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| 10/02/2009 05:43 PM |
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I'm trying to bond my two unaltered rabbits, a male and female. . . will this work? |
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  MonkeybunHillsboro, Oregon
10107 posts  | |
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| 10/02/2009 05:44 PM |
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I wouldn't put an unaltered pair together, they'd be doing more baby making than bonding. Wait until one or both have been altered. |
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 Jenna, Chubs & CometPortland, OR
618 posts | |
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 mrmacSan Diego, CA
2185 posts | |
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| 10/02/2009 08:56 PM |
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Do not put them together until they are altered. It can take only seconds for a pregnancy to happen. Female rabbits have an especially high risk of reproductive cancers. Most males will become very "humpy" around sexual maturity and may even spray. I strongly suggest that you get them altered.
Here's a good link: http://www.rabbit.org/health/spay.html |
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 Sarita(Dallas)
 Forum Leader 14866 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 12:18 AM |
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Absolutely not! You would just be encouraging them to breed and we do not encourage this. Already too many homeless rabbits. The responsible thing is to get them both altered, wait a month, and bond. |
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 jerseygirlAustralia
13174 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 12:38 AM |
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I read in your introduction post that the male is 2, female at least 4 months. This means it is VERY likely the female is already pregnant.  PLEASE be responsible and get her checked out be a rabbit vet. You can look into an emergency spay if she is in fact pregnant. How long have you been trying to bond the two? I realise you are new to the forums and were nervous about joining. I'm glad you did as we can help you in this situation. I would like to let you know that members (myself included) are VERY Pro-neutering rabbits to stop the over population problem. You will probably find this message will come across many times! For now, please take the female to a good rabbit vet. We can assist you in finding one if you haven't already. |
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 katie, max & penny
984 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 08:47 AM |
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No no no no no no no no no no !!
there's a reason people call it "... like rabbits". have these two been together at ALL? if they have, then your girl has a 95% chance of all ready being pregnant. so pleeeeeease take her to a rabbit savvy vet.
we get some of the "i thought he was a boy but hes really a girl!" pregnancies, but knowingly putting two unaltered buns together is absolutely NOT ok.
i know i sound mean and i can live with that because having two unaltered buns is already tip-toeing on the brink of irresponsibility but putting them together is definitely crossing that line.
i'm not trying to make you feel bad or anything, but you have to know how serious this is. PLEASE take your girl to a vet. |
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 RabbitPamSouth Florida
Forum Leader 10029 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 01:14 PM |
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If you haven't already, please get two cages, at least two feet apart - one for each bunny. Let them out separately for exercise, NOT together. Do not let either get near the other one's cage. They can get pregnant through the bars if left unattended, and can hurt each other by biting if they are aggressive.
We do not condone intentional breeding, so if you knowingly put them together unaltered and have a litter, it would be considered intentional.
If you need help finding a good vet for rabbits for neutering, we can help with that, too. |
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 Have your people call my people. We'll do carrots. |
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 PetzyNorthern AB Canada
Forum Leader 5938 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 02:06 PM |
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Bonding is about rabbits that have been desexed. Two rabbits together of opposite gender and both intact is breeding. |
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 "what happened?
did something happen or can I just go back to my hay?" |
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| 10/03/2009 02:10 PM |
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Ok. To get this settled, they have not been anywhere near each other, I was responsible enough to make sure of that. I am one hundred percent positive that Ruby is not pregnant. Their cages are close to each other, about a foot apart but they are rarely both in their cages at the same time. I know how serious this is, but I have yet to find a rabbit savvy vet in the area. Is it better to fix one or both? And if one, then which one? |
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MonkeybunHillsboro, Oregon
10107 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 02:12 PM |
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The female probably. If she goes unaltered, she has a very high chance of getting uterine cancer, which just isn't a good thing. I think its around an 80% chance she could get it if unaltered. |
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Sarita(Dallas)
Forum Leader 14866 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 02:15 PM |
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I agree if you have to chose, the female. I hope you can find a good vet to help you. |
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PetzyNorthern AB Canada
Forum Leader 5938 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 02:24 PM |
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well, as you can see, VelvetLion, you opened a can of worms!  We are all very anti-breeding as they are so many unwanted bunnies. Great that you did the right thing. It is very rare that two rabbits get along without fighting unless they are both fixed. The male must be neutered as his drive to mount will prevent any bonding efforts from being successful. Females can be very aggressive for terrritorial reasons. The female, even if she were the exception and very submissive by nature needs to be spayed for her health also. Females are subject to a number of illnesses if left intact. After you find a rabbit vet, and your rabbits had their surgeries you will need to let one month go by before beginning the bonding process. This is the amount of time needed for their hormones to settle. A male will still mount and can impregnate a female for up to 2 weeks after being neutered and a female can suffer injuries if she is exposed to a male in humpfest mode right after her surgery. |
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| "what happened?
