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The subject of intentional breeding or meat rabbits is prohibited. The answers provided on this board are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet.  It is your responsibility to assess the information being given and seek professional advice/second opinion from your veterinarian and/or qualified behaviorist.

BINKYBUNNY FORUMS

Forum THE LOUNGE Bunny forums

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    • Karla
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        I was just reminded why I use the forum on BinkyBunny and not a Danish one…

        Decided I would have a look on a Danish forum (not cheating on BinkyBunny forum! Don’t worry, just looking ), but I found that the forum was all about threads telling people that bunnies are solitary animals that cannot go well with other bunnies, how you can trim the teeth yourself with a nail clipper…oh, and a lot about breeding babies. None of them have heard about spaying/fixing bunnies.

        I really wanted to participate, but I am not sure if I bother discussing with a lot of people who are so sure they are right and will judge me as the freak, which is so frustrating when I know I am right. I am so frustrated right now. I feel that I should fight for the few bunnies out there whose owners might learn some and let them out of the small commercial cage and have them neutered and perhaps give them a bunny friend or at least some toys.

        I was just wondering – is BinkyBunny a special forum with knowledgable bunny people, or is it normal knowledge in America  how to take care of bunnies properly? 


      • jerseygirl
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          Do you know – I suspect the difference is more breeders V’s companion pet owners. I don’t like to lump all breeders in the same basket though…
          I have come across things like you’ve mentioned through breeders websites before. Many of the beliefs I hold and we support at this community where knocked down as untruths and people like us labelled as “house rabbit and rescue extremists” lol. Sort of an Us V’s Them mentality.

          I don’t understand some of the ideas they put out there though – like rabbits being solitary or not going well with other bunnies. Then what is a warren? Yes they can live as single rabbits – and happily too – but I think only if they are given companionship with the human. They may also not get along well with other bunnies if just thrown together.
          I would politely question that and share a pic of your 3, all of whom pretty well bonded easily didn’t they? You may not get polite responses but at least you can give others viewing the forum pause for thought.


        • Elrohwen
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            I think BB is fairly special. The info we talk about is out there, but most people in America don’t really know how to take care of a bunny – I certainly didn’t until I started doing research. I would say the majority of Americans have some idea of how to care for a dog or a cat, but really zero idea of how to care for bunnies. Everyone I’ve talked to was suprised that I got my bunny neutered and that I let him run around my house like a cat or a dog.

            If I were you, I would post on this forum and show some pictures of your three. Sure, some people might think you’re the crazy bunny lady, but hopefully one or two people take it to heart and learn something from you.


          • Karla
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              You are right on – it is the breeder vs. companion pet owners. And yes, I should give it my best so I might convince some of the new bunny owners who haven’t yet fallen into the claws of these forum people I will spam the forum with pictures and argumentations then.

              Or perhaps make my own forum like the BinkyBunny! LOL. Might be why Binky Bunny herself created this one – frustrated over other forums…


            • Elrohwen
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                I do think there should be a place for breeders to discuss things important to them, but since the majority of bunny owners keep them as pets, not breeding animals, I think it’s important to get pet care information out there. And even for breeders – they may never have thought of their rabbits as smart and personable animals so maybe they could learn something too and give their animals a better life.

                Rabbits are definitely in a unique position as they’ve been kept as livestock and pets and not many other animals are (even if horses or cows may be kept more as “pets” they still live in a barn and have a fairly similar life to a livestock animal). It’s definitely important to get information out there on the best way to keep bunnies as pets or people will always continue to think of them as livestock. And frankly, I don’t see how a bunny could really be an interesting pet if it lives outside in a hutch by itself and you only see it for 10 minutes a day. No pet would be interesting in that environment! Keeping bunnies as house rabbits is really the only way to enjoy them and appreciate them.

