explanation as to why a bunny trances.

                            I’ve never tried it on any bun, and I’ve never had a reason to. I think in the right circumstances it can be a useful tool with a difficult to handle bunny, but it’s not something people should be doing just for fun or in everyday handling.


                          • Elrohwen
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                              Spidey, I agree that it is a skill. I’m not a very good bunny handler and I’m sure I could never do what he is doing. Maybe on the odd easy bun, but not on just anybun. The reason I think he’s doing a service is that he is teaching and helping other people to safely handle their rabbits which is a very important skill for all rabbit owners to know. The article made it sound like he is teaching people how to handle their rabbits, not that he’s necessarily all about trancing. They probably focused on trancing because most people don’t know it’s even possible so it looks impressive. He’s not making money off of it either.


                            • usagi
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                                I think it was just seeing the bun there, on that high table, on his back, with his feet in the air, completely alone, that totally creeped me out. That’s not proper bunbun care! If bun is in a precarious position, you better be right there to support him if needed! As it has been said, they can snap out those trances so quickly… It just made me a bit queesy.


                              • Elrohwen
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                                  Usagi, I totally agree with you on that part. I feel like they wanted to show how relaxed the bunny was, and I’m sure they used a bun who is very easy to trance and will hold the trance for a long time, but still. Made me nervous.


                                • MimzMum
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                                    Posted By Elrohwen on 04/25/2010 11:48 AM
                                      I’m not a very good bunny handler and I’m sure I could never do what he is doing. Maybe on the odd easy bun, but not on just anybun.

                                    *cough*MIMZY*cough-cough*

                                    He is one of those who will realize what I am doing and snap out before I can get him to the ‘play dead’ stage. And it worries me because then he gets really wild and so I never attempt it anywhere but on the top of the bed, so he always has a soft surface in case he squirms.

                                    Fiver is NOT an upside down bunny. Any butt work on him needs to be done while he’s on his side. And yet I’ve seen the doc turn him over in a thrice no problem. It’s incredibly frustrating.

                                    None of my buns can be left to lie like that. they all snap to immediately after the head rubbing stops. So while trimming nails, inspecting glands, etc. someone else has to be massaging the bunnies’ heads while I do the dirty work. And burritos don’t work for me either.

                                    I’m glad you posted this though Jerz, because I was thinking it was relaxing them till I read all this. The rebuttal is fantastic and I hope it’s placed on the bottom of the original article or has some kind of link to it, because the other side needs to be told.

                                    Whatever he’s doing it for, the fact remains that the way the article is presented is how folks will come away with it. I also thought it was a bit grandiose and self-serving, but I read stuff into things all the time that may not be there, that’s just me. Not that it hasn’t always been this way, but especially lately I think I’ve found media in general and internet media specifically to be all about people who want attention, not necessarily information and edification. You can be anything or anyone on the web and when you encounter the ‘genuine article’ in real life, it’s not what you thought it was.

                                    *steps off soapbox*

                                     


                                  • usagi
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                                      @Elrohwen, I am sure they did pick a very calm bunny – but it might give some people the wrong idea, you know? That all bunnies are like that, when actually most of them are not?


                                    • Elrohwen
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                                        Totally agree, usagi. I think they picked a super calm bunny just to make it look spectacular, but obviously that bunny only represents 1% of the population.


                                      • jerseygirl
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                                          Bummer! Just lost my reply!

                                          MM, I do think this was a sort of tabloid-y human interest story. I don’t know what this man does really. He has some helpline apparently. He could be really marvelous with rabbit behaviours for all I know. A communicator…
                                          Like I said, I’d like to know more so if anyonne has some links – please post them here.

                                          To me, the article alluded to that this man was like a master hypnotist or something. That he’s the only person in the country that could do this. Maybe the papers claims rather than the man’s own. There is no mention that rabbit have this inbuilt ability.

                                          I’ll sound hypocritical as I have used trancing and the rabbits do appear relaxed. Honestly, I’d rather them like that then in the frantic state some get into when you handle them without putting them onto their backs. Better for me – but is it for the rabbit….? It seems like they become oblivious but from what I’ve read, they are actually highly alert. (I may be easily influenced by what I read – lol) Trancing is one of those grey areas I guess. There just isn’t enough info. The response I linked above was the first I’d heard of results from studies done on it.
                                          Who knows! Need MORE info.

                                          @ Sani – You’re not an idiot. I’m curious as to what you posted. I’m happy to read opinions different to my own.
                                          @ Sage – I don’t mean to link anaesthetic-free surgery to this guy. He works with vets so I’m sure they would use anaesthesia. This was just an old method that I was reminded of when reading the article. I assume he does this so they can give anaesthetic more easily so the rabbit is less likely to balk. 

                                          Posted by SullysMum:
                                          I think in the right circumstances it can be a useful tool with a difficult to handle bunny, but it’s not something people should be doing just for fun or in everyday handling.

                                          Totally! You put it much better than I was able.

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                                      Forum THE LOUNGE Exploitation – in my opinion!