did something happen or can I just go back to my hay?" |
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| 10/03/2009 03:39 PM |
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Ok. Thanks everybody. I will get Rubes altered a.s.a.p. (And probably Velvet too.) |
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jerseygirlAustralia
13174 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 05:38 PM |
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Rae, thanks for sticking around and clarifying things. I hope you can see that from your opening line of this thread - it was very easy for us to jump on the "DON'T BREED!" Bandwagon! We've probably scared people away before.......
I hope this helps you find a vet. www.rabbit.org/vets/vets.html . If you feel comfortable about posting your State and general location, perhaps another member may be able to recommend a vet also.
As to bonding - I think the pair living side be side may help in them becoming accustomed to one another but that's about as far as it goes. With the hormones involved, their instinct to breed will override the social companionship that rabbits do have. Just natures way! |
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katie, max & penny
984 posts | |
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| 10/03/2009 10:22 PM |
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agreed thank you for clarifying.  i hate pontificating |
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| 10/04/2009 04:41 PM |
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Your welcome. I am kind of afraid of the sky falling on my head again, but. . . complications have arose and my dad doesn't see the need for altering and my mom a) wants to let them have at least one litter and b) thinks it's cruel and unnatural to alter them. They're great parents but I'm having trouble convincing them that this is the best things for my bunnies. Any suggestions? |
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Jenna, Chubs & CometPortland, OR
618 posts | |
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katie, max & penny
984 posts | |
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| 10/04/2009 05:29 PM |
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jenna had some good advice.
it sounds like your dad has some issues with neutering in general, not specifically in buns. i collected some websites that can address altering in general:
www.hsus.org/pets/pet_care/why_you_...r_pet.html
www.hsus.org/pets/pet_care/myths_an...ering.html
docs.google.com/gview
www.americanhumane.org/protecting-a...ering.html
Also, it may help him to know that in many states, including mine (texas) it is illegal to leave your dog unaltered unless you plan on breeding them for business (not just casual breeding).
I think once he sees the reasons behind altering, he may realize the importance of the procedure. good luck!
Oh and the sky won't fall on your head- people freaked out because it orginally sounded like you had already housed them together/bred them and we felt a sense of urgency to express the dangers of that. |
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| 10/04/2009 05:53 PM |
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=) Thanks again. I'll try that and let you know what happens. |
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jerseygirlAustralia
13174 posts | |
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| 10/04/2009 11:35 PM |
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It's difficult when parent have different view point to you. Are they actually your rabbits though? If so, can you assert that you think it is best for them? Are you in a position to save money to pay for the procedures also?
Your Mom mentioned it being cruel and unnatural - and it can seem that way until you discover the statistic & risks of leaving them unaltered. Also, wouldn't it be sad for them to be kept separated all the time? Which is what you'd have to do because otherwise it would be endless litters. As altered rabbits, they can be bonded and live 24/7 together - it is a lovely thing to witness.
Say hypothetically you did as your mom wishes and allowed just one litter.....then you have X amount of rabbits that would have to be kept separated also, including Velvet and Ruby to prevent further litters. Also, it is rare to be able to successfully house same sex unaltered rabbits because they will fight. So it's likely you couldn't even house any together for companionship.
This little article might be an eye opener for your parents. www.bio.miami.edu/hare/scary.html |
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| 10/09/2009 07:12 AM |
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Why would you mum want a litter? I spend a lot of time on a dog forum, and those with hunting dogs help each other find rabbits litters for sale or for free - and then use them for training the dogs. Ask your mum if that is what she wants to happen with this litter? Everybody can look friendly when they come to pick up the bunnies... And tell her that your bunnies will be more easily litter trained, their pee will not smell, they will be more friendly and less destructive if they are fixed. I am sure she appreciates those points. Other than that - I began bonding my bunnies when Karl had been spayed for 6 weeks and Molly for just a week. Karl wanted to hump her all the time, which she had loved the days just before her spay, but after the spay, she hated it. So by only fixing her, you will be driving them crazy, 'cause his hormones will be high and he won't let her be. She will love you for fixing him as well |
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| 10/09/2009 02:05 PM |
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=) I am totally in favor and think I have even found a vet to do it but the other thing is that I'm not sure if I can afford to alter both of them . . . Because I think if I did alter them I would have to pay. (My parents probably wouldn't be willing to pay much for the altering I think.) And I have yet to get a job. Right now I'm like a month under age. (I'll be [edited age-RP] in November.) My mom wants at least one litter because she knows a few people who want a bunny and she thinks it's unnatural to alter bunnies. Personally I know that at least one of the people she is thinking of will give another bunny a good home, (My friend has several already and would take another.) I would really like to be able to bond them though. So. . . now I am in a little bit of a fix. At the moment they are never out at the same time. =( I want them to bond and be friends. . . and I'm afraid of who will get the babies if they do have a litter. Eek. Who knows what might happen to sweet baby bunnies that are given away to strangers!!! Definitely not going to give in to her about that one. |
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katie, max & penny
984 posts | |
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| 10/09/2009 05:26 PM |
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Ah, VL I didn't know you were so young! Sorry for freaking out on you.