                I really hope people see your happy trio and want to learn more about having them and how you take care of them


              • Kokaneeandkahlua
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                  Rabbit husbandry-the proper kind where they live long happy lives -is very new. Very new.
                  They are often viewed as livestock to many people, and those that keep them without any new information keep them outdoors. It’s new-that rabbits are coming in out of the cold, and becoming beloved and cared for family members  

                   

                  And to boot-yes I agree it’s the breeder vs. pet mentality. I’m not trying to lump them together or be all judgy but the bottom line-those rabbits are resources/assets to breeder, who is trying to make money. I don’t know about you (well I do acutally lol) but my bunnies have not made two cents for me and I’ve spent a small fortune on them. I also expect all to live well into their old age. Its’ simply not the same ballgame for breeders.
                  This really impacts how they care for them-feed that ‘may’ pose a risk but is full of oily seeds and produces shiny coats is often used (sunflower seeds), doing many medical procedures at home and/or untrained are done to save money, as well-I think they aren’t staying up all night hand feeding a rabbit who has stasis or rushing them into the emergency vet like we do-because that’s expensive.
                  I’m not saying their callous-but how could they love and care for 200 rabbits each the same way we care for each of ours? It’s a resource issue bothways around I believe.

                  My two cents (that my bunnies did earn for me lol)


                • RabbitPam
                  Moderator
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                    I’m glad you’ve found BB. I think it may have initially been a US change in view of rabbits as house bunnies that is spreading world-wide. Correct me fellow members if I have that wrong.
                    I think the greatest advancement was made by the House Rabbit Society, which began about 20-30 years ago. It brought a wealth of information on line. Also, shelters and veterinarians have been in the forefront for educating rabbit owners, and others, about the care and possibilities of a good life for you and your pet bunnies.

                    If you want, you could post on that website a polite statement saying that if anyone is interested in learning more about ways to have an indoor house rabbit as a pet, they could view our website or the HRS’. (www.rabbit.org) That way if someone goes there with a pet bunny and is not satisfied, or is open to our point of view, they can find more info. I find websites with links to other websites very helpful as I track down a more specific source of information, depending on what I am searching for. Many healthy products provide links, as well as websites that sell rabbit supplies. the more you link into a different network of like-minded people, the more you find is available.


                  • BinkyBunny
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                      The House Rabbit Society really is the forefront of getting education out there.They just recently had their 20th year Anniversary! They are like the trunk and many branches of info and resources have branched out from there based on all of the great work they have done.

                      After learning about and helping in general animal rescue from since I was in high school, (though much later, I became more rabbit focused) and seeing the “consequences” side of things, I also wanted to help in being part of the “prevention” side — just trying to figure out a way to reach out to the individual owners to give them an easy to understand fun way to learn, while maintaining the House Rabbit ideals that help keep shelters numbers down. So that’s why this forum will have more of that kind of feel – example: We strongly advocate spay/neutering – not only for behavior issues that could make someone give up their bunny, but for health, and prevention of MORE bunnies. But we also want it to be light-hearted and not scare people off (though I know that can happen too) so we encourage fun stuff and joking around too.

                      I have found a few good forums – some are more for just asking medical based and care info like EtherBun, no frills, just the facts. The Ontario Rabbit Education forum seems like a great group, and I’ve also heard that there are other forums with similar missions and beliefs but that express themselves even stronger than we do about certain things. So I think it’s just finding that niche. But you will also find U.S. based forums that have different goals in mind and may provide conflicting information and resources than we provide.

                      When I tell people about House Rabbits, especially if they are in a different part of the country, they look at me like…”WHA?? House Rabbits? Spay and neuter?? Wha?? Heh???” But even right here in the Bay Area, where there are a TON of House Rabbit Resources, (even many of the city shelters are on board with the House Rabbit concept) and the HRS main education headquarters is here, and many Rabbit Rescues, I still find people completely unaware, who insist on keeping their bunny in their backyard in a tiny hutch or just treating it like stock. I was even at the vet and a guy saw that I had a rabbit and he said…”Wow, people still have those things as pets these days?”

                      So, yeah….the U.S. by no means has it all covered.


                    • LittlePuffyTail
                      Moderator
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                        I think that the majority of rabbit owners are still in the dark ages regarding rabbit care. Just look at all the terrible products that pet stores sell for rabbits…junk treats that claim to be healthy, pine shavings, etc. Canada is the same way.

                        A surprising number of people still think rabbits don’t need vet care. I know someone who suggested neutering a baby rabbit with elastic bands!!!! (this is common practice with goats, although I’m sure it’s painful). I told this person I was almost 99% positive that would kill a rabbit. Luckily, this particular person no longer owns a rabbit.

                        And look at all the people who think they are setting their bunny out to a happy, natural life by dumping it in the wilderness?


                      • jerseygirl
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                          I will spam the forum with pictures and argumentations then. Or perhaps make my own forum like the BinkyBunny!

                          Does this forum that you spoke of allow advertising? Or others like it? What about if you created and information webpage on House Rabbits? Then if you could put the link to it on these sites, it may lead various people to getting some solid info – maybe opening their eyes to a whole new world regarding rabbits.


                        • Karla
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                            Oh, my God, why do I even bother! I did try…but I was just told that if my bunnies do in fact cuddle up together then it is out of fear or stress, and I am a mean bunny owner. And PS: it is unnatural to spay bunnies, and so if that is the only way to keep bunnies together then it just proves, that it is unnatural for bunnies to have company.

                            Don’t bother trying.


                          • Elrohwen
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                              Wow, that’s too bad! I’m surprised the reaction was so strong – I figured at least one person would say “Wow, look at those bunnies. That’s pretty cool.”


                            • Karla
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                                It is really a shame. Well, I left the forum with some links to rabbit.org. Maybe someone will come by later and read them and be convinced.

                                I ought to read a lot of studies on the european rabbits, so I can throw in lots of good arguments. So if anyone knows any books or websites with factual studies, let me know!


                              • Sarita
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                                  I know Karla, it’s difficult to change many people’s view and not just on rabbits. I sometimes think it’s best just to not even try and find a friendlier place where others think and feel like me. To me, it’s not worth the stress and I know there are plenty of others who feel the same way I do and frankly, I’d rather spend time with them. It’s not worth your frustration and it’s obvious they won’t change their views. Just come and play with us and forget them.


                                • Elrohwen
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                                    Hmm, I remember reading that a Englishman studied them for years. I think he was trying to study them enough to eradicate them, but he learned a lot. I’ll see if I can find where I read that.


                                  • Elrohwen
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                                      Ok, the first chapter of the book “Stories Rabbits Tell” is all about wild rabbits and the second chapter is about the rise of the house rabbit. The whole book is pretty good, so I would recommend looking for it. There’s also a fantastic bibliography explaining where the authors got their information (though I’m sure a lot of the books listed aren’t easily available).

                                      http://www.amazon.com/European-Rabb…amp;sr=8-1 This book is listed in the bibliography. It’s extremely expensive, but may be available through a library.


                                    • Karla
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                                        Posted By Sarita on 01/28/2010 11:08 AM
                                        I know Karla, it’s difficult to change many people’s view and not just on rabbits. I sometimes think it’s best just to not even try and find a friendlier place where others think and feel like me. To me, it’s not worth the stress and I know there are plenty of others who feel the same way I do and frankly, I’d rather spend time with them. It’s not worth your frustration and it’s obvious they won’t change their views. Just come and play with us and forget them.

                                        LOL  You guys in here are just so much better, and it is really such a great forum. The thing is, I know I can’t change the breeder’s point of view, and I have realised it is in fact a breeder forum, so I should give up.  But I just feel that if I could change the lives of just three bunnies, then I am obligated to do the effort. But as JerseyGirl suggested earlier, I should have an informative bunny website – and I do have one actually. I will just work on that one instead and make it even more informative. And then people can e-mail me if they have questions. And have a link to this forum!
                                         


                                      • Karla
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                                          Posted By Elrohwen on 01/28/2010 11:14 AM

                                          Ok, the first chapter of the book “Stories Rabbits Tell” is all about wild rabbits and the second chapter is about the rise of the house rabbit. The whole book is pretty good, so I would recommend looking for it. There’s also a fantastic bibliography explaining where the authors got their information (though I’m sure a lot of the books listed aren’t easily available).

                                          http://www.amazon.com/European-Rabb…amp;sr=8-1 This book is listed in the bibliography. It’s extremely expensive, but may be available through a library.