Why don't you suggest to your mom and/or her friends that they can adopt a rabbit instead of breeding? |
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| 10/09/2009 07:22 PM |
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It's ok, you were doing what you thought was best for the bunnies. I have brought that up but now my mom has gotten tired of me trying to convince her and has just said plain no. Ugh! I am really frustrated right now. My poor bunnies. They both know there is another bunny in the house and are both wondering what is up. =( |
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| 10/09/2009 07:26 PM |
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Lol. About the age thing, it's actually a good thing that you freaked out on me KH, my dad worries that people will know how young I am and something bad will happen to me so usually I try not to show how old I am. . . It means that if I'm careful nobody will know. . . |
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jerseygirlAustralia
13174 posts | |
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| 10/09/2009 08:21 PM |
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It very possible to keep them as is if your parents won't allow having them fixed. It may be a little more work for you, and you have to be ever vigilant they don't escape there cages. Just allow them time (separately) with you each day for company and play. Shelters are over run with rabbits needing homes. Many euthanised because there is just no room. If your Mom has friends wanting their own pet rabbits, direct them there. |
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  Beka27Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
Forum Leader 13991 posts | |
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| 10/10/2009 01:30 AM |
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I would definitely encourage friends or family interested in a house rabbit to do research and then visit a local shelter/rescue to see about adopting. Even if you do have 3 or 4 homes for baby bunnies, I have personally heard of litters with as many as NINE BABIES!!! That's a lot!
At your age (at ANY age!), having two unaltered rabbits to care for, house separately, give separate playtime to... will not be easy. It is very likely that they may spray with urine and leave poops everywhere to mark off their territory against the other bunny.
Another option would be this: if your friend or family member is interested in getting a rabbit (and has done research) and is committed to caring for the bunny, you *could* "adopt" one of your bunnies to them. I KNOW THIS IS NOT IDEAL! You would still be able to be a part of the bunny's life, but you wouldn't need to be continuously concerned about the female getting pregnant, or them breaking out together and getting into a bad fight (which can lead to serious injuries.)
If you don't want to do that, then I would encourage you to start saving a little bit of money when you can and work towards at least getting the female spayed. |
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Meadow.....
...... Max |
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RabbitPamSouth Florida
Forum Leader 10029 posts | |
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| 10/10/2009 01:45 AM |
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It's good that you're trying to convince them.
I agree with Beka's idea to have the friend of your mom's who's interested adopt one of them.
The only other arguements I can think of are:
For the female, it's not unnatural as much as it is a preventative treatment for cancer. The female is very likely to develop it if she is not altered. So the options are to have her be healthy, safe and not pregnant, or suffer a dreadful disease that will shorten her life that could have been prevented.
The male is a much safer and less expensive procedure, so he could be altered and at least she won't get pregnant by him if she isn't already.
You might consider asking them, and other family, to pay for the female as a birthday present. I used to ask for bigger things I wanted/needed as a gift. I am born in Nov. too! (And your Dad can be proud of your awareness of your own risks on the Net. I might go back and edit out the exact number of your age if you don't mind.) |
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| Have your people call my people. We'll do carrots. |
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| 10/10/2009 09:29 AM |
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=) Thanks RabbitPam! I was going to do that myself today. I've decided to ask my parents if they'll pay for Ruby's altering as a present and save up for Velvet (my bunny boy. <3) Also, my brother has adopted Ruby as his, so now he's a partial owner and the responsibility is split. My mom is actually half way there concerning Velvet's altering now. He has a bad habit of leaving his poops everywhere to show that he is the king of living room. . . And he gets smelly sometimes. Right now I'm hoping for the best and an appointment with the vet. |
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