                                           

                                          Thanks elrohwen! I will check it out, at least for my own interest. And my birthday is coming up soon, so I should find a gift to give myself   Ronald Lockley studied wild rabbits as well for a long time and had a huge impact on Richard Adams’ book “watership down”. I should look at that one as well. 


                                        • Sarita
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                                            You won’t change breeder’s point of views.

                                            Those who want the information as rabbits as pets will seek out the information and those are the people you can help and welcome your help. Your website will do that and you’ll be helping rabbits and rabbit owners.


                                          • TARM
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                                              I will admit that I was floored when I first started looking into rabbits as pets and seeing that they get spayed and neutered. And then I read the same thing about guinea pigs and even pet rats and I thought small animal people were insane. I was a dedicated dog person who at the time hadn’t had time for small animals…everyone knows dogs and cats get spay/neutered. Small animals though? Not so much. I was equally floored when I found out how much it costs to adopt an altered rabbit in my area. And even though I know it’s well worth it, every time I tell someone what the adoption fees are at my rescue I cringe inside because that just seems like a lot of money. The adoption fee is good for weeding out the people who aren’t dedicated enough to pay it, so that’s good.

                                              I tried to have a discussion with my mother about the adoption fees for rabbits and she completely shut down. She thinks I’m nuts to spend that kind of money on adoption fees for an animal I can get for $10 on Craigslist. She’s not as much of an animal person as I am so I kind of expected her to take that attitude. Dealing with my own family has made me much more tolerant of strangers when I attempt to educate them. I just speak to those who want to listen and wish luck to those who don’t. There’s only so much I can personally do.


                                            • Elrohwen
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                                                If you’re looking for something for your birthday, I would definitely recommend “Stories Rabbits Tell”. It’s all about rabbits from behavior, to the rise of house rabbits, rabbits in popular culture, rabbits as livestock – really tons of information on how rabbits have impacted our live and culture. And it’s clearly written by two rabbit lovers who have a lot of respect for them (Susan Davis and Margo Demello).

                                                I think they mention Lockely as well – I can’t remember as I read it last year.


                                              • Karla
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                                                  I just ordered “Stories rabbits tell” and then “The private life of the rabbit: An account of the life history and social behaviour of the wild rabbit (A survival book)” by Ronald Mathias Lockley. I actually found a book on massaging bunnies – I should get that next time.

                                                  Tarm, at least you are a converted bunny owner I just think it is a shame that bunnies cost so much at shelters, when you can get them for $1 in the local newspapers here…I’d prefer if people used the shelters.

                                                  This weekend I will work on enhancing my website. Can’t wait


                                                • Sarita
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                                                    There are some disturbing chapters in “Stories rabbits tell…” so be aware of this. They do discuss rabbits being bred for fur and meat and petstores. They wanted to tell all rabbit’s stories so keep that in mind. It’s been a very long time since I’ve read this, but I think it’s a great book.


                                                  • bunnytowne
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                                                      Yeah I figured they would jump you.   

                                                      You know if I could show mine I would but there is no $ in it.   I would not breed to sell or anything just enjoy the showing.  However I am not it is too far from where I live and my back and knee may be dissagreeable after a whole day standing or sitting around.

                                                      Besides mine are not show quality even though they are pedigreed.  I did find show rabbits can be up to 300.00 for good winning kits and bucks and does. 

                                                      I can find pedigreed for pet quality for 50.00

                                                      Thats ok we dont’ need to do all that  mine are house companions. 

                                                      Oh my point is if I did show I would still have mine indoors as pets.  That would not change.   Attitudes are changing slowly and people are being educated about house companion rabbits.  Though you will find on yahoo groups and stuff some pretty hard core show and breeders.

                                                      OH yahoo groups there are also pet only rabbit forums too.  I dont’ go to those groups I used to but was not all that interesting.

                                                      Here is so much better.


                                                    • bunnytowne
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                                                        oh as far as spay and neuter not being natural  well they geld horses and steers dont’ they


                                                      • Wasabi
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                                                          ^You can spay mares too ;D Except it’s not really recommended; horses don’t do well with surgery’s.

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